CynicalScouter Posted October 8, 2021 Author Share Posted October 8, 2021 5 minutes ago, johnsch322 said: With that being said I see an incredible hill to climb for a yes vote. Yep the question now becomes 1) Does the plan get 50%? 2) 66 2/3% (which would allow for a BSA only release/toggle plan)? 3) 75%+? I think 1 could happen. I've said before I see no chance of 2, and 3? Forget it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CynicalScouter Posted October 8, 2021 Author Share Posted October 8, 2021 17 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said: Also mentioned as the failed Archdiocese of St. Paul and Minneapolis bankruptcy: two plans (victims plan and archdiocese plan) simultaneously submitted and rejected, back to mediation they went. I looked. The votes came back in May 2017 Quote Of the 447 people eligible to vote, 406 people participated in the voting process. The plan submitted by the Creditors’ Committee received 94% of survivors’ votes and 93% of the survivors who participated voted to reject the plan proposed by the Archdiocese. https://www.andersonadvocates.com/media-advisory-voting-complete-results-tallied-in-archdiocese-of-st-paul-minneapolis-bankruptcy-case/ That said, the judge STILL rejected both plans, even though 90%+ of the survivors were in favor of their plan. https://www.andersonadvocates.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/Archdiocese-Ballot-Report-Tabulation.pdf The udge ruled in effect NEITHER were confirmable in December 2017. Memo: Denial of Plans Order Denying Confirmation of Archdiocese Plan of Reorganization Order Denying Confirmation of Unsecured Creditors Committee Plan of Reorganization My May all sides reached a deal that was confirmed in September 2018 Confirmation Order Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle1993 Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 3 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said: I looked. The votes came back in May 2017 https://www.andersonadvocates.com/media-advisory-voting-complete-results-tallied-in-archdiocese-of-st-paul-minneapolis-bankruptcy-case/ That said, the judge STILL rejected both plans, even though 90%+ of the survivors were in favor of their plan. https://www.andersonadvocates.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/Archdiocese-Ballot-Report-Tabulation.pdf The udge ruled in effect NEITHER were confirmable in December 2017. Memo: Denial of Plans Order Denying Confirmation of Archdiocese Plan of Reorganization Order Denying Confirmation of Unsecured Creditors Committee Plan of Reorganization My May all sides reached a deal that was confirmed in September 2018 Confirmation Order So a similar timeline for BSA would be April 2023. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnsch322 Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 I have to admit it felt good to hear the TCC say so many times that the plan sucks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiouxRanger Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 46 minutes ago, johnsch322 said: I have to admit it felt good to hear the TCC say so many times that the plan sucks. "Draws a vacuum" is the legally sanctioned term. (No, wait, that is a physics expression, and we know physicists only speak math. "S... " musts be legal-what do those folks know about English?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle1993 Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 Subpoena by Zalkin served against a variety of councils and COs including churches, schools, Etc. https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/02f5f86d-8578-44db-b1e2-ba2559be6308_6549.pdf 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CynicalScouter Posted October 9, 2021 Author Share Posted October 9, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said: Subpoena by Zalkin served against a variety of councils and COs including churches, schools, Etc. https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/02f5f86d-8578-44db-b1e2-ba2559be6308_6549.pdf One thing that will start to happen is we will see 1) tons and tons of parties coming out of the woodwork. There are already 5 new filings. Remember: lots of claimants have attorneys but those attorneys have sat back and let the coalition and in particular a brown-rudnick to do the heavy lift of attending all meetings, etc. 2) expect lots of “joinders”. That is legal parlance for “what that group is asking for? Yeah we want a copy, too.” Or “who that group wants to depose? We want to be there.” eventually Mosby and other BSA big wigs will get deposed. I would expect a line of attorneys around the block wanting to be there and ask them questions. 3) expect tons and tons a of discovery demands. A case this big I would expect the docket will just going to be a mess. Edited October 9, 2021 by CynicalScouter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MYCVAStory Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 33 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said: 3) expect tons and tons a of discovery demands. A case this big I would expect the docket will just going to be a mess. Besides the TCC discovery demands that came out today THIS is huge: Order Authorizing And Approving The Tort Claimants Committees Application For Entry Of An Order Under 11 U.S.C. §§ 1103(a) And 328(a) And Fed. R. Bankr. P. 2014(a) Authorizing Retention Of The Claro Group LLC As Expert Consultant On Sexual Abuse And Expert Witness Effective As Of September 1, 2021 (Related Doc # [6287]) Order Signed on 10/8/2021. (CMB) The TCC has retained a firm to act as an expert witness and begin the process of valuing claims. Claro has been used in many other cases to get an idea of values based upon historical settlements, SOLs, etc. Remember thatthe TCC was trying to get an estimation motion" approved but was swimming upstream when the parties decided it would take too long. So, if this plan has the votes or is close the TCC will potentially have the ammunition to demonstrate that the values are unreasonably being compensated too little. They are the real deal: https://www.theclarogroup.com/ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CynicalScouter Posted October 9, 2021 Author Share Posted October 9, 2021 1 minute ago, MYCVAStory said: The TCC has retained a firm to act as an expert witness and begin the process of valuing claims. Claro has been used in many other cases to get an idea of values based upon historical settlements, SOLs, etc. Yep. They were Quote Specifically, Claro has assisted several major universities, including Michigan State University in connection with the Dr. Larry Nassar molestation/abuse claims, as the retained valuation consultants. In this role, Claro developed individual claim values for each claimant and assisted in the settlement of the Nassar claims and hundreds of sexual abuse claims against other defendants. Claro also worked closely with counsel and performed numerous allocations of such claims across decades worth of available coverages to support insurance recovery efforts. Claro has performed similar work for other universities, and is currently serving as a valuation expert on behalf of the The Official Committee of Unsecured Creditors in the Diocese of Rochester bankruptcy proceedings involving abuse and molestation issues. Whereas BSA hired White & Chase to come up with an estimated valuation of claims ($4-7 billion) Claro will come in likely much, much, much higher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CynicalScouter Posted October 9, 2021 Author Share Posted October 9, 2021 So, the more I think about it the more I am changing my mind on something. I had said that I thought a BSA-only toggle plan was the end result of this mess. I am, however, somewhat intrigued by the idea that came up in the Minneapolis-St. Paul archdiocese case. After the Archdiocese's plan went down in flames (90% AGAINST) and the abuse victims plan was supported (90%) the judge rejected BOTH plans at confirmation and ordered them back into mediation. I still believe that BSA-only comes out of this, but I am now not as certain. Perhaps, after this plan crashes down in flames or at the very least fails to get 67% that there will be a reckoning among the COs and LCs that this is not going away and that the numbers need to go way, way up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle1993 Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 The docket is bursting today with documents. A lot of discovery requests all around. Several now pulling in individual COs (specific churches, etc.). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CynicalScouter Posted October 9, 2021 Author Share Posted October 9, 2021 Well now things got interesting. Or more so. The Coalition is now issuing discovery demands on the TCC. https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/0901a0f7-57a2-471f-8309-f7ba40cf1069_6567.pdf What, we don't know other than it is for documents. And Century has now officially subpoenaed Kosnoff https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/fd0dc01f-34c3-42d7-9092-345ada49eb63_6565.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muttsy Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 Kosnoff’s subpoena issued out of Central CA bankruptcy court, not Silverstein. It’s all privileged information he’s seeking. So when Kosnoff objects and Tanc moves to compel, what does he think that judge is going to think. And does he think a CA bankruptcy court will even get to it before way next year? Not sure I see the logic of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CynicalScouter Posted October 9, 2021 Author Share Posted October 9, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Muttsy said: Kosnoff’s subpoena issued out of Central CA bankruptcy court, not Silverstein. This makes sense. The subpoena is I think returnable in a court of competent jurisdiction within 100 miles of the location. So Kosnoff = Central District CA AVA/Arsdale = Southern District CA But then why is Salvation Army (Virginia) Delaware? Because you can drive 115 miles from the location to Silverstein's courtroom. I'd guess if Salvation Army wants to throw a fit the proper court to make this returnable against is in Virginia. Edited October 9, 2021 by CynicalScouter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle1993 Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 2 hours ago, CynicalScouter said: Well now things got interesting. Or more so. The Coalition is now issuing discovery demands on the TCC. https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/0901a0f7-57a2-471f-8309-f7ba40cf1069_6567.pdf What, we don't know other than it is for documents. And Century has now officially subpoenaed Kosnoff https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/fd0dc01f-34c3-42d7-9092-345ada49eb63_6565.pdf Let us know when they subpoena scouter.com. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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