Scouter liability insurance or umbrella policy

[tnmule20]

After a recent camp out that ended early because of a lightning storm my Father asked me if, as Scoutmaster, I am responsible for all of the Scouts on outings.  I said "Yes".  He said, "You know you could lose everything if one of the Scouts gets hurt or worse.  You might want to think about that."

So I started thinking about it, again.  I know that it is a possibility and I'm not sure if the BSA would have our back at this point in its current situation.  I know that we are supposedly covered under the BSA but I'm not sure I want to stake everything that I have worked for on that.  I have been with Farm Bureau insurance all of my life.  When I inquired about an umbrella policy specifically for my role as Scoutmaster my agent told me that the policy would not cover me for anything off of my property.  So I let it go.

Now that I am thinking about this again my question is,

Those of you that have this kind of protection, who do you have your policy through?  Are you sure it will cover you for something that happens at summer camp or elsewhere when it involves Scouts and/or their Parents?

[InquisitiveScouter]

You are covered by the Federal Volunteer Protection Act of 1997.

https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/PLAW-105publ19/pdf/PLAW-105publ19.pdf

 

https://www.astho.org/Programs/Preparedness/Public-Health-Emergency-Law/Emergency-Volunteer-Toolkit/Volunteer-Protection-Acts-and-Good-Samaritan-Laws-Fact-Sheet/#:~:text=The federal Volunteer Protection Act,for its protections to apply.

However,

"Protection under VPA does not apply if the volunteer engages in willful or criminal misconduct, gross negligence, reckless misconduct, or a conscious, flagrant indifference to the rights or safety of the individual(s) harmed by the volunteer. "

I don't think any insurance policy will cover you under those circumstances, either.  This is the basic position of the insurance companies who believe they have a case to deny payment under claims for sexual abuse...they hold that BSA violated those standards.

Which is why we diligently follow Guide to Safe Scouting, Scouter Code of Conduct, and written BSA policies.  You signed an application saying you would do the same

Edited March 31, 2021 by InquisitiveScouter

[tnmule20]

13 minutes ago, InquisitiveScouter said:

Which is why we diligently follow Guide to Safe Scouting, Scouter Code of Conduct, and written BSA policies.  You signed an application saying you would do the same

As do we.  Still dose not change the fact that people will sue no matter what guide you follow.

[InquisitiveScouter]

People will sue you, especially if you have an umbrella insurance policy   (Never advertise that you do!!)

I also had an umbrella, and cancelled for the same reason...it only covered the excess of things that happened on our property.

If you ever find a policy that will cover you, let us know! (anonymously here, of course  )

Edited March 31, 2021 by InquisitiveScouter

[T2Eagle]

Ask a different agent, or ask the agent again.  The whole point of umbrella policies is that they cover things not covered by your homeowners policy. 

If being involved in youth activities as a volunteer was really that risky you would know about a lot more claims and be offered insurance as part of every kid activity you're involved in.  So you probably don't need it.  But it's relatively cheap and brings some peace of mind, so I have it.

[scoutldr]

I have carried it, as well.  $4M through State Farm, where I have everything bundled.  Costs me a few hundred a year, although I am no longer an active Scouter.  I have a vacation home on a lake, boats, etc, and occasionally let friends use the property (not on a rental basis).

[InquisitiveScouter]

This should be a perquisite for Scoutmasters?  If unit financial situation permits, ask your committee to cover the umbrella while you are in the seat.

Thoughts?

[yknot]

I think one place to look for information is the youth sports world. Youth volunteer coaches and officials are frequently urged to get liability umbrella coverage. I don't see the roles as being much different. Also, I have always wondered about D&O insurance for those who serve on the committee. It's not just who is at the camp out who is liable. The committee can be named in lawsuits as well. 

[T2Eagle]

The party that will be named in a lawsuit is the CO, that's who the Directors and Officers of the troop are.   Whoever is running the CO should certainly have D&O insurance of some sort.

[scoutldr]

THey will sue everyone and let the Court sort it out.  It could still cost you thousands in legal fees even though you are dismissed from the suit.

[InquisitiveScouter]

On 4/2/2021 at 7:48 AM, scoutldr said:

THey will sue everyone and let the Court sort it out.  It could still cost you thousands in legal fees even though you are dismissed from the suit.

And that is another facet of tort reform that we need...

[yknot]

4 hours ago, InquisitiveScouter said:

And that is another facet of tort reform that we need...

We do need tort reform. On the other hand I would not want to be in Canada or Europe where your kid can be mutilated and you have almost no recourse. 

[mrjohns2]

On 4/1/2021 at 6:15 AM, scoutldr said:

I have carried it, as well.  $4M through State Farm, where I have everything bundled.  Costs me a few hundred a year, although I am no longer an active Scouter.  I have a vacation home on a lake, boats, etc, and occasionally let friends use the property (not on a rental basis).

I was at $2M, but your $4M caused me to reevaluate this last week. From both a holding and liability standpoint, I hadn't done a review in 5 years or so. I am now too at $4M. It wasn't much more to go from 2-4.

[InquisitiveScouter]

Reviving this old post, if you don't mind 😜

Can anyone out there tell me what BSA General Liability Insurance provides for you that a personal umbrella policy does not?  And vice versa?

https://www.scouting.org/health-and-safety/gss/gss10/

https://content.naic.org/article/whats-umbrella-policy

--------------------------------------------------------

Comprehensive General Liability Insurance

This coverage provides primary general liability coverage for registered adults of the Boy Scouts of America who serve in a volunteer or professional capacity concerning claims arising out of an official Scouting activity, which is defined in the insurance policy as consistent with the values, Charter and Bylaws, Rules and Regulations, operations manuals, and applicable literature of the Boy Scouts of America. This coverage responds to allegations of negligent actions by third parties that result in personal injury or property damage claims that are made and protects Scouting units and chartered organizations on a primary basis.

The BSA general liability insurance program provides volunteers and chartered organizations additional excess coverage for motor vehicles above a local council’s automobile liability policy or a volunteer’s or chartered organization’s automobile or watercraft liability policy. The owner’s motor vehicle (automobile) or watercraft liability insurance is primary. The excess insurance, whether the local council auto or BSA general liability, is available only while the motor vehicle or watercraft is in the actual use of a Scouting unit and being used during an official Scouting activity.

The insurance provided to unregistered Scouting volunteers participating in an official Scouting activity through the general liability insurance program is excess over any other insurance the volunteer might have to their benefit, usually a homeowner, personal liability, motor vehicle (automobile), or watercraft policy.

The general liability policy does not provide indemnification or defense coverage to those individuals who commit intentional and criminal acts. The Boy Scouts of America does not have an insurance policy that provides defense for situations involving allegations of intentional and criminal acts.

Scouting youth are not insured under the general liability policy.

---------------------------------------------------------

And, does anyone know the limits of this BSA coverage?  If I am an insured party, do I have a right to know? 😜

Edited February 16, 2023 by InquisitiveScouter

[scoutldr]

3 hours ago, InquisitiveScouter said:

The general liability policy does not provide indemnification or defense coverage to those individuals who commit intentional and criminal acts. The Boy Scouts of America does not have an insurance policy that provides defense for situations involving allegations of intentional and criminal acts.

So I interpret this to mean if you willfully ignore BSA rules and policy, such as the G2SS, you are not covered.  I believe this is being discussed in another thread.