Modified Requirements

[TMSM]

https://www.scouting.org/coronavirus/covid-19-faq/?fbclid=IwAR1Nbfkd2TbKIjlIS-SNGokCxJEyI37vCVuEtuL0F3CGJiuoCyGbAJlvt4o

 

Tenderfoot rank requirements 
1b. – Virtual patrol or troop campouts via video conferencing will be permitted.
2a. – During the same day as your virtual patrol or troop campout, assist in preparing one meal with the help of those with whom you live. Tell your patrol or troop why it was important for each person to share in meal preparation and cleanup. 
2b. – During the same day as your virtual campout, demonstrate the appropriate method of safely cleaning items used to prepare, serve and eat a meal. 
5a. – Explain the importance of the buddy system as it relates to your personal safety on outings and in your neighborhood. Verbally commit to following the buddy system on your next troop or patrol outing. 
7a. – Tell how to display, raise, lower, and fold the U.S. flag. 
Second Class rank requirements:
1a & 1c. – Virtual patrol or troop activities via video conferencing will be permitted. 
3b. – Using a compass and map together, plan a 5-mile hike approved by your adult leader.
4. – Evidence of wild animals can be demonstrated with information or photos of your local area found online.
5c. – May be completed virtually via video conferencing on dry land. 
7c. – Learn about the dangers of using drugs, alcohol and tobacco and other practices that could be harmful to your health. Discuss what you learned with your family and explain the dangers of substance addictions. Report to your Scoutmaster or other adult leader in your troop about which parts of the Scout Oath and Scout Law relate to what you learned. 
8a. – May be completed virtually using video conferencing.
8d. – May be completed by comparing costs at three (3) online sites or locations. 
First Class rank requirements:
1a – Virtual patrol or troop activities via video conferencing will be permitted. 
2e. – On the same day as your virtual campout, serve as the cook. Supervise your assistant(s) in using a stove or building a cooking fire. Prepare the breakfast, lunch, and dinner planned in First Class requirement 2a. Supervise the cleanup. 
4a. – By drawing, computer software, or other virtual methods, plan an orienteering course that would cover at least one mile. Explain why measuring the height and/or width of designated items (tree, tower, canyon, ditch, etc.) is helpful. Explain how you would complete your course using a real map and compass.
4b. – Scouts do not need to follow their route.
5a. – Evidence of native plants can be demonstrated with information or photos of your local area found online.
6e. – May be completed on dry land.
9a. – Visit may take place virtually or by phone.
9c. – Outings can include past or future plans. 
10. – Invite the potential new member to a virtual meeting or future activity using video conferencing. 

 

[TMSM]

I don't think I am ready to pull the trigger on these yet. My question is do I have to allow these? There are plenty of other requirements to do but if a scout who hates hiking sees this he may choose to do a 5 miles hike plan vs actually doing the hike. FYI - we can still hike in our area.

[Eagledad]

27 minutes ago, TMSM said:

I don't think I am ready to pull the trigger on these yet. My question is do I have to allow these? There are plenty of other requirements to do but if a scout who hates hiking sees this he may choose to do a 5 miles hike plan vs actually doing the hike. FYI - we can still hike in our area.

I agree. First Class is not just a rank, it is a declaration of level of skills to safely camp in the woods without assistance. Can a person develop that level of skills without practicing those skills while camping as a patrol? Surely, there is hope that life will get back to normal and the patrol will again camp together. If not, then scouting needs to start over and redefine first class skills. 

I'm not even sure virtual fits in the scouting program.

Barry

Edited April 14, 2020 by Eagledad

[Eagle94-A1]

My understanding is we have to allow it.

What i find ironic is that they first stated camping requirements would not be altered,  yhen the next thing they do is alter the requirements. 

Edited:

INTERESTING.  I went to the link posted, AND IT IS DIFFERENT THAN THE ONE I  READ YESTERDAY MORNING! (emphasis) The one originally posted not only contradicted itself, but also did not post the exact requirements altered.

 

And did anyone note that these modified requirements are in effect to August or September? 

Edited April 14, 2020 by Eagle94-A1

[Eagledad]

26 minutes ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

My understanding is we have to allow it.

What i find ironic is that they first stated camping requirements would not be altered,  yhen the next thing they do is alter the requirements. 

Edited:

INTERESTING.  I went to the link posted, AND IT IS DIFFERENT THAN THE ONE I  READ YESTERDAY MORNING! (emphasis) The one originally posted not only contradicted itself, but also did not post the exact requirements altered.

 

And did anyone note that these modified requirements are in effect to August or September? 

It's another example of inept organization management.

Barry

[Cburkhardt]

Our relativily young Troop would be at an advancement standstill without this type of temporary remedy.  After hearing the “no exceptions for anything” announcement, I was among many Scoutmasters who urged some accommodations.  This is a balanced approach.  Without it I would be telling some Scouts that they will just have to wait half a year and that is too long for a child.  

I have no doubt whatsoever that our Scoutmaster staff will be able to assure the mastery of these skills when we resume Troop campouts in September (I believe we will continue a complete shutdown of the entire BSA until then).  Keeping interest and membership in a high-performing Troop requires movement and this allows for it.  It is a humane answer to requests from our Scouts.  This action shows we are an organization that is willing to adapt and can respond quickly.

[TMSM]

27 minutes ago, Cburkhardt said:

I have no doubt whatsoever that our Scoutmaster staff will be able to assure the mastery of these skills when we resume Troop campouts in September

I understand how this fits your needs for the vision of your troop. 

I am actually thinking of calling it quits as SM. In my opinion campouts are not reallly about sleeping a tent, a 5 mile hike is meant to teach compass skills in the field, evidence of plants or anmals is to get the boys out into the wild and to explore. These real experiences are what I thought taught citizenship, how to help others and how to explore the world. I see no reason to hurry these requirements as if they will miss out being a certain rank - I see more value in waiting 6 months and scouts learning the value of waiting. My scouts are not into getting ranked up but more into hands on skill learning. I really feel like I misinterpreted something along the way and maybe should just move on.

 

[qwazse]

I do favor the scout using his/her family as a surrogate patrol. The challenge is looping in the PL, TG, and SPL.

I don't know about your scouts, but the academic program has not let up for mine. In some ways it's harder.

Note: evidence of wild animals should include recordings of bird songs and calls of other beasts. A scout could report smells as well.

But this all amounts to a 3 month delay. I don't see it weighing on our younger scouts all that much.

[Eagledad]

21 minutes ago, Cburkhardt said:

Our relativily young Troop would be at an advancement standstill without this type of temporary remedy.  After hearing the “no exceptions for anything” announcement, I was among many Scoutmasters who urged some accommodations.  This is a balanced approach.  Without it I would be telling some Scouts that they will just have to wait half a year and that is too long for a child.  

Yes, I know. This is not the first time my reverence for skills comes in conflict with those who have a demand for advancement. I'm not sure where the balance is determined, but I am sure that is dependent on the different Scoutmasters. 

Waiting? Waiting for what? A badge? If you were to suggest ways for scouts to learn and practice skills for the purpose of fun, your noble suggestion might have more following. I might at least read with interest. But, accelerating advancement for the sake of advancement is not a principled motivation in scouting.

I could easily see the patrol videoing (Zooming?)  together for learning how to build a fire, and then practicing what they learned in their fireplace or back yard barbecue with an observing consenting adult. But, that shouldn't credited to signing off a requirement, just practice for the next patrol adventure.

How to keep the passion of the scouting flame lit it more about fun than knocking off a few requirements. 

Barry

[qwazse]

2 minutes ago, TMSM said:

... I am actually thinking of calling it quits as SM. ...

If it's a choice between ditching the SM and ditching ad hoc requirements, I'd hold on to the SM. Nothing is saying you have to tell scouts about any of this. I certainly haven't. In fact, here is exactly what I said to them (via E-mail with gratitude from our CC) ...

Quote

I also wanted to let you know that we're all still trying to help you grow as scouts.This involves a couple of areas:

• Adult association
  • We adults are here for you. Yes, many of us are essential and are working long and complicated hours. But, we also want to hear from you.
  • Scoutmaster conferences aren't just for advancement, they can be simply to touch base and talk about goals.
  • Send Mr. _, Mr. _, and Mr. _ an E-mail. Be sure to copy your parents so they know what you're thinking.
• Outdoors
  • It's obvious that large troop-wide activities are off the table. Even a patrol hike puts together too many people, and someone's parent/grandparent might be hurt. But ...
  • Get out, walk around the block, tidy the lawn, etc ... Shout a friendly hello to your neighbors. Step out on every clear evening and count the stars. Step out on the rainy ones and catch a few droplets.
  • A stranger on the internet reminded me that this is a perfect time of year to start bird study.
• Advancement
  • A couple of us are keeping track of BSA's announcements about managing rank advancement during this time. There's a lot to digest. Here's a thumbnail:
  • If you are Life rank and turning 18 soon, and the lock-down has disrupted your project or that last Merit Badge for Eagle, BSA is allowing scouts to apply for an extension, but there's paperwork ... talk to Mr. ___ ASAP if this concerns you.
  • If you started a merit badge, counselors may now register your work in Scoutbook; however, like all things new and digital, not all counselors know how to do this. Don't worry, do the work, let us know, we'll sort out the paperwork.
  • Hey, cross-overs! Read your handbook! I first learned my knots using my handbook and some rope from our garage. You can do that and more!
• Patrols
  • Lord willing, this will pass and all-of-a-sudden there's summer camp.
  • Troop ___ has some sharp patrols. But it takes time together to stay sharp.
  • Scouts around the country and world are video conferencing with their patrols online. You can too.
  • If you've never tried google hangouts, Have your parents help you check it out, and get in a quick chat with your friends.

And there are more ideas popping up every week. But don't take my word for it. Check out https://www.scouting.org/scoutingathome/ and https://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2020/04/10/scout-saturday-live-just-one-example-of-bsa-councils-offering-quality-quarantine-programming/.

 

Until we can hit the trails together again,

Feel free to adapt to the tone you'd like to set.

Remember, smiles are our paycheck.

[HashTagScouts]

Before the BSA put this out, we had discussion on some ways of being flexible- parent filming the Scout on a cell phone as they built a fire in the backyard, learning knots via animated knots and then demonstrating it on a Zoom conference, taking a hike with a parent in an open area and using cell phone to capture pics of plants/animal signs.  Also we agreed that family members could be surrogate patrol members for cooking requirements.Those I could get down with.  Not actually having to navigate or truly demonstrate I am not down with.  The concept of "they'll learn it later on, after the rank has been awarded" is going too far.  There's no reason to rush for most of these kids.  Do enough to keep interested and connected, but no reason to be tossing the outdoor requirements out the window.

[malraux]

I can see some value in getting youth to at least the tenderfoot rank via online activities. Lots of webelos moving to the troop are sitting at a standstill from all this right now. Getting at least that first real rank will help keep them invested. 

[qwazse]

28 minutes ago, HashTagScouts said:

... Not actually having to navigate or truly demonstrate I am not down with.  ...

Planning and navigating a hike with your surrogate patrol would be well within the grasp of most scouts and their communities.

If one of us were not essential at this time, I would have planned and sent an "Easter Egg" hunt. Colored chalk eggs would be drawn on boulders and walls throughout the neighborhood trails and parks. Using CalTopo (a free dot-com product), I'd drop pins at some of the locations. Objective: before the next rain, with a member of your surrogate patrol, navigate to the pin and take a selfie of yourself with the egg in the background.

Same thing could be done with a five mile hike, only there the scout would write a plan and send it to you for approval.

Parents' can't hike? A car ride to some interesting (but often overlooked and rarely visited) locations could work. You need the parent who would follow the scout's directions to the letter (except for running stoplights, etc ... ).

The one activity that I think is definitely "off the table" for now would be swimming. Unless a scout has a family of guards and a private location it's off the table. My family has the personnel and safety gear, but ain't nobody going swimming until Memorial Day, when we tell that Great Lake that it can warm up for summer.

[Eagledad]

59 minutes ago, malraux said:

I can see some value in getting youth to at least the tenderfoot rank via online activities. Lots of webelos moving to the troop are sitting at a standstill from all this right now. Getting at least that first real rank will help keep them invested. 

I'm just not seeing it. Oh, I can understand an adult thinking  wearing a badge is the coolest thing ever, but were you a scout as a youth? Given a choice of going to school or going to play soccer, what would more likely keep the a youth invested?

So, let's see, Requirment 1b. Spend at least one night on a patrol or troop campout. Sleep in a tent you have helped pitch. Do we really want to sigh off on 1b without the scout doing it? How about, picking up a troop tent and dropping it off at the scout's house so he/she can practice setting it up. It doesn't get the sign off, but it does get them invested. And it's fun. Who knows, maybe several scouts can have a tent pitching race with a phone start.

Barry

[Eagle94-A1]

2 hours ago, qwazse said:

I do favor the scout using his/her family as a surrogate patrol.

Sorry, no. Families are not surrogate patrols. Not only in my last troop, but in other troops throughout the years,  I have seen parents try and take over signing stuff for their Scout.  Newly crossed over Cub Scout parents are bad at it, but the worst are the former Cub Scout leaders. They are indoctrinated to be in charge as Cub Scout leaders, that they forget they have to let go as Scouters. Even I had difficulties at times I see a lot of Tenderfoot through First Class  BORs in the future, and the Scouts will be clueless when it comes to the outdoors.

 

3 hours ago, Cburkhardt said:

Our relativily young Troop would be at an advancement standstill without this type of temporary remedy.  After hearing the “no exceptions for anything” announcement, I was among many Scoutmasters who urged some accommodations.  This is a balanced approach.  Without it I would be telling some Scouts that they will just have to wait half a year and that is too long for a child.  

I assume you are a big fan of FIRST CLASS: FIRST YEAR? You do know that the 1980s data that developed this plan is skewed right? First and foremost,. it was heavily influenced by LDS troops which kept their 11 years olds separate from everyone else. The other factor is that it did not take into how active troops were. The more active the troop is, the more Scouts want to stay in.

I give you an example, with the exception of December and February, until COVID-19 came along, we camped every month. December is a service project and Christmas party, and February is Scouting for Food (2 weekends), Scout Sunday, and court of honor. Yet half the kids who have been a year or longer are Second Class or lower. They are staying because the program is  fun.

 

I want to add, I think this is setting a precedent that will cause issues in the future. I am willing to bet people wil want this to become the norm, not the exception.