Chapter 11 announced

[CynicalScouter]

22 minutes ago, MattR said:

I made my scouts dance for lost items.

Something Guide to Safe Scouting now explicitly prohibits.

Edited March 13, 2021 by CynicalScouter

[CynicalScouter]

52 minutes ago, SilverPalm said:

This same Scoutmaster, during his tenure, instituted a program where any Scout who left an item behind at a campground - a waterbottle, perhaps, or a pocketknife - would then have to stand up in front of the troop and sing a song to reclaim his item

Something Guide to Safe Scouting explicitly prohibits.

See also Reminder: Singing for a lost item is bullying - Bryan on Scouting

[SilverPalm]

Good.  As it should be, IMO.  I saw too many Scouts react negatively to it.

[FaithfulScouter]

9 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said:

We've told out troop parents this weekend to expect BSA to be shut down this summer. Lot of disappointment and sadness, but that's where we are at.

I'm a realist and I respect your perspective.  We're not being told ANYTHING like that in our Council.

Our Council building, which is owned free and clear, is now being put up for sale in order for our Council to pay their portion of the settlement.  Our President made a short presentation when announcing the sale and overall it was positive in nature, with no hint of the Council and/or National not being able to survive all of the litigation.

[CynicalScouter]

4 hours ago, vol_scouter said:

Summer camps are core to the mission of Scouting. 

Lots of Councils don't have summer camps.

My Council lost its camp years ago due to financial mismanagement.

Any LC that tries to shield its camp with "but it's a core function!" will have those Councils without camps thrown back in their face.

Edited March 13, 2021 by CynicalScouter

[Eagle1993]

26 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said:

That's true for any business in a Chapter 11, not just a not-for-profit. The company (or not for profit) must retain enough of an operating business model to be able to survive post-bankruptcy/Chapter 11.

I question that in this case.  If the claimants continue to vote against the offer they can essentially force the BSA to part with core assets. They only way out is the judge enforcing a cram down but when has that every happened with a sexual abuse bankruptcy?

[CynicalScouter]

5 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said:

I question that in this case.  If the claimants continue to vote against the offer they can essentially force the BSA to part with core assets. They only way out is the judge enforcing a cram down but when has that every happened with a sexual abuse bankruptcy?

There's nothing to question. It is black letter: if this is a Chapter 11 plan, the plan must be such that the company continues operations post-emergence.

And if claimants continue to vote against the offer and BSA insists it simply cannot part with (INSERT NAME OF ASSET HERE) then either:

1) The judge orders a cramdown, in effect overruling the claimants. Regarding sexual abuse? That has NEVER, EVER happened. No federal judge is going to order it, or rather, the odds of it happen are so infinitesimal as to be effectively zero.

2) The bankruptcy fails and the company (or in this case BSA) comes out of bankruptcy with no restructuring plan. BSA would go back to the position it was in prior to the bankruptcy filing, circa February 2020.

3) The bankruptcy converts to Chapter 7 liquidation. Since a not for profit cannot be FORCED either by creditors or the judge into Chapter 7, BSA would have to volunteer for liquidation.

[Eagle1993]

21 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said:

My Council lost its camp years ago due to financial mismanagement.

My council also does not have a summer camp. They should, but saved Cub Scout camps and sold off their summer camp.  

[ThenNow]

2 hours ago, SilverPalm said:

ThenNow: I'm horrified as I read through what you've written of your experiences, and as a fellow Eagle Scout, I offer you my sincerest regret that your Scouting career was not more like mine - more like it should have been.  I don't know what the right answer is as far as compensation goes - I'm not sure any compensation can really ever make you whole - but I hope that this process will offer you some closure at least.  Your posts have greatly saddened me... that's not what Scouting should ever have been about.

Thank you. Me as well. Your time in Scouting sounds amazing.

I’m glad to have a place to give voice to my many silent fellows. In a way, it fills my cup. I share here more as a way to put a “face” on the otherwise amorphous group of survivor claimants, which some see as the marauding force storming the Scouting castle. I didn’t want that to be the only perception or allow the screeching voices of certain attorneys to distract from and drown out the deeply human story at hand.

Edited March 14, 2021 by ThenNow

[yknot]

50 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said:

Lots of Councils don't have summer camps.

My Council lost its camp years ago due to financial mismanagement.

Any LC that tries to shield its camp with "but it's a core function!" will have those Councils without camps thrown back in their face.

That may be true but some kind of local camp presence would need to remain for scouting to be functional. I assume you camp at town/county/state/park service facilities or private property. That kind of accessibility could be part of a formula but it would take some coordination and sophistication on the part of BSA and the affected LCs to propose it. Some councils near me have half a dozen camps. Clearly they could function with less. Others have one or none. Clearly their ability to function could be impacted. 

[ThenNow]

2 hours ago, MattR said:

There response should be it's a lot better than the 2000/year we used to have and we'd like to improve it again. Make it part of a settlement proposal.

Agree 100%. In fact, enhancing and improving YPT is one of the key non-monetary requirements for the TCC to recommend approval of a Plan. The BSA knows that, but utterly blew it off in what they filed. Zippo. This is the sort of nonsensical, arrogant non-negotiating negotiation strategy that infuriates us as survivor claimants. Why was it not addressed...at all? “Thank you, sir. May I have another?” Good grief.

[CynicalScouter]

4 minutes ago, ThenNow said:

In fact, enhancing and improving YPT is one of the key non-monetary requirements for the TCC to recommend approval of a Plan. The BSA knows that, but utterly blew it off in what they filed. Zippo.

Right, and the TCC lawyer (forget which) said that during the TCC town hall: the first priority was to maximize the amount recovered for victims. The moment that number is reached, they will be asking for an order regarding changes/enhancement of prevention of child abuse that will be included in the final reorganization plan.

TCC did not say what that order would entail, but if I had to make a wild guess it is going to include an outside inspector-general type appointed by the court that will be a YPT enforcer and lay down whatever rules he/she feels are needed for YPT.

Or, it might in fact be specific changes to YPT rules. As I said, if it were up to me the minimum standard should be Council-level reports similar to Clery Act reports for colleges that list every YPT violation and the subsequent results (arrest, unfounded, adult dismissed from program, remedial YPT education) etc.

Any council that reports 0 YPT violations in any given year should immediately have an audit done to either a) replicate what they are doing because they are perfect or b) heads should roll (paid professional and volunteer) because there is no way a council with thousands of adults did not have at least ONE screw up.

[ThenNow]

9 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said:

TCC did not say what that order would entail

If there is anything that can be shared outside the mediation confidentiality shield, I’ll see if I can tease it out. 

[vol_scouter]

8 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said:

Right, and the TCC lawyer (forget which) said that during the TCC town hall: the first priority was to maximize the amount recovered for victims. The moment that number is reached, they will be asking for an order regarding changes/enhancement of prevention of child abuse that will be included in the final reorganization plan.

 

This is disingenuous at best because the best way to maximize the amount recovered is to liquidate the BSA, all local councils, and as many chartered organizations as possible.  So the TCC is committed to the liquidation of the entire BSA and punishing more than a million children and youth as well as nearly a million dedicated volunteers.  This is light of unquestionable improvement in youth protection.  The legal system is horribly and possibly irreparably broken.

[CynicalScouter]

19 minutes ago, vol_scouter said:

This is disingenuous at best because the best way to maximize the amount recovered is to liquidate the BSA, all local councils, and as many chartered organizations as possible

Actually, it isn't, for two reasons.

1) As I noted, liquidation of a not for profit (like BSA national and the LCs) is legally impossible UNLESS the not for profit voluntarily does so.

2) Liquidation triggers the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation. Whose that you ask? It is a federal agency that insures all private pension in the U.S., just like the ones BSA National used to have.

PBGC has already filed a claim for at LEAST $1.1 Billion against BSA national (nearly the sum total of ALL BSA National assets which are around $1.4 Billion).

Upon liquidation, guess who jumps to the top of the creditor list ("administrative and priority claimants")? Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation.

Guess who could not care less about abuse victims, TCC, Kosnoff, or anyone else other than those it is legally obligated to protect (BSA pension program participants)? Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation.

What that means is that

1) Kosnoff cannot get his liquidation unless BSA falls on its sword and asks for it and..

2) The minute BSA did so, Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation comes in and sweeps 90% of BSA's assets out the door. The abuse victims, the other creditors, JPMorgan Chase, EVERYONE else gets to fight for the $200 million (or less) in scraps at that point.

The LAST thing TCC wants is a liquidated BSA. They want the BSA Golden Goose to keep paying out settlement checks/golden eggs for years to come into that Settlement Fund.

Again, do NOT equate TCC = Kosnoff. They have two very, very different agendas.

Edited March 14, 2021 by CynicalScouter