What Happens if BSA Goes Chapter 7.

[Eagle94-A1]

@ALongWalkstated "am at the point of thinking there is no way National survives now. Sure hope that LC’s are discussing some sort of confederations that will allow Scouting to continue.  "

and @InquisitiveScouter stated " We all need to begin thinking about this "What if?"

If you desire to continue supporting Scouting, what will you do if BSA goes Chapter 7?

(Let's make this a new thread, please?)"

 

Well I am starting a new thread on this WHAT IF.

For me I have no idea. I do not think I could support a local consortium, For several years now, my council has been virtually useless. I do not trust them enough to work with other councils, and be effective. If a merger of council occurred, I still do not know. While I hope and pray BSA survives, my selfish concern is to see my Life Scout sons get Eagle before BSA dissolves

 

I hate to be a Negative Nelly, but I do not trust my council or national. I am focused on my unit.

[mrjohns2]

2 hours ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

I am focused on my unit.

Than a What If isn't as important. Keep doing your unit thing, no? 

I would spend more time on What If if I needed to help determine plans for national to prepare for. Since I don't have that role, I have determined there is very little that I need to do to prepare. My unit wouldn't know a big difference. Patches and books would come off of eBay. Activities and meetings and campouts would come from the PLC as they do today. So, while sad, it really wouldn't change much.

Our council is pretty good. They would likely sell 1 or 2 of their 4 camps (plus one property). They would still do summer camp for at least a couple of years. 

[yknot]

To me it seems like liability insurance is going to be the issue. If BSA goes belly up, no single unit or supporting organization would be able to afford it. If scouting is gong to continue at any kind of level more organized than a random street side pick up game, some solution would have to be found. I don't know what that is or what it would look like. 

[ALongWalk]

I am fortunate to be involved with a unit that is in a strong council (at least I think it is strong).  I am no expert but it just seems to me that National is out of money and has no legitimate way to earn its way out of the crevasse that it is in. If scouting is going to survive it is probably time to call it as it is and liquidate the BSA. Allow the survivors to receive as much as possible and then allow the councils to negotiate settlements. Some simply will not survive and there will be gaps in where the program is offered. It’s awful but I think we are at the point that we have to decide if the program really matters to our children, families, communities, and nation then we have to take steps to help it survive. I just don’t see how national BSA can be a part of that now. And I want to be clear, I blame the BSA….well, after the abusers. Thousands of our country’s children were harmed with the ultimate responsibility falling at the feet of the BSA. I don’t think for a moment that they wanted one child to be harmed but their inaction and wrong priorities allowed it to happen.

[johnsch322]

9 minutes ago, ALongWalk said:

And I want to be clear, I blame the BSA….well, after the abusers.

 

Edited September 5, 2022 by johnsch322
miss read

[InquisitiveScouter]

4 hours ago, yknot said:

no single unit or supporting organization would be able to afford it.

Do we know this?  I haven't gotten a quote yet, but I intend to...

[InquisitiveScouter]

We will continue Scouting at the unit level...

My biggest concern, after the insurance, is awarding Eagle Scout rank to a Scout.  Since this is only granted by the National Council, and they keep these records, would it be legitimate for a local unit to recognize/award someone as an Eagle Scout?

(On a separate note, it's time to start hoarding some Eagle rank patches...)

[yknot]

2 hours ago, InquisitiveScouter said:

Do we know this?  I haven't gotten a quote yet, but I intend to...

It will be interesting to see what the quotes are. I can't think of any parallels in youth organizations. Pretty much everyone doing anything with kids is under the coverage of an umbrella organization in some way unless they are a free lance piano teacher or a tutor. But those activities are not comparable to scouting and are generally adequately covered by a personal liability umbrella. 

[Wyobkr]

Have written few different responses and deleted them.  Conflicted about what to say.  I had an exemplary experience in Scouting as a youth.  Dedicated adults helping, great troop, Jambo, Philmont, and so on.  Volunteered for several years even though I didnt have a youth in the program.  Then was blessed with a son who participated and earned Eagle.  So terribly sad that people who are/were not qualified to lead National and councils have been doing so.  I have seen it first hand.  I had to step away after decades.  Lot of obstacles facing BSA including ever increasing costs to participate and maintain properties that have been negelected.  Then there is the Summit.  It is still hard to fathom how any group of people could have thought they could raise the money they convinced themselves they would get. 

[mrjohns2]

43 minutes ago, Wyobkr said:

So terribly sad that people who are/were not qualified to lead National and councils have been doing so.  I have seen it first hand.  I had to step away after decades.  Lot of obstacles facing BSA including ever increasing costs to participate and maintain properties that have been negelected.  Then there is the Summit.  It is still hard to fathom how any group of people could have thought they could raise the money they convinced themselves they would get. 

Good observations. The summit and other issues (lack of protection for what was thought to be restricted funds) was a failure of skilled leadership (or lack of skill). 

[Oldscout448]

While roasting  marshmallows last weekend my grandson told me he wants to be an Eagle Scout like his Dad.  He's almost 6.  It hurts knowing  that it probably won't be possible. It's not the rank that  matters, it's realizing that even if scouts survives it will most likely be vastly diminished . Will Philmot be there?  Jamborees?   The OA?  Sure, the few surviving troops in the area can get together somewhere for a mini camporee,  and the grey hairs can tell  tales of BSA's glory days but that's about all.  So an Eagle he may one day be but it breaks my heart that his scouting trail will be so much poorer than his Dads or mine.

[Eagle1993]

I don't think this will happen. But, if Ch 7 occurred..

All assets (essential HA based and Trademarks including Eagle) would be sold to the highest bidder.  This includes all merit badges and program materials.

I could see a "new national" BSA form who would buy most of the trademarks and materials (but not HA bases).  Then scouting would proceed.

The most likely path for BSA is that it is going to get very expensive regardless of Ch 7 unless they start getting big donations and large increases of youth. I wouldn't be surprised to see scouts Canada fees ($150/year), HA bases charge $2K+ for 7 day trips and summer camps head towards $600+ for a week.  BSA will exist, but if our course doesn't change it I fear it will be for those that can afford it. 

[FireStone]

8 hours ago, Oldscout448 said:

While roasting  marshmallows last weekend my grandson told me he wants to be an Eagle Scout like his Dad.  He's almost 6.  It hurts knowing  that it probably won't be possible. It's not the rank that  matters, it's realizing that even if scouts survives it will most likely be vastly diminished . Will Philmot be there?  Jamborees?  The OA?  ...

I think it will still be there. I've been hearing predictions about this all going away for longer than my son as been on this planet and he's a Tenderfoot now. If some of those predictions were right he would have never even worn the uniform.

Even if some of those things to do go away, I disagree that it diminishes anything. Lots of Eagles (myself included) never went to a Jamboree, Philmont, etc., or even went to anything outside of our home tristate area. Doesn't mean the rank means any less to me. Different troops have different cultures when it comes to high adventure, big trips, and travel. None of it is a requirement of the rank.

[ThenNow]

3 hours ago, Eagle1993 said:

youth. I wouldn't be surprised to see scouts Canada fees ($150/year), HA bases charge $2K+ for 7 day trips and summer camps head towards $600+ for a week.  BSA will exist, but if our course doesn't change it I fear it will be for those that can afford it. 

For context:

* The Aspen Institute’s study showed that parents with a child in ice hockey spent on average $2,583 per year in 2019. 

* After the gear comes lessons, lift tickets and the cost of getting to and from the mountain. Skiing and snowboarding costs about $2,250 per child in 2019.

* Gymnastics $1200

* Lacrosse $1200

* Tennis $1200

* Flag Football (lowest at) $270

Edited September 6, 2022 by ThenNow
Sorry for wonky font size

[InquisitiveScouter]

2 minutes ago, ThenNow said:

For context:

* The Aspen Institute’s study showed that parents with a child in ice hockey spent on average $2,583 per year in 2019. 

* After the gear comes lessons, lift tickets and the cost of getting to and from the mountain. Skiing and snowboarding costs about $2,250 per child in 2019.

* Gymnastics $1200

* Lacrosse $1200

* Tennis $1200

* Flag Football (lowest at) $270

I haven't specifically tracked all costs, but I tell parents that, to participate in every outing in our program for the year, including Summer Camp, you'll spend about $1000.  And, in our fundraiser, it is entirely possible for an enterprising Scout to earn that much money.