Does mb counselor status expire?

[christineka]

As background, my son just celebrated his 13th birthday.  We're LDS, we live in Utah.  I'm sure you all know that the LDS church dropped the scouting program at the end of 2019.  My son joined a new community troop in the fall.  I have asked for my son's records.  I was promised they'd get them to me.  A couple months have passed and I've been doing some investigations of my own.  (Looked on scoutbook, asked the scout leader, called council) and it appears that there aren't any records.  My son does have a scout book, but was never instructed to bring it, nor was there ever any announcement of when they were doing advancement interviews (or whatever it's called).  Council is really nice and has entered the date of the one and only non-Eagle Court of Honor as the date of achieving all ranks up to 1st class and the first aid merit badge.  My son also earned personal management.  Since he had to email the financial tracking sheet to the counselor, I still had that email handy.  I emailed the counselor asking if he would sign a blue card for my son.  He says that since the church didn't recharter, he's now expired and can't sign the card.  Is it true that merit badge counselors expire?  I am a merit badge counselor and haven't been sent any emails telling me that I have to re-register.  I do keep up with youth protection.  If this merit badge counselor is expired, what can we do (other than redo the badge) to get a current counselor to sign the card?  I was told our troop would have a last court of honor (the previous one was held in May 2019), but I guess my family is the only one that cares about my boys being awarded the badges they earned.  (I have an older son, too.)   

[malraux]

Yes, everyone has to recharter/renew every year. It would be nice if there were a better way to do that.

The new troop should have the list of current merit badge counselors. I would think that most MBC would accept previous work, especially in being understanding of the turmoil you're experience because of the shakeup.

Your son should talk with the scoutmaster about fixing this.

[scoutldr]

Merit Badge counselors (MBC) should be properly registered at the District level.  It is not a troop level position.  If a troop does not recharter, it should not affect their registration.  They also need to keep their Youth Protection training current.  Your son's SM should be able to get a list of currently registered and approved MBC from the District Advancement Committee.  These are the ONLY people who should be signing off on blue cards.

[ParkMan]

15 minutes ago, malraux said:

Yes, everyone has to recharter/renew every year. It would be nice if there were a better way to do that.

It would be desirable in my.scouting.org to see your registration status and items needed for re-registration.  

Imagine if... 

• you could go in, see that you needed to re-do YPT and it has a needs to be done by date. 
• if you needed MBC training, it had the link to the training.
• If there were other forms needed - such as a local council MBC form - it would be available there online, you could fill it in live, and then hit submit.  The form would go to the correct district/council person who would receive it and hit accept.
• A district person could see the list of people online and see current status
• A unit key three member could see the list of MBC for the district.

If only we possessed the technology in our society to do things like that.  Ahh, but even if we did I'm sure it would be more cost effective for us to do this all by paper and having people chase forms.

[christineka]

2 hours ago, ParkMan said:

It would be desirable in my.scouting.org to see your registration status and items needed for re-registration.  

Imagine if... 

• you could go in, see that you needed to re-do YPT and it has a needs to be done by date. 
• if you needed MBC training, it had the link to the training.
• If there were other forms needed - such as a local council MBC form - it would be available there online, you could fill it in live, and then hit submit.  The form would go to the correct district/council person who would receive it and hit accept.
• A district person could see the list of people online and see current status
• A unit key three member could see the list of MBC for the district.

If only we possessed the technology in our society to do things like that.  Ahh, but even if we did I'm sure it would be more cost effective for us to do this all by paper and having people chase forms.

I need this in my life!  I can't keep track of when I fill out forms that aren't online!  I re-registered in bsa in early fall when the new troop became official.  I'm sure the merit badge counselor paper I filled out was turned in over a year ago.  No one told me I had to redo that on an annual basis.

I have a new question, though.  Since my son completed the merit badge in the middle of last year (and I have record of turning in the last requirement because it was emailed), can the man, who was merit badge counselor, sign the card and date it for last year?  The badge was passed off.

[T2Eagle]

Here' a quick tutorial about how advancement should get recorded for a scout.  The scout completes a rank and the troop submits a report, electronic or paper, to the council, and that rank is attached to the scout's member ID in the council/national database.  BSA computer systems are not particularly modern or well built and so it's hard to be more precise than this in a description.  Similarly, a scout completes a merit badge and (hopefully) turns in a blue card to his troop and the troop again records that through the council.

In direct answer to your question, the original merit badge counselor could certainly retroactively sign a blue card even though he is not currently registered.  The blue card itself has a line to indicate the date completed.  The merit badge counselor should sign the card and your son should then turn it in to his current troop for proper recording.

To the question of whether merit badge counselor status expires.  There are two registration requirements to be a merit badge counselor,  you need to be a registered scouter and you need to be registered as a merit badge counselor with your District or Council.  Some people are primarily registered as part of a troop and are then additionally, or in the parlance "multiple" registered as merit badge counselors.  Some folks are primarily registered as merit badge counselors and not directly affiliated with any specific troop.  Either way that registration or membership needs to be renewed each year either through the troop rechartering process or through the District/Council rechartering process.  

Good luck with helping your sons get their record keeping straightened out, and glad to see you stayed aboard.  Out of curiosity, what motivated your son to stick with the program, and why do you think most of his fellow LDS scouts did not?

[qwazse]

1 hour ago, christineka said:

I need this in my life!  I can't keep track of when I fill out forms that aren't online!  I re-registered in bsa in early fall when the new troop became official.  I'm sure the merit badge counselor paper I filled out was turned in over a year ago.  No one told me I had to redo that on an annual basis.

I have a new question, though.  Since my son completed the merit badge in the middle of last year (and I have record of turning in the last requirement because it was emailed), can the man, who was merit badge counselor, sign the card and date it for last year?  The badge was passed off.

This is new territory for all of us. Never before in the history of scouting have MBC's been tracked so regularly,  never before in the history of scouting has there been so many points of failure in the registration process, and never before as there been such a mass exodus of COs.

So, if the first MBC signed the card, even with today's date, no scouter in their right mind would speak against the scout's completed application. But, supposing the MBC is still not comfortable signing ... any other MBC would probably accept the scout's previous work if the scout can explain and discuss everything. It will be an hour that you'll never get back, but meeting another caring adult will hopefully make up the difference.

[christineka]

1 hour ago, T2Eagle said:

1 hour ago, T2Eagle said:

 

Good luck with helping your sons get their record keeping straightened out, and glad to see you stayed aboard.  Out of curiosity, what motivated your son to stick with the program, and why do you think most of his fellow LDS scouts did not?

I didn't ask my son.  I just signed him and the older one up.  The younger needs social interaction in his life, goals to work toward, and things to do.  Also my brothers were eagle scouts and I think it's a good program.  The sentiment I hear among the church members here is that bsa is bad and they've ruined it with letting in girls and others.  (I have 5 daughters and am not afraid of girls or even differently gendered people.)  

 

[The Latin Scot]

As a fellow LDS Scouter, I empathize with your confusion and challenges, and have dealt with many similar issues myself over the past year. Some thoughts:

- It's never too late to ask a MBC to sign a blue card unless the Scout is 18 and past age; if the counselor is willing, he or she may sign for any work that has been completed - the only 'expiration date' is the 18th birthday, not the end of the year.

- In my council, LDS records are being maintained until early March, so you may want to check with your council to see if your troop is still on record so changes can be made if needed. Most important thing to remember: if it's in your book, it will be accepted - even if that means hunting down your Scoutmaster and getting him to sign for work you know has already been completed, regardless of whether he has a new calling or not. Talk with the brother who served as Scoutmaster and see if you can get him to retroactively sign for work you know your son has completed.

1 hour ago, qwazse said:

So, if the first MBC signed the card, even with today's date, no scouter in their right mind would speak against the scout's completed application. But, supposing the MBC is still not comfortable signing ... any other MBC would probably accept the scout's previous work if the scout can explain and discuss everything. It will be an hour that you'll never get back, but meeting another caring adult will hopefully make up the difference.

This is sound counsel; it's going to be annoying going to so many people to get past work signed, but fortunately most people will be understanding of what you're going through - especially in your area, where most everybody is going through the exact same thing.

- The transition from an LDS unit to a traditional unit is tough; I am the Unit Commissioner for a newly formed LDS troop and there is a LOT of confusion between the way Scouting is supposed to happen verses the "false traditions of our fathers." I recommend you study up on Scouting online (there are many wonderful resources, especially this website!), and ask as many questions as you can, not only here, but also to your district and professional leaders. And if you have other questions, feel free to send me a PM and I'll be happy to answer and point you towards any resources that might help you and your sons continue on your Scouting journey!

[SSScout]

The confusion with the old LDS program versus the "regular" BSA program is unfortunate. Merit Badges....

Hereabouts, once a person fills in the four pieces of paper, including having completed the YPT, and the Personal Record Permission , they are listed with the District Dean of Merit Badge Counselors. This list is correlated with the Council, and that is that.  Scout needs a MBCounselor?  Check with District Dean.   If the MBC counsels ONE Scout in a year, they are kept on the active list.  If no Scouts in the past year, chances are good they'll be kept "active"  anyway. 

A few years back, Council purged all lists and required ALL MBCs  to sign up all over again, fresh from the word Go.  Mass hysteria and confusion ensued, as one might expect. But it got done and everyone was YPT'd and signed, sealed and delivered, so to speak.  

Lost Blue Cards are not unusual.  Recreating them is tough but doable.  

If the Scout is having a good time, and sees his/her time in Scouts as worthwhile (and you do too?),  that's what we're here for.   

 

Edited February 24, 2020 by SSScout