Chapter 11 Announced - Part 10 - Post Confirmation Hearing/Judges Ruling

[ThenNow]

Most recent request for compensation from The Stang's firm. It's an "interim period" going back to January. Don't ask me. Anyway, you're welcome to read through and report fully on this filing. On my end, I simply had to relay one of the best lines I've read in a legal document in a good minute. Not being a bookkeeper, accountant, tax attorney or $250 per hour fee application preparer, I'm not familiar with this term of art. I find it hilarious, however. (Please allow us this moment of comic relief, weak though my efforts may be.)

PSZ&J is particularly sensitive to issues of “lumping.”

Say wha? Maybe they're cookin' up something? Surely not the books (and I mean that.) Oo! Pancakes? Biscuits? Gravy? Okay. Now I'm hungry. Back in a bit... 

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/d9b3db8f-05d1-4ff8-8f76-9c9f76e452b4_9955.pdf

 

Edited June 23, 2022 by ThenNow

[skeptic]

Say what you will, these people seem to not find their levels of billing usurious.  Who on here, of normal populace, ever made three digit hourly rates?  What is non working transportation hours?  I know, it is our system.  And that is half the problem, as it has become far too much of money pit than a legal equity and fairness instrument.  And since the wolves are in charge of the system, little will change unless we find a way to get rid of many of the wolves.  Just saying.  I am a peon, and this whole thing reeks, and worst of all is that the survivors/victims are also getting abuse again by this whole thing, along with the BSA and its conveyors of the programs.  

Maybe I am just too jaded and old to comprehend the new universal right of excess and greed.

Edited June 23, 2022 by skeptic
add

[fred8033]

2 hours ago, ThenNow said:

Most recent request for compensation from The Stang's firm. It's an "interim period" going back to January.

Is this normal?  Early in the case, fees documents were filed 1 to 2 months after the month.  Now, it's almost five full months later.  That means there is a huge backlog of unbilled fees pending.  That sounds dangerous.  

[Tron]

3 hours ago, ThenNow said:

Most recent request for compensation from The Stang's firm. It's an "interim period" going back to January. Don't ask me. Anyway, you're welcome to read through and report fully on this filing. On my end, I simply had to relay one of the best lines I've read in a legal document in a good minute. Not being a bookkeeper, accountant, tax attorney or $250 per hour fee application preparer, I'm not familiar with this term of art. I find it hilarious, however. (Please allow us this moment of comic relief, weak though my efforts may be.)

PSZ&J is particularly sensitive to issues of “lumping.”

Say wha? Maybe they're cookin' up something? Surely not the books (and I mean that.) Oo! Pancakes? Biscuits? Gravy? Okay. Now I'm hungry. Back in a bit... 

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/d9b3db8f-05d1-4ff8-8f76-9c9f76e452b4_9955.pdf

 

Lumping is when a retirement plan has "Lump Sum" clauses that allow a member to take a lump sum payment or allow an employer to force someone out of a retirement plan with a lump sum payment. Normally plan advisors do not like either lump sum option as most retirement plans are tied to accruing value using available principal; bulk divestiture causes revisions in performance projections etc ...

[fred8033]

49 minutes ago, SiouxRanger said:

3.  My favorite situation was the client whose hospital bill was reduced from $26,000± to $928 because of some agreement for preferential rates between the hospital and health insurer.  Then the hospital hammered the client for the $928.  "Y'all wrote off over $25,000 and now chasing $928?"

I was part of CA class action in the 1990s where BCBS of CA was negotiating discounts with medical providers ... BUT the patient bill was based on the unmarked down portion.  BCBS was claiming they covered theirs without paying their fair share.    The issue was if the original bill was $10,000 and BCBS/patient had a 50%/50% share ... then BCBS would negotiate drastically down on the whole bill but the patient would still owe the full $5000.  BCBS could end up owing nothing.  ... Down right ugly fraud.

Edited June 23, 2022 by fred8033

[MYCVAStory]

I'll leave arguments over whether the rates charged are appropriate or not.  I find that lots of arguments can be made.  "Compared to X, Y is outrageous."  "Well, we pay our professional athletes at the top of their game this so why shouldn't professionals at the top of theirs be paid a lot?"  Lots of justifications are available and for me, and perhaps a product of abuse, is working hard to determine what I have some sort of control over before I ramp up my outrage to the white-hot level.  Just offering this though:

1.  There is a fee examiner in this bankruptcy.  He is required to go through all bills and ask for clarification.

2.  Some of the largest bills, potentially THE largest, are yet to come.  These are the bills from all the depositions prior to the confirmation hearing AND then the weeks of confirmation.  All those attorneys and every professional on Zoom watching confirmation were billing.

3.  I remember reading once something to the effect of "Bankruptcy is expensive.  It should be.  Debtors need to know that it's going to cost a lot so that it's a deterrent to declaring bankruptcy."  Twisted logic but logic nonetheless.

I'd also like to offer a prediction, something I don't do often unless I'm pretty sure of it.  In this case I just have a hunch.  IF this bankruptcy plan is confirmed in some fashion there will be a lot of people seeing it as some sort of "resolution."  That may or may not be the case and people who aren't Survivors will be on both sides; Survivors too I imagine.   But still, the whole thing will be abstract because resolution is an abstract concept.  But then, there will be an echo to the result of this stage.  That echo will come back in the form of awards.  Money is tangible.  WHEN Survivors start seeing awards THEN they and especially the general public will truly understand the result and impact of the bankruptcy.  We're making judgements about fees because they are tangible and we can weigh them against services performed.  If checks start hitting mailboxes that will happen again and there is a real chance that Survivors AND ESPECIALLY others will look at all of this through a tangible lens that might cast a new light on ALL of it.

 

[ScouterDavid]

On 6/21/2022 at 6:07 PM, Eagle1993 said:

As part of the plan, BSA councils are kicking in an extra $100M that would have gone to pension fund as the councils said the fund was already larger than needed at the time of the plan. 

I definitely agree most claimants would be better off in Ch 11, but some would be better off in Ch 7.  I certainly hope the judge comes back with an approval as it seems like we are running out of time.  At some point they will hit cash flow issues.  As long as Jambo 2023 is on, I think we are ok.  If you see BSA cancel 2023 it may be a sign the bankruptcy is taking too long and they need to save cash. 

The LCs aren't really kicking in an extra $100M. That only applies IF the pension plan is overfunded. After the latest market turbulence, it isn't and the $100M will be going to the pension plan, NOT the trust fund.

[Tron]

Considering the rollercoaster coming out of SCOTUS the past couple weeks is there any chance that the judge is waiting on a determination from 1 of the 4 outstanding SCOTUS opinions before handing down her judgement?

[MYCVAStory]

21 minutes ago, Tron said:

Considering the rollercoaster coming out of SCOTUS the past couple weeks is there any chance that the judge is waiting on a determination from 1 of the 4 outstanding SCOTUS opinions before handing down her judgement?

Little.  There are some issues that are anything but "cut and dry."  Bankruptcy Judges know their decisions will be reviewed, and potentially appealed.  This one has insurers with appeals ready to tee up.  She's taking a long time to be thorough, wrestle with issues, and given the time it's taking possibly dealing with portions she will approve and portions she will reject. 

[fred8033]

9 hours ago, fred8033 said:

Edited 8 hours ago by RememberSchiff
Posted videos, images, and links must pertain to the original post.

WHAT !!!!!   Image removed?  ... Months passing waiting for a ruling ... directly commenting on slow wait for the ruling ....   Yet, @ThenNow gets to have an image about heating and air conditioning wages.  ... AND ... AND !!!! ... AND !!!! ... Don't think I didn't notice that other posters got to have their lawyer jokes, but my previously very high quality legal profession humor was removed.  ... ...    I should take this to SCOTUS and have this injustice overturned.  

@RememberSchiff ... Thanks for what you do.  ...  FYI ... I do have a few more lawyer jokes to share.  

Edited June 29, 2022 by fred8033

[RememberSchiff]

Sorry been busy guarding the wall. I will remove the off-topic stuff mentioned.

This serious topic seems to have wandered more than usual due to the wait, seems every week there is someone asking Are we there yet?

Maybe the topic should be locked until the wait is over?

RS

Edited June 29, 2022 by RememberSchiff

[fred8033]

22 minutes ago, RememberSchiff said:

Sorry been busy guarding the wall. I will remove the off-topic stuff mentioned.

This serious topic seems to have wandered more than usual due to the wait, seems every week there is someone asking Are we there yet?

Maybe the topic should be locked until the wait is over?

RS

I'm just de-stressing as we wait.    ... no worries.  ...  Providing humor and did not intend to get other posts removed.  ...  I still have my lawyer jokes ready though.

Edited June 29, 2022 by fred8033

[PaleRider]

17 hours ago, RememberSchiff said:

Sorry been busy guarding the wall. I will remove the off-topic stuff mentioned.

This serious topic seems to have wandered more than usual due to the wait, seems every week there is someone asking Are we there yet?

Maybe the topic should be locked until the wait is over?

RS

It's a shame the Boy Scouts didn't take this topic serious for 1 hundred plus years.

[ThenNow]

This is very interesting. I reckon it will be getting some serious press and, in my view, could be a game changer in terms of states opening look-back windows.  

Federal investigators have reportedly launched an expansive investigation into allegations of sex abuse within the Roman Catholic Church in New Orleans going back decades.  The probe reportedly focuses on whether priests traveled with children across state lines in order to assault them.

According to an Associated Press report published Wednesday, more than a dozen victims of alleged abuse have been interviewed this year in connection with the investigation. Some of the cases involve abuse that allegedly took place during trips to Mississippi, Texas, and Florida.

One victim, a former altar boy who was not named in accordance with AP policy not to identify people who say they have been sexually abused, said that he was taken on trips to Colorado and Florida and was abused starting in the 1970s when he was in the fifth grade.

https://apnews.com/article/new-orleans-clergy-sex-abuse-fbi-investigation-0d0ee865d27508b7848909d8e82e87fb

“This is actually a big deal, and it should be heartening to victims,” said Marci Hamilton, a University of Pennsylvania professor and chief executive of Child USA, a think tank focused on preventing child abuse. “The FBI has rarely become involved in the clergy sex abuse scandals. They’ve dragged their feet around the country with respect to the Catholic Church.”

https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile/fbi-investigating-decades-of-alleged-sex-abuse-in-new-orleans-catholic-church-report/

[JBWest]

13 minutes ago, ThenNow said:

This is very interesting. I reckon it will be getting some serious press and, in my view, could be a game changer in terms of states opening look-back windows.  

This particular law in Louisiana lengthening the look back period (down here we call it the prescriptive period) was ruled unconstitutional by the state supreme court.  Will be interesting to see how it plays out now that the feds have taken over.