Are your Resident Camps/Summer Camps opening?

[Eagle94-A1]

Well it's not posted on the summer camp page yet, but my council is cancelling 2020 summer camp and moving to virtual summer camp.

Even if summer camp does open up and the updated research does show that COVID-19 was here earlier than January (first US COVID-19 death is now determined to be February 6 after a post mortem was conducted)  and not as lethal as initially believed,  we have at least 2 families that will not be sending Scouts to camp due to immuno-compromised family members. That's 1/3 of the troop not going right there.

Don't know what the plan B for the troop will be. I know my family is considering a backpacking trek. You know you got a keeper when the wife likes to camp. Now we got to determine who uses what pack since youngest son stole hers.

[yknot]

In our multi state region, many camps have already cancelled for the summer. I think it's going to be a very regional decision.

I would also say that if anything has become obvious about this virus over the past three or so months, it is that we really don't know much about it or how it behaves. It's far more contagious than initially thought, spread possibly even while simply speaking, and its symptoms are far more varied. Temperature checks are a helpful but not really effective screen because the data is showing many infected people don't present with fever. In a large percentage of cases, for example, it presents as GI issues. The point of this is that it is going to be very hard to manage, especially as parts of the country attempt to come back online. Even if camps attempt to open, I expect we'll see a lot of them have to close back down. I personally won't be sending my kids outside of their social cohort this summer. If they camp, they will camp local with the same kids who they will also hopefully be seeing in school this fall. There are plenty of local options. Not as exciting maybe, but child care can be achieved. 

[5thGenTexan]

1 hour ago, yknot said:

In our multi state region, many camps have already cancelled for the summer. I think it's going to be a very regional decision.

I would also say that if anything has become obvious about this virus over the past three or so months, it is that we really don't know much about it or how it behaves. It's far more contagious than initially thought, spread possibly even while simply speaking, and its symptoms are far more varied. Temperature checks are a helpful but not really effective screen because the data is showing many infected people don't present with fever. In a large percentage of cases, for example, it presents as GI issues. The point of this is that it is going to be very hard to manage, especially as parts of the country attempt to come back online. Even if camps attempt to open, I expect we'll see a lot of them have to close back down. I personally won't be sending my kids outside of their social cohort this summer. If they camp, they will camp local with the same kids who they will also hopefully be seeing in school this fall. There are plenty of local options. Not as exciting maybe, but child care can be achieved. 

We (my son and I) have Webelos resident camp the first week of June.  It will be kids/parents from all over the DFW metroplex.  Right now I am 95% leaning toward not going.  They are going to be doing temp checks and sitting 6 people to a table in the dining hall instead of 10.  🙄

[MattR]

3 hours ago, 5thGenTexan said:

We (my son and I) have Webelos resident camp the first week of June.  It will be kids/parents from all over the DFW metroplex.  Right now I am 95% leaning toward not going.  They are going to be doing temp checks and sitting 6 people to a table in the dining hall instead of 10.  🙄

I hope the SM's with the stereotypical SM gut stay home. That's just one more underlying condition.

BTW, what will they do if they find someone with a high temperature? By that point they've already been spreading the virus for 2 days.

[ItsBrian]

24 minutes ago, MattR said:

I hope the SM's with the stereotypical SM gut stay home. That's just one more underlying condition.

BTW, what will they do if they find someone with a high temperature? By that point they've already been spreading the virus for 2 days.

I think he means at check in. I know my camp is suppose to be doing temp checks/med checks as the first stop on Sunday. 

[5thGenTexan]

1 hour ago, MattR said:

I hope the SM's with the stereotypical SM gut stay home. That's just one more underlying condition.

BTW, what will they do if they find someone with a high temperature? By that point they've already been spreading the virus for 2 days.

Remember, I am talking Webelos, followed by Cub Resident Camp.  All Scouts will have a parent/grandparent/whatever with them   Scouts carrying the food for their entire table back to the table.  People touching water jugs all day to fill their bottles.  

Yes, temp checks at check-in I am assuming.  But that is useless for people that are asymptomatic and spreading cooties all over for the session

[5thGenTexan]

I was thinking today... I really wish National would make the unpopular call to cancel all camps for this Summer.  Let us start small and get back to having meetings first, preferably outside and by Den or Patrol.  Let us camp on our own this Summer and stay away from other people.  I know it sucks for people counting on the big shebangs, but that is just the way it has to be sometimes.

[Sentinel947]

2 minutes ago, 5thGenTexan said:

I was thinking today... I really wish National would make the unpopular call to cancel all camps for this Summer.  Let us start small and get back to having meetings first, preferably outside and by Den or Patrol.  Let us camp on our own this Summer and stay away from other people.  I know it sucks for people counting on the big shebangs, but that is just the way it has to be sometimes.

Yea, that's a tough call. Has some big impacts on a range of people. Probably in the next week or two they'll need to make that decision. @RememberSchiff had a great post, that I'm going to shamelessly turn into a Scoutmaster minute if I needed.

This would not be the first time in the history of Scouting that there has been a disease outbreak that closed camps. 

[fred8033]

On 4/25/2020 at 9:53 AM, Eagle94-A1 said:

.... moving to virtual summer camp.

I keep flip-flopping.  I celebrate finding a way to keep scouts involved in scouting.  I celebrate finding a way to distract scouts during this stressful time.  On the flip side, virtual camp outs are just not the same thing.  I have a real hard time figuring where to position on this.  Is it possible we will end up with Eagle scouts who only camped in their own back yard ?  But then again, maybe that is an acceptable reflection of today.  

[ItsBrian]

I’ve been reading that many camps will be making a decision around May 15th, my camp included. 
 

We will see!

[5thGenTexan]

2 hours ago, ItsBrian said:

I’ve been reading that many camps will be making a decision around May 15th, my camp included. 
 

We will see!

Texas Gov pretty much told the state to go do your thing today.  About May 15 we may be seeing a nice big spike in cases.

[ItsBrian]

Just now, 5thGenTexan said:

Texas Gov pretty much told the state to go do your thing today.  About May 15 we may be seeing a nice big spike in cases.

Interesting. I feel around Memorial Day there will be spikes as well. I can’t see camps opening around me for the summer currently.

[Jackdaws]

If National makes an official cancelation for this summer, that's 2 of out the last 3 years of nothing at Philmont.  That could pretty bad debt accumulation for them. 

I am really on the fence on whether our troop should go to summer camp in Georgia if its open.  We have a couple scouts with health issues already.  My son has a heart defect and couple boys with asthma.   We are exploring the option of trying to book a week somewhere to camp on our own and try to do some activities.  We know it will be a massive undertaking and its hot as all get out here in Florida (one of the main reasons we don't go to our council home camp) so we would need to make sure we have somewhere that will be able to accommodate what we are looking for.  

I am wondering if councils if there is a delayed camp will maybe try to do some weekend or 3 day activities in small groups to get those scouts a chance to do the practical portion of some badges. 

[yknot]

I just don't see how camps and especially HA will be able to run this year. The only things that work right now are social distancing, masks, and hygiene. Temperature checks are really not that useful because a significant percentage of people do not ever develop fevers or only do so long after they have already been contagious. The symptoms we are learning are also increasingly variable far beyond a cough, fever, or sore throat. The CDC recently expanded the symptom list, but it still does not include GI symptoms which appear in many cases. Other nonspecific symptoms include skin rashes, pink eye, and neurologic signs. I am really not sure how a camp health officer will be able to do surveillance on all that and how you would be able to tell a case of routine stomach bug from a possible Covid symptom. If I were running camps, I would try to preserve the main point of summer camp -- getting kids camping outside -- by forgoing some of the other traditional camp aspects. I would have troops forget about splitting up for merit badges, etc., and instead have them experience a shortened camp week if necessary in troop pods. Troops can hike together, boat together, shoot together, etc., assisted by staff with sanitizing between each group.  I would cut the census by giving each Troop a half week. Meals would be delivered to the camp site by staff to avoid dining hall issues. Easy enough to set up a camp site fly to have a meal space for each local troop pod.  I think to have any semblance of safety this summer you have to change the way you view the camp experience. 

 

   

[Jackdaws]

16 minutes ago, yknot said:

I just don't see how camps and especially HA will be able to run this year. The only things that work right now are social distancing, masks, and hygiene. Temperature checks are really not that useful because a significant percentage of people do not ever develop fevers or only do so long after they have already been contagious. The symptoms we are learning are also increasingly variable far beyond a cough, fever, or sore throat. The CDC recently expanded the symptom list, but it still does not include GI symptoms which appear in many cases. Other nonspecific symptoms include skin rashes, pink eye, and neurologic signs. I am really not sure how a camp health officer will be able to do surveillance on all that and how you would be able to tell a case of routine stomach bug from a possible Covid symptom. If I were running camps, I would try to preserve the main point of summer camp -- getting kids camping outside -- by forgoing some of the other traditional camp aspects. I would have troops forget about splitting up for merit badges, etc., and instead have them experience a shortened camp week if necessary in troop pods. Troops can hike together, boat together, shoot together, etc., assisted by staff with sanitizing between each group.  I would cut the census by giving each Troop a half week. Meals would be delivered to the camp site by staff to avoid dining hall issues. Easy enough to set up a camp site fly to have a meal space for each local troop pod.  I think to have any semblance of safety this summer you have to change the way you view the camp experience. 

 

   

In troops with a varied age range and rank range this maybe a challenge.   Not all first year scouts have the swimming badge thus they can't do the water sports and Star and Life scouts aren't going to sit around and do those what many consider first year badges like First Aid. So keeping them together may not be the best.  Several of our older scouts usually opt for the extreme challenges at camp as they have already been there and got the badge for it on the other classes.