Sailing High Adventures

[clarkbear]

We have a group looking at the different sailing high adventures out of Sea Base. No one from our troop has gone on one of these, so I was hoping to get some feedback from anyone else's experiences? One thing we are wondering is which is better, the Sea Base Bahamas adventure or the Key West sailing adventure?

[InquisitiveScouter]

Save your money, book a week on the Chesapeake, DelMarVa Council:

http://www.delmarvacouncil.org/high-adventure-opportunities/high-adventure-sailing-on-the-chesapeake/9297#Registration

Save even more money...eliminate the middle man of the council, and book directly with the company:

https://www.experiencesail.com/

You'll have to plan for and bring your own meals...but they will give you guidance on that...

[qwazse]

I've done Key West Sailing adventure with three crews (on the same week) and Bahamas Sailing Adventure with two crews. They are both very rewarding. Especially the snorkeling in the Bahamas. I'd go back to the Bahamas with my family in a heartbeat. Oh wait, I did!

 

Yes, you can get private outfitters for each, but self-provisioning is a day out of your schedule. And the captains who sign up to host scouts are a unique breed.

[mashmaster]

We have done the Key West sailing through Seabase, it is a lot of fun. It isn't High adventure but it is a lot of fun.  I am not sure how the Bahama base is now after the last hurricanes, might be worth checking,

For our Sea Scouts they were looking at the Captain waiting to do more, they would rather charter a boat and sail it themselves, because they can.

[fred8033]

1 hour ago, mashmaster said:

It (Sea Base) isn't High adventure but it is a lot of fun. 

It depends how you define "high adventure".  One person's adventure is another person's normal weekend.  

High adventure in context of my experiences 

• New and challenging experiences -->  BSA Sea Base ... Activities that we just can't do where I live.
• Physically demanding --> Philmont ... Carrying a heavy pack for 6 to 10 miles each day.  Setup.  Tear down.  Hike.  Hike.  Hike.
• Dependent on your own crew for health, safety and success --> Northern Tier ... You are significantly further out and isolated than any of the other adventures.   Help and comfort are an hour away.  Maybe not a day or more away either. 
• Cost --> All ... 😁

Each can also be viewed as not a high-adventure.

• BSA Sea Base ... Expensive toys and the beach. 
• BSA Philmont ... A week of summer camp activities with a BSA second class five mile hike at the start of each day
• BSA Northern Tier ... A canoe trip. 

I've been on several high adventures and I cherish all of them.  Sea Base though holds a special place for me.  It was a unique adventure different than any of our other adventures.

Edited September 30, 2020 by fred8033

[mashmaster]

Fair enough, maybe our guys were all used to sailing already it wasn't particular new to use.  It was beautiful and a ton of fun.

My two High Adventures we did we 74 mile canoe trip on the Buffalo River and backpacking the Gila Wilderness loop in New Mexico.  Neither had no preset itinerary and the youth had to roll their own adventure.  Some things worked, some things didn't....  Like failing to put the food in waterproof containers on canoes....  dunked dinner more that once on the trip. But great adventures! 

[Eagledad]

15 hours ago, qwazse said:

Yes, you can get private outfitters for each, but self-provisioning is a day out of your schedule. And the captains who sign up to host scouts are a unique breed.

"Most" troops hesitate to plan their own High Adventure because the don't know how. I recommend troops use and outfitter once to learn the ropes and plan the next adventure on their own.  Or, call council and ask them if they know a Scouter who will lead and teach a High Adventure. We once had a Ventruring Crew that would lead and teach troops the skills for high adventure. 

Barry

[InquisitiveScouter]

2 minutes ago, Eagledad said:

"Most" troops hesitate to plan their own High Adventure because the don't know how.

A great resource...

https://tap.scouting.org/

Check it out

[qwazse]

3 hours ago, Eagledad said:

"Most" troops hesitate to plan their own High Adventure because the don't know how. I recommend troops use and outfitter once to learn the ropes and plan the next adventure on their own.  Or, call council and ask them if they know a Scouter who will lead and teach a High Adventure. We once had a Ventruring Crew that would lead and teach troops the skills for high adventure. 

Barry

I disagree. Troops hesitate to plan their own big-ticket activities because it is a time-consuming distraction from the troop's other activities. It is far easier to beef up a fundraiser to cover costs of staff who tailor trips for novice scouts (novice to the adventure, and often novice to being scout-run for a week straight.) than it is to build the level of scouts' personal responsibility for every aspect of the trip.

It's awesome if you can get your unit's parents to buy-in to building a troops' activities around shaping up for the next scout-researched-scout-designed-super-activity. Doing so really inspires younger scouts. Badges start being earned around what's needed to prepare for the trip. Advancement is no longer an end in itself. (My first-years are learning to "throw" a clove hitch over a post. One of them is inspired to become a sea scout.) But, it requires connecting a lot of dots -- building a vision -- that many troops are not prepared to do.

That's the case for my troop at the moment. This batch of older scouts has been sheltered from doing the heavy lifting of trip preparation. They know it because I tell them so when there's an event that interests them and I put it on them to line up transportation, schedules, and campsite location. And it's going to take a few more of my "special offerings" of events where they miss deadlines and, consequently, opportunities because "Mr. Q. is good for nothing and best used that way." But, once they realize that I'm with them anywhere and up for anything if they make the phone calls and line up the plans, we are gonna have a lot of fun (and eat quite well) on some lean budgets.

I'm sure most of my parents would rather throw money at the problem -- and if they'd pay my way and do the phone calls I'd almost take them up on it. But, it turns out that boys who are in a habit of the 'rents buying canned adventure are boys who haven't built a habit of uniting on a particular adventure in a particular year ... nor are they prepared with their backpack at the end of their bed ready to grab-and-go when someone has a last-minute opening in their crew.

If a scouter has a dozen scouts with BSA Seabase on the brain, he/she should build up the cash to make it happen. Along the way, they'll pick up tips and tricks for home-growing the next big-ticket activity. Their program will sync with their next adventure, and even the scouts who aren't on the trip will have buy-in on account of the skills they pick up in the preparation.

Edited September 30, 2020 by qwazse

[Eagledad]

13 minutes ago, qwazse said:

I disagree. Troops hesitate to plan their own big-ticket activities because it is a time-consuming distraction from the troop's other activities. It is far easier to beef up a fundraiser to cover costs of staff who tailor trips for novice scouts (novice to the adventure, and often novice to being scout-run for a week straight.) than it is to build the level of scouts' personal responsibility for every aspect of the trip.

We will have to agree to disagree. You're correlating scout-run to high-adventure. Most Troops that are scout-run aren't less scout run after they become experienced with high adventure. Scout run is principle philosophy that isn't going to change with the same set of adults.

Barry

[qwazse]

22 hours ago, Eagledad said:

We will have to agree to disagree. You're correlating scout-run to high-adventure. Most Troops that are scout-run aren't less scout run after they become experienced with high adventure. Scout run is principle philosophy that isn't going to change with the same set of adults.

Barry

I agree that scout-run and HA are orthogonal. A canned HA wont necessarily erode a scout-run ethos. It could cut the other way. For example, a crew may fall in with a Seabase captain or a Philmont ranger who firmly gets adults to stand down and who puts the scouts at the helm. That in turn can open the eyes of adult leaders for the first time. Folks come home more willing to let youth take the lead in decision making. Those leaders can back the youth to a skeptical committee because they've seen it in action and they want to see it again.

The canned vs. planned adventure decision can come from adult- or youth- run crews. Sometimes youth can easily put in a few more hours at work (or make themselves worth that much doing a few more chores at home) and their earnings offset the cost savings of planned adventure. Or they know they can mobilize adults for a fundraiser better than they can mobilize them to re-vamp the unit program toward planning the next big-ticket event. They can't find the synergy between a planned adventure and their weekly program ... so, they opt for canned. It's not so much ignorance as it is impatience.

[clarkbear]

Back specifically to the topic of the Sailing HA's run out of Sea Base, any recommendations on which one to do? Key West, Bahamas or St. Thomas? Any pros/cons we should consider while deciding among them? Thanks to everyone!

 

[qwazse]

17 minutes ago, clarkbear said:Back specifically to the topic of the Sailing HA's run out of Sea Base, any recommendations on which one to do? Key West, Bahamas or St. Thomas? Any pros/cons we should consider while deciding among them? Thanks to everyone!

I’ve done KW and Bahamas sailing.

KW: relatively inexpensive drive from Miami. Nice bunks on the base. Chance to meet scouts and scouters from elsewhere. The snorkeling in the marine sanctuary is the best in the U.S. The Atlantic can be choppy ... ergo sea sickness. Lots of famous landmarks. The sculpture garden in KW is inspiring ... especially the bust recognizing the person who brought scouting to the keys. But, there are also plenty of tourist traps. (And, discipline issues can arise ... depends on your adults.)

Bahamas: the flight from, say, Lauderdale to Marsh Harbor is expensive. International travel requires more paperwork. You won’t arrive at a base so much as a resort with a boat slip. You’ll cross paths with a few scouts, but most captains get under way right quick. The Sea of Abaco is less choppy, but tides might dictate when and where your boat can visit a particular island. I was very impressed with the snorkeling. But, you spend a good bit of time visiting little islands ... many of which are rebuilding after Dorian ravaged them. I do hope Vernon is sill making pies on Elbow Cay ... it’s well worth the walk along the island to pick one up!

I have never visited St. Tomas, but a friend relocated there and loved it. Not sure how the Seabase program there operates.

 

[Eagledad]

I have not experienced with any of those HA's. Always wanted to, but they never made the list. However, I am big on going places where the scouts can experience the local people and culture, independently if possible. I have frequented all those locations with my kids, so I  have a little bit of a feel of where I would feel safe with scouts.

Bahamas is a beautiful place and the people are friendly. But, like St. Thomas, tourism drives the culture and that leads to a lot of in-your-face marketing for your dollars. It's pretty safe, but I wouldn't let the scouts go out on their own, And the constant atmosphere of seeking your money can wearing. I believe it has the highest crime of the three choices. I'm sure the outfitters at HA there can advise the best places to stay and enjoy the local culture safely.

As I said, St. Thomas is also tourist driven, but there is more of a diverse population that gives it a more international feel. The shopping in St. Thomas is less intense, and the town is old and interesting. The history is also interesting if you go on a tour. But, to get away from the hustle and bustle of tourist marketing, we like to go to St. Johns for a day on the beach. St. Johns is a small island only a short ferry ride away . I believe the beaches there are fine white sand surrounded by jungle. They are some of the most beautiful beaches in the Caribbean. Snorkeling is ok, but the beauty of the area and large beaches all worth it. The beaches haven't been over built with tourist marketing stuff, but still have good facilities for showers and food. After play time, the small town has several small restaurants that server good burgers and sea food. But, they are small tourist driven places that fill quickly, so I'm not sure how well they handle a large group. I would feel very safe in St. Johns with scouts. Don't miss the ferry going back.

Key West, is worth a one day visit because the town is fun to tour. It is the safest of the three, but I believe adults need to keep track of the scouts because parts of KW has bit of a bohemian atmosphere. The history there is very interesting and worth learning. I believe it was the richest city in the U.S. until the early 1920's. The snorkeling there is good, but the beaches are just so so compared to the other choices. It's a fun place to visit for one day. 

I don't know how the Seabase programs rate, and I think that is very important (most important). So, you have to balance those reviews with the locations and the cost of getting to those locations. 

You are going to have a great time.

Barry

 

 

[mashmaster]

We have done the sailing adventure out of Sea Base and it was fun.  Everyone had a great time.  Maybe we were lucky, we had zero problems with sea sickness.  We spent an afternoon in Fort Lauderdale at the beach on the afternoon before Sea Base then visited a gator farm and fan boat ride.  After leaving Sea Base and getting to the airport.   Pre-Covid, tit was easy and cheap to get flights to Fort Lauderdale and rent a big van for the week.