Eagle advisors - what questions do you ask to help the youth realize their Eagle projects proposals maybe needs more thought?

[MichelleIsAScout]

A scout is proposing to install pre-ordered supplies at their church. We don’t want to just say no; we want the youth to use their critical thinking skills to come to that conclusion. What questions do you ask?

 

so far we have:

Have you discussed this with your SM?

How do you plan on showing your leadership skills?

Any other questions you can help us with?  We want to compile a list to help us in the future with these. Thanks!

[MattR]

Welcome to the forum, @MichelleIsAScout.

If I read you correctly you're saying the church ordered some supplies independent of this scout and asked the scout to install them? Question number 1, is there much complexity in the installation? What does this involve? If this is something really simple then this isn't, in my view, an eagle project. If a scout is just providing labor then that's not leadership. Anyone can put out a flier, send some email, and get a half dozen scouts to show up. It might be a great service project but it doesn't involve leadership.

Usually when I see projects like this I try and find something else the scout can own and take care of. Figuring out how to make something work, taking a vague idea from the benefactor and turning it into a detailed project and leading that, doing some research as how to best do something. Any simple task, if it's scaled up, presents new challenges that will require leadership. The challenge for the adults is to help the scout find those types of things.

Hope that helps.

 

[Jameson76]

Ask them, How does this fulfill the requirements - While a Life Scout, plan, develop, and give leadership to others in a service project helpful to any religious institution, any school, or your community. (The project must benefit an organization other than the Boy Scouts of America.) A project proposal must be approved by the organization benefiting from the effort, your Scoutmaster and unit committee, and the council or district before you start. 

[Thunderbird]

I am not sure what you mean by "install pre-ordered supplies".  Depending on the answer, it might be considered "routine labor", which would not normally qualify as an Eagle service project.  Routine labor is described in the Eagle Scout service project workbook and also in the Guide to Advancement 9.0.2.11 Routine Labor.

Outside of that, I would recommend The Eagle Scout Service Project sections 9.0.2.0 - 9.0.2.16, which describes the process in detail.

[MichelleIsAScout]

Thank you. I am not the advisor, my spouse is. But he was stuck. Neither of us like saying no; we like coaching the youth to their own conclusions. We know this is not an Eagle project. It’s installing hand sanitizing stations. Four screws and done. 
 

We want the youth to come up with that conclusion though. 
 

thank you for the advise so far. Spouse has decided on his next move. The two questions he is asking now will be the start. 

[SSScout]

Who decided the "supplies" were needed? Did the Scout point out their being needed there?  Who developed the plan to raise the funds, order them,  collect the crew necessary to install them correctly? Who would have done this, if not by a Scout's efforts?   Perhaps the janitor?   

This is much different from a Scout noticing that a bridge over this particular muddy area on a well traveled park trail  might be a good addition, go to the park department, offer to plan, arrange, gather materials,  supervise the bridge construction and then get 'er done. 

 

[PACAN]

Commendable that you want the scout to come to his own conclusion.  First question "did you read through the entire workbook?"  since he is required to attest to that when he signs the Candidate's promise.   Page 4 would give him his answer on Routine Maintenance.   Your advisor answer to him is no.   Remember 9.0.2.3  A good test of any project is to evaluate its complexity. 

[PACAN]

So what happened with this ?

[fred8033]

Dang.  I responded to an old post.

 

On 5/29/2020 at 4:02 PM, Jameson76 said:

Ask them, How does this fulfill the requirements - While a Life Scout, plan, develop, and give leadership to others in a service project helpful to any religious institution, any school, or your community. (The project must benefit an organization other than the Boy Scouts of America.) A project proposal must be approved by the organization benefiting from the effort, your Scoutmaster and unit committee, and the council or district before you start. 

Correct.  When working with the scout, use the words the scout sees.  Use the GTA for your own education to interpret the words the scout sees.

Further, I'd parse the requirements

• Plan ... What does the scout need to plan?  Can the project be broken down into smaller steps that need to be coordinated?  Do multiple groups need to be coordinated?  
• Develop ... What does the scout have to solve?  Choosing where to install.  Purchasing.  Pricing.  Technical challenges.  
• Give leadership to others ... How is the scout the "leader" of this project?  This is beyond taking instructions from others and then repeating work instructions to a work crew.  

The requirements can also be summarized as how does the scout own the project?  How is he a driving force for the project?  How is this his project?

Edited June 30, 2020 by fred8033

[mashmaster]

I think it depends on the project. For my sons project for example, the first half of the project was making a trail which required mainly manual labor (chain saws (for adults), loping shears, rakes, shovels....), the second part for the building of the mountain bike jumps and features, my son came up with an estimated list of materials and the trail designer modified his list because he has domain specific knowledge of what is needed.  So IMHO, if the materials are not the key to the whole project it might be fine.

For example, if he was building and putting in a playground, it is totally reasonable to order a kit of materials for the equipment because the work is preparing and making the playground area.  If the area was already prepared and the project was order the kit and assemble it, I would say he probably needs to think about how his project could be expanded.