oldisnewagain1 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 I'm obsessing with the choice of a pack for a 2020 Philmont trek On one hand I have my tried and true Alps Cascade 5200 (85 Liters) pack on the other hand I got a good price on a Granite Gear Crown X60 (60 liters). The Pros and Cons as I see them right now are Alps Pros I already own it There is plenty of room for my stuff, crew gear, and Philmont gear It fits well and is comfortable Cons It is heavy (5 pounds 8 oz) The pack has been repaired a few times (the sewed seams leave a lot to be desired) With the extra space in the pack, I could over pack Not as much airflow as I would like on my back Granite Gear Pros Lightweight (2 pounds 8.2 oz) Good features including back ventilation Price $120 (budget is always a concern) Cons 35 pound max carry It doesn't look like I could strap any thing to the bottom Having never tried it before, I'm not sure how comfortable it will be Now based on my current base weight is 17.11 but I still have some things to get and weigh. With water, an estimate of Philfood (for three days), and a tent my estimated weight is 37.5 and this is before crew and Philmont gear. I'm thinking the Granite Gear might not be the right choice. Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSScout Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 Thoughts? I never got to hike in Philmont. The senior Scouts from my Troop used army surplus plywood packframes, made their own tarp tents out of 8 mil black plastic , duct tape, and grommets, came back hyped up. Our Troop went camping a lot after that. Since the older Scouts used 'em, dad and I went out and bought the M4 plywood packframe for me, lashed the BSA Yucca pack to it, and that is what I used thru the late 1950s. No hip belt, canvas, cotton cord. When the canvas backpad started to give way, I found a open mesh one that fit and that made a world of difference in comfort. Then a friend brought a Swiss rucksack. Aluminum frame, hip belt , nylon. Wow. Instant conversion. I got a Kelty/REI packframe, and then even tried to convert the M4 with a homemade heavy hinge hip belt thingy, which bent under the load. The M4 is ready for the museum.... When my friend invited me to walk the Camino de Santiago with him, I went out and bought a new Deuter pack. I think I had a max 20 kilos . Very comfortable, extra roomy, served very well. I crafted some rings on the bottom of the pack to lash the sleeping bag to, keeping the light weight stuff on the bottom. I believe I still would favor an external frame as being more adaptable, but the internal frame Deuter was very nice. Pockets on the outside for small stuff... Rain cape, Such choices available now. "Ya pays yer money and ya takes yer cherce." 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwazse Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 Perspective: you are fretting over a 2.97 pound reduction in pack-weight a $120 cost, which means: $20.20 per pound reduction in pack weight, but you don't even know if you could strap that extra 3 pounds of whatever you want to the bottom of the new pack. IMHO, the penalty for over-packing is huge. Airflow is nice, but not a show stopper. I only switched packs when the wicking liner (Goretex, I think) crumbled. (Note to self: I need to scavenge that old pack. I could use the cotter pins and lock rings for my kayak.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldisnewagain1 Posted June 18, 2019 Author Share Posted June 18, 2019 36 minutes ago, qwazse said: Perspective: you are fretting over a 2.97 pound reduction in pack-weight a $120 cost, which means: $20.20 per pound reduction in pack weight, but you don't even know if you could strap that extra 3 pounds of whatever you want to the bottom of the new pack. IMHO, the penalty for over-packing is huge. Airflow is nice, but not a show stopper. I only switched packs when the wicking liner (Goretex, I think) crumbled. (Note to self: I need to scavenge that old pack. I could use the cotter pins and lock rings for my kayak.) And I'm fretting over the Alps seams once again letting loose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldisnewagain1 Posted June 18, 2019 Author Share Posted June 18, 2019 54 minutes ago, SSScout said: The senior Scouts from my Troop used army surplus plywood packframes,... Yeah, when I was a young strapping lad, I could diamond hitch just about anything to a WWII (maybe Korean War) pack frame our Troop had and carry way too much But those days are gone and I'm expecting Vitamin I (despite conditioning before going) will be my best friend on this trek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagledad Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 The 35# limit would stop me. Of course the goal is to stay below that weight, but that would be an easy weight to bust. There are all kinds of situations that could force sharing the load of a crew member. Spend some time on Craigslist. What state are you located? Barry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldisnewagain1 Posted June 18, 2019 Author Share Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Eagledad said: There are all kinds of situations that could force sharing the load of a crew member. What state are you located? That makes good sense! Thanks Barry! I just cancelled my order for the crown x60. My state, well usually, confusion and denial but I'm located in Mass Edited June 18, 2019 by oldisnewagain1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allangr1024 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 I went to Philmont in 2005, and my pack started out at 35 pounds. Then they added 15 pounds of food and water. You are looking at a base weight of 20. Not hard to do these days, but you have to plan carefully and look at the gear you want to carry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattR Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 I'm going backpacking next week with my troop. There is so much snow in the mountains that we need to bring snow shoes, and warmer clothing, and a big pack. Frost points the end of June, just what I want. Anyway, I went and borrowed a big pack. I'm thinking I'm getting too old for this. New thought: Now I'm more like the younger scouts on the hike - not quite sure if I'm going to make it. Reminds me of my first backpacking trips. I have a smaller pack that works just fine for a weekend (without snow) and a recent external frame pack that is super comfortable but doesn't hold much more than the little pack. It could hold a lot more if I just make a pack that will fit the frame (the pack that comes with it is only 2/3 the size of the frame). I may do that some day. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuctTape Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 most of the time excess weight in packs comes from the the things that "weigh nothing". I am not an uberlight backpacker and I do carry some extras, but I found the key is to know exactly (to the tenth of an ounce) what everything weighs and use a list. This almost all but eliminates the "I *might* need this too and it doesn't weigh much". B/c all those add up to a lot. This is also why I suggest all scouts should pack for all trips as though it was for backpacking that way they know what is really necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwazse Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 10 hours ago, oldisnewagain1 said: And I'm fretting over the Alps seams once again letting loose Oh, if it's fraying (or frayed once) at the seems don't take it on a week-long adventure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjlash Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 My $0.02 worth - I would go with the GG pack. Partly because of the weight savings, partly because smaller pack prevents adding unnecessary items (which saves more weight), partly because of the questionable stitching. Mostly because Im a gear geek and enjoy trying out new stuff. Ive carried a GoLite Pinnacle on 2 treks (and a bunch of other week-long hikes). THe specs put it at 70 liters and 30# weight limit. My personal gear was right about 18# so very similar to yours - add Philfood, water and tent and I was about 35#. That pack was comfortable at that weight. It was full to the top at our biggest food pickup but everything fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
69RoadRunner Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 Less weight = more happiness. Go with the lighter pack and work on a lower base weight. Mine is around 12 pounds right now. On a budget you can easily be under 15 before crew gear, food and water. My mostly complete list for our 7/28/2019 trek: https://lighterpack.com/r/1y08fv 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle94-A1 Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 I am in a similar predicament. I am looking to get a lighter pack as I am using a Camp Trails Wind River Pack. It is approx. 5.5 pounds, and is approx. 80 L expandable to 90L. After looking at what is out there. I am sticking with the Wind River. The 35# weight limit is a major concern for some packs, and for others, the weight savings was negligable for the cost. In one case, the pack weighed more than the Wind River! Not only do I use the pack for family camping, there have been two instances where I had to deal with medical emergencies, and gear had to be redistributed. First time it happened, I had a cheap pack from K Mart, and the pack broke from the excess weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSScout Posted June 24, 2019 Share Posted June 24, 2019 Oldisnewagain1 : Maybe you don't really want a … back pack.... Maybe you're asking the wrong question... https://74fdc.wordpress.com/2013/01/18/woven-backpacks-design-rooted-in-history-and-tradition/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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