Good Press for BSA, Indirectly

[JoeBob]

Boy Scouts banned from planting American flags on veterans' graves for Memorial Day due to coronavirus

https://www.foxnews.com/us/boy-scouts-banned-memorial-day-coronavirus-veterans

At least we're trying to do the right thing.

[Eagledad]

It might be good press, but it also shows how Boy Scouts is viewed more as a youth after school program instead of a Community Service organization. We saw the same thing here in Oklahoma City recently after a tornado tore up the south part of town. Our council, which is accustom to organizing assistance was told to stay out by FEMA. I'm told it's a litigation issue. Scouts are still allowed to help in smaller towns, but it's a challenge in the bigger city. There are still ways the scouts can help, but it wasn't that long ago that we were considered an integral part in the community disaster relief.  

Beary

[Buggie]

One of the main reasons for not being allowed to help in the southern part of OKC tornado zones was the risk of hazardous chemicals within the tornado struck neighborhoods. My son's troop and church youth groups also attempted to volunteer, but were turned away for this reason. 

Imagine all the chemicals that folks keep under the sinks, in washrooms, garages etc. There's a danger that the disturbing of any rubble etc can cause damage containers to leak and mix creating toxic clouds. Not to mention the chemicals themselves. This is on top of the already dangerous environment of nails, broken glass, shards of whatever etc. 

Helping the groups outside the area were good, but there were so many adults already volunteering they were selected over the non-adults for their maturity alone. Whether they were actually mature is not the point. 😄

I remember back in the Moore Tornado of 1999 how teenagers were allowed to come in and assist in various ways, but I imagine lessons were learned there and in other tornado recovery sites that made these changes. 

[Rick_in_CA]

On 5/13/2020 at 1:45 PM, Eagledad said:

It might be good press, but it also shows how Boy Scouts is viewed more as a youth after school program instead of a Community Service organization. We saw the same thing here in Oklahoma City recently after a tornado tore up the south part of town. Our council, which is accustom to organizing assistance was told to stay out by FEMA. I'm told it's a litigation issue. Scouts are still allowed to help in smaller towns, but it's a challenge in the bigger city. There are still ways the scouts can help, but it wasn't that long ago that we were considered an integral part in the community disaster relief.  

Beary

I don't think this has anything to do with how Boy Scouts are viewed specifically, but how young people are viewed in general. You are correct, liability is a big part of it, but so is the extension of childhood. For too many people, "young adult" no longer referrers to 14,15, 16 year olds, but to 18, 19, 20 year olds. How many 13 year olds get gigs as babysitters now days? How many 13 year olds can't be left home alone without a babysitter themselves? How long before 18, 19 and 20 year olds are going to need "adult supervision"?

[Sentinel947]

5 minutes ago, Rick_in_CA said:

 How long before 18, 19 and 20 year olds are going to need "adult supervision"?

Isn't that effectively what college is becoming? Some would argue it's been that way for a while. 

Edited May 23, 2020 by Sentinel947

[Eagle94-A1]

6 minutes ago, Sentinel947 said:

Isn't that effectively what college is becoming? Some would argue it's been that way for a while. 

For those that think 18-25 year olds need adult supervision, I say tell it to these folks.

[qwazse]

8 hours ago, Sentinel947 said:

Isn't that effectively what college is becoming? Some would argue it's been that way for a while. 

If any good comes from this pandemic at the collegiate level, it will be the realization that that students don't need the community built by university to learn stuff. The have the community, they need the university to come teach them how to build it.

[InquisitiveScouter]

11 hours ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

For those that think 18-25 year olds need adult supervision, I say tell it to these folks.

 

Eagle94,

I agree that our young military personnel are having experiences which make them grow up much faster.  However, after 26 years on active duty, I can tell you the 18-25 year olds do need "adult" supervision.

As a squadron commander (normal first level in Air Force that has UCMJ authority) I spent a great deal of time handling legal and readiness issues for this age cohort.  Drugs/DUI/crimes/security violations/domestic issues/financial problems/mental health, etc.  Most "kids" entering the military are quite unprepared for the military culture.  Something that would be a minor offense in the civilian world (or no offense at all) can have serious consequences in the military.

The research is becoming clear that our brains are not fully formed until we are between 25 - 30...specifically some areas of the frontal cortex.

This area is the seat of executive function, responsible for processing what our actions should be in

1. Situations that involve planning or decision making
2. Situations that involve error correction or trouble shooting
3. Situations where responses are not well-rehearsed or contain novel sequences of actions
4. Dangerous or technically difficult situations
5. Situations that require overcoming strong habitual response or resisting temptation

^^^^^Sounds like Scouting to me...

Although I have not seen empirical evidence for this, I claim that Scouting is a "rehearsal" for those areas, and that, through having experiences in these areas at a younger age makes a young adult much more suited making good decisions in situations above.  This is why people want to hire Eagle Scouts, why they are given higher rank when entering the military, and why, in later life, they are usually more "productive" citizens.

Remember all the crazy stuff you did at this age?  It's a wonder I survived, even as an Eagle Scout

This is why I am involve in Scouting.  I want young people to have experiences in a relatively well-controlled environment which will help them develop before they hit those critical 18-25 years, where their decisions will have more significant consequences.

If you have the time, here is a good read https://www.rainbowrehab.com/executive-functioning/

 

 

Edited May 23, 2020 by InquisitiveScouter

[InquisitiveScouter]

And the second pic above is a special forces unit...SEAL, Delta, Green Beret???...average age for those groups is in the 30's

[MattR]

29 minutes ago, InquisitiveScouter said:

This area is the seat of executive function, responsible for processing what our actions should be in

1. Situations that involve planning or decision making
2. Situations that involve error correction or trouble shooting
3. Situations where responses are not well-rehearsed or contain novel sequences of actions
4. Dangerous or technically difficult situations
5. Situations that require overcoming strong habitual response or resisting temptation

^^^^^Sounds like Scouting to me...

I think this is exactly what makes scouting unique and useful. This is where the magic occurs and where the focus should be.

The challenge is keeping up the challenge for a range of abilities that change as scouts age. There's a big difference between what a 13 year old and a 16 year old can do. Pushing a program such that a 13 yo can complete eagle  leaves nothing for a 16 yo.

[InquisitiveScouter]

8 hours ago, MattR said:

Pushing a program such that a 13 yo can complete eagle  leaves nothing for a 16 yo.

Concur...

I've often thought there should be a lower age limit for Eagle Scout.

And there are many things for the 16 yo to do...High Adventure, Hornadays, National Medal for Outdoor Achievement, Supernova Awards (Scouts and Venturing...5 total), Congressional Award for Youth (up to Gold Medal) (although not a Scouting program), Summit, Religious Awards for particular faith...

[TAHAWK]

If the role of colleges and universities were education instead of social indoctrination, 

On 5/13/2020 at 3:47 PM, JoeBob said:

Boy Scouts banned from planting American flags on veterans' graves for Memorial Day due to coronavirus

https://www.foxnews.com/us/boy-scouts-banned-memorial-day-coronavirus-veterans

At least we're trying to do the right thing.

Typical Fox headline.  We planted 2000 flags on veteran's graves this morning.  The bureaucrats' ruling applied to the minority of veteran's graves that are on federal property.  We even have thirty-seven Revolutionary War vets buried here in NE Ohio.  After the flag-setting, at the last cemetery,  in our home township, came the reading of the Role of Honor as the bell tolled.

 

Today, Fox announced a manhunt for someone who is suspected of multiple "slays."

 

They need more high school graduates on staff.

[TAHAWK]

On 5/13/2020 at 4:45 PM, Eagledad said:

It might be good press, but it also shows how Boy Scouts is viewed more as a youth after school program instead of a Community Service organization. We saw the same thing here in Oklahoma City recently after a tornado tore up the south part of town. Our council, which is accustom to organizing assistance was told to stay out by FEMA. I'm told it's a litigation issue. Scouts are still allowed to help in smaller towns, but it's a challenge in the bigger city. There are still ways the scouts can help, but it wasn't that long ago that we were considered an integral part in the community disaster relief.  

Beary

Thirty-five years ago, an "F5" went down the main street of a small city to the SE of us, Newton Falls.  We were prohibited from distributing beverage and sandwiches to rescue personnel by the Red Cross. "Legal problems" were cited.  It has only gotten worse, with law schools churning out over twice as many lawyers as the economy can employ.

[jpb6583]

On 5/23/2020 at 8:01 AM, InquisitiveScouter said:

And the second pic above is a special forces unit...SEAL, Delta, Green Beret???...average age for those groups is in the 30's

That's a group of Navy SEALS. I'm pretty sure that no matter what the age of the member of those groups are, they are trained and matured enough to supervise themselves. Mostly. But you hit the nail on the head about the majority of kids entering the military.

Edited May 26, 2020 by jpb6583

[JoeBob]

5 hours ago, TAHAWK said:

Typical Fox headline.

Sorry Tahawk; check the date.  That headline on Fox was fully 2 weeks ago.  That Fox outrage is partially responsible for the changes that enabled all of us to plant the flags that were allowed.

Not that those underground would or could care.