Eagledad Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 16 minutes ago, MattR said: I think it was from a recommendation on this forum that I took my troop to a patrol cooking summer camp. I was impressed with the results. Cooking for a whole week helps the scouts get in a groove. It really did help teamwork. They did like the food better as well. And yet, my troop doesn't do patrol cooking at summer camp anymore. I think the biggest problem was the lack of support from the camps we went to. There was a stretch of 6 or 7 years where we tried every other year and it was always a disaster because the camps didn't understand what the patrols needed. Honestly, what do you do when you get a bag of frozen chicken breasts a half hour before it's time to eat? We went back to one, and I won't mention names because it's on the list in the OP, and I had to drive back home and pick up our gear because while they said they had everything they didn't. Logistics for patrol cooking summer camps is a lot more complicated than mess halls, which I understand is the main reason many camps we're glad to get away from it. Barry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrkstvns Posted June 13, 2019 Author Share Posted June 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, Eagledad said: Logistics for patrol cooking summer camps is a lot more complicated than mess halls, which I understand is the main reason many camps we're glad to get away from it. Yep. As adults, it's often a whole lot easier for us to just do something ourselves than it is to involve the boys. Those younger guys aren't as efficient as us and they waste time figuring things out and sometimes making the kind of mistakes that will only result in experience. As an adult-led organization, BSA should sure focus on whatever is logistically best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagledad Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 10 minutes ago, mrkstvns said: Yep. As adults, it's often a whole lot easier for us to just do something ourselves than it is to involve the boys. Those younger guys aren't as efficient as us and they waste time figuring things out and sometimes making the kind of mistakes that will only result in experience. As an adult-led organization, BSA should sure focus on whatever is logistically best. No, what I mean is the logistics for the summer camp to handle food from delivery, dividing it out to patrols and transporting it to the troops is very complicated and time consuming. It requires a lot more staff hours. One little hic-up and the whole camp is set back. Been there done that. As I said, going to a mess hall reduces cost by a lot because it requires less staff and is easier on camp logistics. Barry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwazse Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 2 hours ago, Eagledad said: No, what I mean is the logistics for the summer camp to handle food from delivery, dividing it out to patrols and transporting it to the troops is very complicated and time consuming. It requires a lot more staff hours. One little hic-up and the whole camp is set back. Been there done that. As I said, going to a mess hall reduces cost by a lot because it requires less staff and is easier on camp logistics. Barry SBR's commissary model is probably the ideal. Scouts order thier ingredients and amounts and pick them up at the commissary ... old time general store fashion. I thought I would get to sample the full effect of that at World Jamboree, but the choices are all warm-and-serve type foods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris1 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 On 6/13/2019 at 2:18 PM, MattR said: ... I think it would be great but the adults in my troop shot it down several times. Unfortunately I have seen that a lot from adults in the past several years at several troops. Camp Dietler gives scouts a great experience, and highly recommend it or other patrol-cooking camps that may be closer to you. At Dietler the scouts get to know the staffers as they rotate, eating meals with patrols. Yes even the camp director eats what 11 year old scouts cook. Patrol method summer camps is not about the number of merit badges one can earn, it is about growth as a team and as individuals. Too bad so many people don't understand that, and focus only on how many merit badge sessions there are. I also find the food at patrols is far better than at dining halls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chief027 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 Honestly when I’ve asked the scouts there said they don’t want to cook at summer camp. Why? They said to focus on having fun and merit badges and not having to worry about it. i think this is the majority opinion and that’s why we struggle to find camps that let the scouts cook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrkstvns Posted June 20, 2019 Author Share Posted June 20, 2019 (edited) . Edited June 20, 2019 by mrkstvns Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrkstvns Posted June 20, 2019 Author Share Posted June 20, 2019 10 minutes ago, chief027 said: I think this is the majority opinion and that’s why we struggle to find camps that let the scouts cook. That's fine if that's really what the BOYS want....but in too many troops, the adults never even presented the option and the boys don't realize they COULD opt to cook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagledad Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 (edited) 21 minutes ago, chief027 said: Honestly when I’ve asked the scouts there said they don’t want to cook at summer camp. Why? They said to focus on having fun and merit badges and not having to worry about it. i think this is the majority opinion and that’s why we struggle to find camps that let the scouts cook. Well, I'm told the reasoning most camps goto mess halls is economical. And, I think most folks, including adults, would rather spend time with the fun stuff than the something monotonous that they do on every other camp out the rest of the year. But, I said before, nothing pulls scouts through the team building experience better than summer camp patrol cooking. So, if the adults are looking for scout growth in their decision making process, nothing does it better than patrol cooking. Barry Edited June 20, 2019 by Eagledad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrkstvns Posted June 20, 2019 Author Share Posted June 20, 2019 1 hour ago, Eagledad said: Well, I'm told the reasoning most camps goto mess halls is economical. Hmmm. I'd like to see real data on that because it sounds completely upside down. A commissary window should be many times cheaper for the camp than a mess hall. After all, a commissary can be run on a much smaller staff, requires a simpler facility (essentially a small warehouse vs. a fully equipped kitchen), lower energy costs (no stoves or ovens), and less complexity (no need for prep lines, dishwashing areas, or serving facilities/staff). It's very hard to imagine a scenario in which even the best-run mess hall is genuinely more economical than the worst-run commissary... But if you really have credible info to the contrary, I'm happy to be convinced otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagledad Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 3 minutes ago, mrkstvns said: Hmmm. I'd like to see real data on that because it sounds completely upside down. A commissary window should be many times cheaper for the camp than a mess hall. After all, a commissary can be run on a much smaller staff, requires a simpler facility (essentially a small warehouse vs. a fully equipped kitchen), lower energy costs (no stoves or ovens), and less complexity (no need for prep lines, dishwashing areas, or serving facilities/staff). It's very hard to imagine a scenario in which even the best-run mess hall is genuinely more economical than the worst-run commissary... But if you really have credible info to the contrary, I'm happy to be convinced otherwise. I've was told this by camp directors in 1995. I trust their word. I can see by your post that you don't understand or respect the effort of distributing food from the delivery trucks to the patrols. It is quite an effort. One fact I think even todays camp directors will pass along (give one a call) is that summer camps operate with a very very tight budget. Insurance cost alone determined some of the activities provided. Mountain bikes is one activity taken from a camp we used. Barry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buggie Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 At camp it's difficult enough for the coffee truck to make its way to all the campsites in the morning early enough before the flag ceremony. Oh lord, nothing worse than adults crying bout not getting their coffee. I get it, but sometimes things happen. You can get your coffee at breakfast. Deal with it. I like coffee too. Stop complaining! Someone get this scouter their coffee so we can get some relative peace here! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderbird Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, Buggie said: At camp it's difficult enough for the coffee truck to make its way to all the campsites in the morning early enough before the flag ceremony. Oh lord, nothing worse than adults crying bout not getting their coffee. I get it, but sometimes things happen. You can get your coffee at breakfast. Deal with it. I like coffee too. Stop complaining! Someone get this scouter their coffee so we can get some relative peace here! Coffee trucks??? Which Scout camps have coffee trucks? We have to brew our own if we want it before breakfast! 🤣 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle94-A1 Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 54 minutes ago, Thunderbird said: Coffee trucks??? Which Scout camps have coffee trucks? We have to brew our own if we want it before breakfast! 🤣 How about a coffee car? 😛 When I was the camp commissioner at Camp Bonner in NC, I would put fresh coffee in the USGI thermos, pick up the newspapers, and drive to the campsites to delivering fresh, hot coffee and a paper to the SM and ASMs. And since I was a tad bit homesick, I blasted YOU ARE MY SUNSHINE, since it is my home state's official song, to let everyone know I was on the way. Only time I had any problems was LDS week. No coffee, only papers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrkstvns Posted June 21, 2019 Author Share Posted June 21, 2019 2 hours ago, Thunderbird said: Coffee trucks??? Which Scout camps have coffee trucks? We have to brew our own if we want it before breakfast! 🤣 What?!?! Your summer camp doesn't have coffee trucks? Ours does... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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