Chapt 11 Proof of Claim leads to Local Search Warrant, Arrest

[ThenNow]

38 minutes ago, RememberSchiff said:

"Information in this Sexual Abuse Survivor Proof of Claim may be required to be disclosed to governmental authorities under mandatory reporting laws in many jurisdictions. "

Yes. Ok. I see it and I now recall. It’s at the very end of an 8-line paragraph, comprising the totality of “PART I: Confidentiality.”

Since I previously reported all this crap to law enforcement in 2003 and BSA in 2008, it wasn’t an issue for me. HOWEVER, we were told there would be due Notice of Designation of Additional Permitted Parties in the event any other previously unnamed party requested and was being granted access to our Proofs of Claim. If they’re forwarding to law enforcement, that should trigger the notice requirement. I know, I know. They are using an exception for expediency/existent circumstances or some such. Perhaps the victims received such notice? In ANY case, we deserve to be advised if this is happening with our POC. Right?

 

Edited August 20, 2021 by ThenNow

[CynicalScouter]

19 minutes ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

Is that not the case now?  I know in my state, that is the case. 

Not every state makes it a LAW that everyone involved in scouting/childrens programs is a mandatory reporter. I'm not sure how Alabama law squares on this. But again, if I had to guess, I'd say that the bankruptcy judge would find in favor of a council official who transferred the info to local police.

[ThenNow]

1 hour ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

I would think this is a good thing, especially for victims.

Victims, generally, yes. As to the individual who put their blood and guts on the line to create the jumping off point for law enforcement? Maybe not so much if there is no notice, warning and, “Hey, you might want to be aware...” I know you can’t understand, and that’s got to be that (for me).

Edited August 20, 2021 by ThenNow

[ThenNow]

56 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said:

Not every state makes it a LAW that everyone involved in scouting/childrens programs is a mandatory reporter.

 

manda.pdf

[ThenNow]

Last note for the night, I think. What is difficult for non-victims to viscerally and deeply understand is this. Finding out about even the prospect of our Proof of Claim being used by others, without any due notice, is a massive trigger. When I read the article, it lit a short fuse. That fuse led to the implosion that occurs when I am confronted, yet again, with the falling, falling, falling into panic and despair that besets me when control is taken from me without my permission. Out of control of my body, my already fragile identity, my information and my fate. Everyone feels insecure when not in control. We feel the earth tremble, the ground open up beneath us and the seemingly inevitable slide toward dark places. 

Edited August 21, 2021 by ThenNow

[Life]

8 minutes ago, ThenNow said:

Last note for the night, I think. What is difficult for non-victims to viscerally and deeply understand is this. Finding out about even the prospect of our Proof of Claim being used by others, without any due notice, is a massive trigger. When I read the article, it lit a short fuse. That fuse led to the implosion that occurs when I am confronted, yet again, with the falling, falling, falling into panic and despair that besets me when control is taken from me without my permission. Out of control body, my already fragile identity, my information and my fate. Everyone feels insecure when not in control. We feel the earth tremble, the ground open up beneath us and the seemingly inevitable slide toward dark places. 

I ‘like’ that you spoke my mind, but I dislike that it is the experience occurring. 
that being said, all wounds being splayed open, broken identity being run through again, I would welcome this in my case (with proper notice) on more than one occasion, due to the multiple investigations into the man that molested me, I would hope this time I wouldn’t be told to go home and just forget about it.  
who trained these people? 
thanks again for coming from the deep of your gut. It is helpful. 

[David CO]

Sometimes the needs of the community outweigh the needs of the individual.  I think mandatory reporting is a prime example of this.  The community needs mandatory reporting, even if the victim and/or the victim's family objects.  

[Eagle1993]

2 hours ago, ThenNow said:

Victims, generally, yes. As to the individual who put their blood and guts on the line to create the jumping off point for law enforcement? Maybe not so much if there is no notice, warning and, “Hey, you might want to be aware...” I know you can’t understand, and that’s got to be that (for me).

We don’t know the specifics of this case.  Perhaps they did discuss this with the claimant.  I absolutely agree law enforcement should communicate with victims and involve them in the process.  I hope they  would include experts in sex abuse victims to handle the discussions appropriately.

However, I believe that they need to act on this information. Who knows how many kids are currently being abused by some of these men.
 

 I am incredibly thankful that some men reported the abuse.  I hope they were treated kindly during the process.  

[ThenNow]

12 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said:

I believe that they need to act on this information. Who knows how many kids are currently being abused by some of these men.

Ok. Obviously not done for the night.

Don’t disagree and hopefully you didn’t think I was saying otherwise. I’m trying to point out the very hybrid, unique situation this is. We’re not talking about a direct allegation to a “reporter” or observed suspicious behavior. These are, most likely, detailed retellings of a man’s abuse for the specific purpose of receiving compensation, with some expectation of great discretion, confidentiality (admittedly qualified) and the promise of notice pre-disclosure. The difference couldn’t be too much greater. 

Edited August 21, 2021 by ThenNow

[MYCVAStory]

3 hours ago, Eagle1970 said:

Ok.  Mandatory reporting.  I get that.  I should have read that.  My abuser likes guns.  Great.  Thanks BSA.  My proof already made its way to the Catholic Insurance Fund.  Might just as well put it in the paper.  This whole thing has gone from helping victims into an all-out S### show.  I don't need the minimal compensation as much as I need my security and well-being.  Just sorry I ever filed.

That's a shame.  If you have a lawyer, did he/she spell this out?  I'm always wondering how in-depth some attorneys discussed the process versus churning POCs.

[DuctTape]

I am so sorry to those survivors whom, through this entire process, are continually being triggered, re-traumatized etc... as reports, information etc... are reported. Stay safe and strong! You WILL get through this.

[ThenNow]

5 hours ago, DuctTape said:

to those survivors whom, through this entire process, are continually being triggered, re-traumatized etc... as reports, information etc... are reported.

From my view, given no attorney updates (other than when I talk to myself which is frequently), the TCC has done a great job of tying to keep us advised. Sometimes, it can only be after the fact when things emerge from the mediation cones of silence or happen in court. That’s a huge challenge for many of us; being behind the information curve. What I’ve heard here is a number of firms, AIS and others, haven’t been so hot communicating with clients, especially in response to personal inquiries. That is awful. No attorney should get 40-50% if they’re not doing their job. 

13 hours ago, MYCVAStory said:

If you have a lawyer, did he/she spell this out?  I'm always wondering how in-depth some attorneys discussed the process versus churning POCs.

Me, too. Hindsight is 20/20, but it would have been nice for there to have been a more obvious, clear and robust explanation of the process within the POC. Unfortunately, guys who never really saw the document and/or processed through a call center would never have seen it or be told about it anyway. I hate that.

[ThenNow]

Back to the case that kicked off this thread, I believe Auburn, AL is in the Chattahoochee Council, yes? If so, the list of claims shows 150 implicating it independently and 3 “shared” with Greater Alabama Council. I was thinking it may be a small number than that and very easy to work through and see the more recent claims, identify anyone notable, as here. I would like to know if LCs are reviewing all of their claims as a matter of course. Anyone know? 

PS - This is a Scouter site, yes? I need to report that I am baffled and troubled by the fact that topics are segregated by being designated “threads.” Shouldn’t you/we be calling them “binder twines”? There. Got that off my chest. Carry on...

Edited August 21, 2021 by ThenNow

[ThenNow]

1 hour ago, ThenNow said:

,

Wouldn’t you know. “Pride cometh before the fall.” I typed a comma instead of a period. D-Oh!

[Eagle94-A1]

2 hours ago, ThenNow said:

Back to the case that kicked off this thread, I believe Auburn, AL is in the Chattahoochee Council, yes? If so, the list of claims shows 150 implicating it independently and 3 “shared” with Greater Alabama Council. I was thinking it may be a small number than that and very easy to work through and see the more recent claims, identify anyone notable, as here. I would like to know if LCs are reviewing all of their claims as a matter of course. Anyone know? 

I would hope someone at every council who has access to the POC has gone through to see if anyone accused is still active and/or alive. T

I admit I assumed victims would be questioned by law enforcement and notified about the arrests prior to them happening.