Chapter 11 announced - Part 2 (after the big slow)

[David CO]

Just now, carebear3895 said:

The two are synonymous in the mind of your average American 

Nope.  Our local unit still has a good reputation in the community.  BSA's reputation is dirt. 

[carebear3895]

3 minutes ago, David CO said:

Nope.  Our local unit still has a good reputation in the community.  BSA's reputation is dirt. 

Great for your local unit. 

Edited April 13, 2021 by carebear3895

[1980Scouter]

If the lawsuit is just over National, would they still not go after HAB's? 

[David CO]

3 minutes ago, carebear3895 said:

Great for your local unit. 

Yep.  So long as it all works out well for the kids, that's all that really matters.

 

[yknot]

We are all the Kool-Aid drinkers here, so we trend optimistic. Scouting is very difficult to understand and to administer compared to most other youth activities. I think there is a need for an outdoors oriented youth organization. I don't think scouting is it any longer. BP had a great idea for his time but times have changed. Maybe it's an opportunity for some other visionary to come up with a program that connects people to the world outside. I'm sure for awhile some vestigial scouting units will continue until they get sued or turned out but it won't last. 

[Eagle1993]

33 minutes ago, 1980Scouter said:

If the lawsuit is just over National, would they still not go after HAB's? 

I expect the TCC will go after all unrestricted assets that National owns.  They have already signaled that includes Philmont & Summit.  The BSA lead lawyer told the AP they expect litigation will be required to determine the outcome of some aspects of the plan.  HABs are the big target/asset National has ... the courts will decide if they stay with the BSA or are sold off. 

[walk in the woods]

2 hours ago, elitts said:

But as far as I'm aware, most, if not all, of the settlements thus-far have been funded by insurance policies.

Insurance policies paid for by your dues and council chartering fees.  Insurance isn't free.

[David CO]

1 hour ago, 5thGenTexan said:

 After its all said and done, does the general population care about WOSM? 

No.  The general public doesn't even know that WOSM exists.  The public has some vague notion that there is an international scouting group, but couldn't say who it is.  

I'm not sure that's important.  The important thing is that WOSM does exist, and it can authorize the creation of a new scout association in the USA.  WOSM will not leave the USA without a scout association.

 

[ThenNow]

On 4/5/2021 at 11:52 AM, Eagle1993 said:

Shouldn't this be as easy as a table that states:

Entity        Total Assets     Total Unrestricted assets       Amount provided to Trust

 

Then fill in for BSA and every council.  The TCC could then review and argue if they believe the asset amounts listed are incorrect or if the amount provided to the trust is not a sufficient percentage of the unrestricted assets.

I agree its complex, but it sounds like TCC has already assessed 500 properties and could probably verify that table.

Given TCC's response, it seems like either BSA isn't providing sufficient information or are not providing an offer sufficient to settle.

I’m using this as a jumping off point, of sorts, and don’t expect much response. If so, I’d love to hear.

Alongside whatever has/hasn’t gone on with BSA hiding the asset peanut, I feel like they are simply doing a terrible job of representing what I thought Scouting was supposed to be. As you know, Scouting wasn’t all it was meant to be in my life. Still, I see the good, carry with me great lessons and some happy memories, and know the moral and ethical construct is sound. From the apparent lack of interface with the TCC, the failure to engage anyone on the claimant side before filing Amended Plan 1 and soon Amended Plan 2, the lack of collaboration between LCs, and more or less lying to LCs about the prospect of needing to contribute to receive a release, Scouting has the egg of untrustworthiness all over its face. Add to that an ice cold lead council who exudes no compassion and comes off the quintessential robotic and unsympathetic Wall Street lawyer. She’s Gordon Gekko’s go-to. I’m certain she’s a big law sniper. A heavy hitter and extremely competent. All well and good, but she lends no measure of credibility or reinforcement to the alleged narrative that the BSA gives two turds about the survivors. I would never have selected her to be lead, at least publicly. I recognize you want the best, but this is a PR case as well as a legal one.

Scouting? I see good. For sure. BSA? The nasty taste in my mouth isn’t soon to fade. 

[yknot]

22 minutes ago, David CO said:

No.  The general public doesn't even know that WOSM exists.  The public has some vague notion that there is an international scouting group, but couldn't say who it is.  

I'm not sure that's important.  The important thing is that WOSM does exist, and it can authorize the creation of a new scout association in the USA.  WOSM will not leave the USA without a scout association.

 

I hope you're right but I do want to point out that most of the growth, and interest, in scouting is in non first world countries. I'm not so sure WOSM cares all that much about the US. Also in general, even in third world countries, there is declining interest and support for organizations that are perceived as vestiges of colonialism. Scouting's connection to someone who fought in the Boer War in Colonial South Africa and was so associated with the British elite upper class does not augur well for the future given how social trends are going. It's a net negative and the only reason it hasn't been a bigger issue is because people really haven't looked. The general public knows nothing about WOSM but say "Imperialist" and they react right away. 

[walk in the woods]

15 minutes ago, yknot said:

I hope you're right but I do want to point out that most of the growth, and interest, in scouting is in non first world countries. I'm not so sure WOSM cares all that much about the US. Also in general, even in third world countries, there is declining interest and support for organizations that are perceived as vestiges of colonialism. Scouting's connection to someone who fought in the Boer War in Colonial South Africa and was so associated with the British elite upper class does not augur well for the future given how social trends are going. It's a net negative and the only reason it hasn't been a bigger issue is because people really haven't looked. The general public knows nothing about WOSM but say "Imperialist" and they react right away. 

I suspect WOSM will care.  I may be wrong but I believe the first world countries effectively subsidize the growth in the non first world.

[5thGenTexan]

51 minutes ago, David CO said:

No.  The general public doesn't even know that WOSM exists.  The public has some vague notion that there is an international scouting group, but couldn't say who it is.  

I'm not sure that's important.  The important thing is that WOSM does exist, and it can authorize the creation of a new scout association in the USA.  WOSM will not leave the USA without a scout association.

 

Thats kind of my point.  They dont know about WOSM, and they don't care.  All they will hear is "Scouts" and then just move along.  A lot of PR repair if anything continues.

[David CO]

16 minutes ago, 5thGenTexan said:

Thats kind of my point.  They dont know about WOSM, and they don't care.  All they will hear is "Scouts" and then just move along.  A lot of PR repair if anything continues.

Yes.  A lot of repair will be needed.  

 

[Eagle1993]

BSA just released their new plan.  I figure that its a good time to lock this topic and start a new, part 3, Chapter 11 discussion.  Hopefully it will keep these large threads manageable.  

 

Edited April 14, 2021 by Eagle1993
added new thread link