Update on new Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion MB

[Bowsprit]

5 hours ago, Navybone said:

That is one definition from a scholarly article. Not the normal definition by any means.  Another is the definition Ford uses when they discuss diversity, equity, and inclusion.  And Ford is not a Marxist company.

”Equity seeks to ensure fair treatment, equality of opportunity, and fairness in access to information and resources for all. We believe this is only possible in an environment built on respect and dignity.”

fair treatment, equal opportunity, and fairness are consistent with how BSA operates and the scout law and oath.  There is no reason to believe this definition is not consistent with the BSAs approach to equity.  There is nothing to suggest that the BSA would suddenly  adopt a Marxist philosophy regarding scouting.  

You make a good argument with that Ford quote, however with Ford and BSA both adopting a stance that supports BLM's (the organization) narrative, and with BLM being an openly Marxist organization, I do not find that argument compelling.

Edited November 29, 2020 by Bowsprit
Spelling

[TAHAWK]

“It’s about giving people the resources and support they need so that everyone can be on equal footing, and then compete on equal footing. Equitable treatment means we all end up at the same place,” she [Harris] said as the video ended.

So may we distinguish between equality of opportunity and guaranteed equality of outcomes - e.g. "Eagle for all"?

[BQZip]

8 hours ago, Navybone said:

That is one definition from a scholarly article. Not the normal definition by any means.  Another is the definition Ford uses when they discuss diversity, equity, and inclusion.  And Ford is not a Marxist company.

”Equity seeks to ensure fair treatment, equality of opportunity, and fairness in access to information and resources for all. We believe this is only possible in an environment built on respect and dignity.”

fair treatment, equal opportunity, and fairness are consistent with how BSA operates and the scout law and oath.  There is no reason to believe this definition is not consistent with the BSAs approach to equity.  There is nothing to suggest that the BSA would suddenly  adopt a Marxist philosophy regarding scouting.  

It's HOW we ensure "fair" treatment that is the issue. "Fair" is a loaded word. Some view it as "white privilege" being suppressed. Others view it as setting quotas/affirmative action. Others, just making sure we give an honest effort to recruit from the inner cities. The reason we are wary is because none of this is being spelled out.

Edited November 29, 2020 by BQZip

[yknot]

"How" is indeed the issue. Do we want to remake the country or try to add in new colors between the lines. I'm all in favor of a radical re-envisioning of the system until it gets to the point where we are tearing down what created this amazing experiment in the first place. Because if we go, there is nothing much else left that holds the line. 

Edited November 29, 2020 by yknot

[CynicalScouter]

Update: https://discussions.scouting.org/t/de-i-merit-badge-requirements/209655

Quote

Scout Executives were supposed to turn in Comments last Friday for consideration.

Did any of you get asked your views on this? Or was this limited to S.E.s?

[BQZip]

8 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said:

Update: https://discussions.scouting.org/t/de-i-merit-badge-requirements/209655

Did any of you get asked your views on this? Or was this limited to S.E.s?

This is the first I heard of ANY feedback being accepted. That they aren't interested in feedback from PAYING members at large is more than a little disconcerting

[Navybone]

29 minutes ago, BQZip said:

That they aren't interested in feedback from PAYING members at large is more than a little disconcerting

Based on the comments on this site, I think BrianWylie1, who asked the question, was pretty clear in why they looked at a small group on how to implement the merit badge.  I would not assume that the leadership has not seen the response on sites like this and others.

[BQZip]

53 minutes ago, Navybone said:

Based on the comments on this site, I think BrianWylie1, who asked the question, was pretty clear in why they looked at a small group on how to implement the merit badge.  I would not assume that the leadership has not seen the response on sites like this and others.

The fact they didn't even ask for feedback is the problem. This is a top-down directed requirement based on appeasement. 

[fred8033]

QUESTION ... Perhaps it was written on a previous page.  

A current life scout, if thy don't complete requirements by May for Eagle, then, they need to complete this badge for Eagle?  GTA section 4 says rank requirements are stable once the scout earns the previous rank and they don't change.  

This topic should just be part of one or more of the existing citizenship badges.  ... OR ... merge all the citizenship badges and add this new badge.  Scouts should be out doing more active MBs with their rank representing that activity.   We've got just too many "required" MBs.  

[CynicalScouter]

10 minutes ago, fred8033 said:

QUESTION ... Perhaps it was written on a previous page.  

A current life scout, if thy don't complete requirements by May for Eagle, then, they need to complete this badge for Eagle?  GTA section 4 says rank requirements are stable once the scout earns the previous rank and they don't change.

It was announced: if you have not done your EBOR by May 1, you have to do the new merit badge.

You are right, GENERALLY it is stable once the scout earns the previous rank. But that is GENERALLY. Guide to Advancement lets national change the rules at any time. 7.0.4.3 What to Do When Requirements Change

Quote

Sometimes, however— especially for more significant changes—the Scouts BSA Handbook, the Scouts BSA Requirements book, www.scouting.org/meritbadges, or official communications from the National Council may set forth a different procedure that must be used and may establish a date by when use of the old requirements must cease.

 

Edited December 15, 2020 by CynicalScouter

[qwazse]

Name one MB where feedback was collected from boots-on-the-ground before roll-out.

[BQZip]

2 hours ago, qwazse said:

Name one MB where feedback was collected from boots-on-the-ground before roll-out.

Name one that wasn't:

https://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2013/08/12/how-to-suggest-a-new-merit-badge/

[qwazse]

6 hours ago, BQZip said:

Name one that wasn't:

https://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2013/08/12/how-to-suggest-a-new-merit-badge/

“... they’re the brainiacs who create new merit badges ...”

In other words: we’re not.

[Bowsprit]

Generally BSA seems to have done well in determining merit badges. Some people have said the requirements have been nerfed over time, that wouldn't suprise me. It's hard to compete on a basis of hard work in a culture that prizes instant gratification. Yet providing opportunities and direction for becoming a principled human being is what scouts are supposed to be about. Hence the disagreement about this specific badge and the greater concern over the direction of BSA in general. If it isn't going to provide the expected value, and continue its slow morphing into merely another vessel for propaganda laden entertainment, I'm out.

[RememberSchiff]

10 hours ago, qwazse said:

Name one MB where feedback was collected from boots-on-the-ground before roll-out.

Ah, now that would be a diverse, equitable, and inclusive MB program.

My $0.02,  well at least here