Appropriate Insignia UNDER Right Pocket?

[mrkstvns]

1 hour ago, qwazse said:

... I do agree with @ParkMan in that I want the scouts to be intentional about how they present themselves. So, I try to bring up deviations from the Insignia Guide -- including my own -- in a kind and courteous manner. I want the scouts to know there's a balance between a uniform that tells your scouting story and one that distracts from tasks at hand.

I like the idea that a uniform tells a scouting story.

Quite true...

In the Bryan on Scouting post about Congressman Elijah Cummings, there's a bit about how he grew up in a working poor family that could ill-afford to pay for "official" BSA uniforms.  The article says...

 

None of the Cub Scouts in Elijah Cummings’ pack could afford a full uniform. So, in true Scouting fashion, they improvised — cobbling together uniform pieces at bargain shops and the local Salvation Army. Some boys bought unofficial iron-on patches and cut out the numbers to iron onto their left sleeves.

The picture above “shows the only thing I was able to find, which was a belt,” Cummings told the BET in 2014. “As a matter of fact, that’s a Boy Scout belt, and even though I was in the Cub Scouts then, I was so proud of that belt. As you can see, I wasn’t a fashion guru, but we did the best we could with what we had.”

 

IMHO, many of us can learn a lesson in humility from this.

[Liz]

On 10/31/2019 at 12:21 PM, Thunderbird said:

There is a council near me that uses segments.  They seem to encourage it for older Scouts (in troops) - not just Cub Scouts (usually worn on the red brag vest).  If I remember correctly, they wear it in the temporary patch spot on the right pocket - basically counting the center patch and all segments as the temporary patch.

That's how it's done in my current Council and in the Council I was in before. At least in the previous council the round patch placed on the right pocket was a District patch which you could argue had some value by itself (the segments being a different matter). But in my council it's just a 2nd council patch, which is, if nothing else, redundant. If you buy a shirt with patches pre-sewn at the local Council office, they even include this extra council patch. 

I don't like it. I grudgingly complied with it on my daughter's blue uniform, but now that she's in tan, nope. My older kids did it and I always thought it looked tacky. I'm far from uniform police, but this is so far away from a neat and tidy look that I just boycott it. 

[Thunderbird]

52 minutes ago, Liz said:

That's how it's done in my current Council and in the Council I was in before. At least in the previous council the round patch placed on the right pocket was a District patch which you could argue had some value by itself (the segments being a different matter). But in my council it's just a 2nd council patch, which is, if nothing else, redundant. If you buy a shirt with patches pre-sewn at the local Council office, they even include this extra council patch. 

I don't like it. I grudgingly complied with it on my daughter's blue uniform, but now that she's in tan, nope. My older kids did it and I always thought it looked tacky. I'm far from uniform police, but this is so far away from a neat and tidy look that I just boycott it. 

In my council, Cub Scouts really love to put all of their patches on the red brag vest.  They could get a round council patch, put it on the back of the vest, and then put all of their segments in rings around the council patch.  To me, this looks better than trying to fit all of that under the right pocket.  I have only seen Cub Scouts wear the red vest, though - not older Scouts.

[Liz]

I don't think I've ever seen a Scout with a red brag vest in real life. 

[desertrat77]

5 minutes ago, Liz said:

I don't think I've ever seen a Scout with a red brag vest in real life. 

Fairly common in the '70s, started dying out in the early '80s. 

[Liz]

2 minutes ago, desertrat77 said:

Fairly common in the '70s, started dying out in the early '80s. 

When my older kids were Cub Scouts in 2001-2007ish, they weren't even available to purchase and were no longer considered "official" Scouting wear. Most of the kids in our dens used a "brag blanket." I know they have made a little bit of a comeback and are now available for purchase at the Scout Shop, but I don't know anybody who actually has one. 

[desertrat77]

22 minutes ago, Liz said:

When my older kids were Cub Scouts in 2001-2007ish, they weren't even available to purchase and were no longer considered "official" Scouting wear. Most of the kids in our dens used a "brag blanket." I know they have made a little bit of a comeback and are now available for purchase at the Scout Shop, but I don't know anybody who actually has one. 

I haven't seen either...the one I have from my scouting days was official BSA, made of heavy felt.  Plenty of others were homemade and were considered acceptable for uniform wear. 

[Liz]

https://www.scoutshop.org/cub-scout-youth-patch-vest-red-600540.html - They're official again now, but they were on hiatus for several years. 

[fred8033]

On 10/31/2019 at 2:13 PM, denibug72 said:

The majority of our boys wear them as pictured in the OP - the middle patch is their first year at Tomahawk, surrounded by all the segments they've earned so far.  I've seen quite a few from other Tomahawk troops that wear them on the back of their MB sash.  It definitely clutters up the shirt, but it's also been a great jump off point for conversations when meeting scouts from other troops.  

I've seen many worn on the shirt like the original poster.

Mine have put them on the back of the MB sash.  I'd like to say it's because of I'm a rule follower and I've read the insignia guide.  I have read it.  I like to follow the rules.  But there is a more important reason.  Sewing dozens of little segments is a lot of work !!!!   What happens when they grow in size ?  One mother said you cut that panel off the old shirt and re-sew it to the new shirt as a panel. 

My family is lucky to keep the main patches accurate over the years.  Rank.  Position.  Misc.  We'd never succeed keeping the huge panel of segments current ... in my house.  

[Thunderbird]

2 hours ago, fred8033 said:

I've seen many worn on the shirt like the original poster.

Mine have put them on the back of the MB sash.  I'd like to say it's because of I'm a rule follower and I've read the insignia guide.  I have read it.  I like to follow the rules.  But there is a more important reason.  Sewing dozens of little segments is a lot of work !!!!   What happens when they grow in size ?  One mother said you cut that panel off the old shirt and re-sew it to the new shirt as a panel. 

My family is lucky to keep the main patches accurate over the years.  Rank.  Position.  Misc.  We'd never succeed keeping the huge panel of segments current ... in my house.  

I started using velcro for ranks, position, JTE, etc.  Then I put sticky back velcro (cut it down so that it's smaller than the patch) on the back of the patch.  Makes it much easier to keep up with patches that change a lot.

[FireStone]

I'm generally the last person to criticize this kind of thing. I've sewn stuff on my son's uniform that I know wasn't regulation, but I like that the kids embrace some of these elements of the uniform, the badges, beads, etc. If it makes them want to wear it more, I'm all for it. 

But within reason. The uniform isn't the place to show every little thing you've done. You don't put every camp patch on the pocket, you pick one and wear just that one. Adults now are supposed to limit square knots to 9 (3 rows of 3). So I think a general rule of "keep it subtle" is key here, don't over-do it. 

So this, to me, is overdoing it. Those segments look like they were designed to work best in one or two rows at most, so that's probably where this should have stopped. If a scout really wants to display them all, put them on a pack, a camp blanket, back of a sash, etc. 

[Protoclete]

We had the same system when I was a scout, a council or district patch in the middle, with segments for summer camp and camporee and all sorts of things ringed around it.

The center patch was supposed to be centered on the pocket, and the segments not to exceed the seams of the pocket. 

In fact, this example is used on this page, from my old Council: http://www.scoutinsignia.com/tmppatch.htm

I think the only badges I remember being set below the pocket were the Arrow of Light (left) and the Recruiter Strip (right). 

Edited January 29, 2020 by Protoclete