marinelaw Posted June 28, 2004 Author Share Posted June 28, 2004 The jones act is irrelevant to this matter, I responded with that for the question of foriegn or US flag. When questioning the USCG Miami I also found they were granted a "stay of execution" if you will. I was also told it expires JULY. This was offered so they had time to comply, which they don't seem to be doing as boats are still carrying 8. I feel Gags is on the right track in his cconcerns. Why are the Boy Scouts allowed special privlage in this matter and allowed to operated above CG regulation. A charterboat, is a charterboat, is a charterboat. Would a criminal be given special treatment because of who he worked for? Would the sentance be ignored or less if he was afiliated with the Boy Scouts. Would a malpractice suit be unwarranted if a physician worked for a hospital as opposed to having his own practice? All pilots and airlines are regulated by a federal office, they all have the same requirements for licensing as well as insurance and rules to which they must abide by. that is why we have regulations is it not? Why is their bias here. I would venture to say there is very few operators if any, chartering through the Sea Base that would come close to to the experience at sea I have logged throughout my lifetime. I would also mention if I were allowed to carry two extra paying passengers on every trip I have taken, I could have retired years ago with the extra money as well as saved thousands on commercially inspected vessels. We (commercially) all pay insurance coverage for certain limits of operative liability as well as are licensed respectively to operate under these regulations. On larger boats that hold COI's(cert. of inspection) for inspected vessels allowed to operated with over 6 capacity, there is rules that apply. Would an inspected vessel with a COI to carry 49 suddenly be allowed to carry 65...absolutely not, they would be fried if caught. On uninspected vessels there are rules and standard regulation that apply as well. We all must comply appropriately or we would live in the wild west again. Did that disgusting employee who molested the 4 children at Sea Base last year get excused from his crimes because he worked "at Sea Base"....your damn right he didn't! What do you think their parents were told that he was given special permission to do so because he was a Boy Scout Employee. Lets be serious here, why does it always have to reach injury or death before someone acts when the Scouts are involved. This is suppopsed to be an organization of Honesty, Integrity, Loyalty, and honor is it not? I hate to preach to the choir but some dont seem to be listening!! Are we now just another organization of substandard activity or are we THE BOYS SCOUT OF AMERICA!!! a group youth and men alike who should uphold all of our founding values It seems some need to review abasic pricipal here or refrain from leading.. On my honor . . . By giving your word, you are promising to be guided by the ideals of the Scout Oath. . . . I will do my best . . . Try hard to live up to the points of the Scout Oath. Measure your achievements against your own high standards and don't be influenced by peer pressure or what other people do. . . . To do my duty to God . . . Your family and religious leaders teach you about God and the ways you can serve. You do your duty to God by following the wisdom of those teachings every day and by respecting and defending the rights of others to practice their own beliefs. . . . and my country . . . Help keep the United States a strong and fair nation by learning about our system of government and your responsibilities as a citizen and future voter. America is made up of countless families and communities. When you work to improve your community and your home, you are serving your country. Natural resources are another important part of America's heritage worthy of your efforts to understand, protect, and use wisely. What you do can make a real difference. . . . and to obey the Scout Law; . . . The twelve points of the Scout Law are guidelines that can lead you toward wise choices. When you obey the Scout Law, other people will respect you for the way you live, and you will respect yourself.. . . To help other people at all times; . . . There are many people who need you. Your cheerful smile and helping hand will ease the burden of many who need assistance. By helping out whenever possible, you are doing your part to make this a better world. . . . To keep myself physically strong, . . . Take care of your body so that it will serve you well for an entire lifetime. That means eating nutritious foods, getting enough sleep, and exercising regularly to build strength and endurance. it also means avoiding harmful drugs, alcohol, tobacco, and anything else that can harm your health. . . . mentally awake, . . . Develop your mind both in the classroom and outside of school. Be curious about everything around you, and work hard to make the most of your abilities. With an inquiring attitude and the willingness to ask questions, you can learn much about the exciting world around you and your role in it. . . . and morally straight. To be a person of strong character, your relationships with others should be honest and open. You should respect and defend the rights of all people. Be clean in your speech and actions, and remain faithful in your religious beliefs. The values you practice as a Scout will help you shape a life of virtue and self-reliance.(This message has been edited by marinelaw)(This message has been edited by marinelaw)(This message has been edited by marinelaw) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marinelaw Posted June 28, 2004 Author Share Posted June 28, 2004 This is a good comparison to another poost in the forums right now!!! Perhaps we should compare views on the underage drunken Eagle scout from Mass., who thinks nothing is illeagal or wrong of having his parents throw a boozefest for underage children in his honor(aside the fact that the cops showed up). If t(This message has been edited by marinelaw) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marinelaw Posted June 28, 2004 Author Share Posted June 28, 2004 HOW FRUSTRATING!!! with these incomplete posts! I'll repost again later..(This message has been edited by marinelaw) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob White Posted June 29, 2004 Share Posted June 29, 2004 "This is a good comparison to another poost in the forums right now!!! Perhaps we should compare views on the underage drunken Eagle scout from Mass., who thinks nothing is illeagal or wrong of having his parents throw a boozefest for underage children in his honor(aside the fact that the cops showed up)." Marinelaw, Is it now your intention to make this act by an individual the fault of the BSA? You raised the alarm over the USCG when in fact there is no problem, and that is according to the USCG. Now you want to compare a bad decision by one of 5-million members to being similar. You need to relax. As Geraldo said when he opened Al Capone's vault "There is nothing here!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoutdad Posted June 29, 2004 Share Posted June 29, 2004 Last summer I went to FSB as an adult leader along with 6 boys and another adult. We did the coral reef sailing program. One of us adults (me), was required to be certified in safe swim defense, safety afloat, and pass a Florida boating safety course. The scouts and adults were asked to help with handling lines, anchor, capturing and tying up to the buoys and if needed anchor watches. As you can tell this is not just a simple charter service but a working learning experience, and no doubt that is the reason for the USCG wavier. Also, we never cruised for 12 hours straight, we would stop mid-morning and mid-afternoon to snorkel. I found our boat to be well maintained and the captain knew his stuff. He could maneuver his boat in and out of the cramped marina at Key West without aid of line handlers and never touching the dock. The boats practiced the buddy boat system and were always on the radio checking in with each other. The boat had sleeping berths for 6 below but some of the boys chose to sleep in the cockpit while the other adult leader and myself slept on the fore-deck (much cooler). I dont know the purpose of this thread, but I checked FSBs web site today and all is ok. Reservations continue for coral reef sailing with a min. 6 and max. 8. I would and I know the boys would go back in a heartbeat. YIS Scoutdad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marinelaw Posted June 29, 2004 Author Share Posted June 29, 2004 It seems as though you are from the "boys will be boys" school who allows these poorly trained and poorly led children to continue this irresponsible behavior with a slap on the wrist so little Johnny does not have poor self esteem for being marked as a bad seed!. Seems a shame. This comparison is simply a great example of how so many boys are allowed to get away with improper and stupid things due to the fact they... well, they're Boy Scouts soooo, that is really a pathetic approch to proper leadership. Leading by example should be focused on. They are Scouts so they get special treatment. Please dont tell me you support the parents who enabled this activity, or that you would support any BSA affiliated activity which is illegal un scout like. Or do you just take pride when special consideration is taken for those who are paying their dues to contine paying national salaries, this is rediculous. The National staff member who molested god knows how many children at the Base, before he was finally stood up to by PROPER Boy Scouts, was probably the Scout who was slapped on the wrist and saw that he could continue through life with out the responsibility of consiquence for his actions until the unthinkable occured. You seem so dead set against the issues of law and safety one would think you are in bed with them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marinelaw Posted June 29, 2004 Author Share Posted June 29, 2004 Amazing that within 48 of the USCG saying they have no such document to fax me, that you got one. If you have a signed copy form the USCG office in charge....post it better yet scan it and post it so the authorizing signiature can be seen proper, lets have a look see at it. Better yet, your friends at the base should po(This message has been edited by marinelaw) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGreyEagle Posted June 29, 2004 Share Posted June 29, 2004 I understand truncated posts are not your fault, and I would like to listen to what you have to say Marinelaw, but the sound of that axe you are grinding "drowns" out your arguments Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packsaddle Posted June 29, 2004 Share Posted June 29, 2004 Uuuuggh, got me again.(This message has been edited by packsaddle) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packsaddle Posted June 29, 2004 Share Posted June 29, 2004 OGE, I agree. truncate that, Microsoft! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nldscout Posted June 29, 2004 Share Posted June 29, 2004 I beleive this is a case of sour grapes for not get Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FScouter Posted June 29, 2004 Share Posted June 29, 2004 This sounds like nothing more than a tempest in a teapot. After boiling down 15 or 20 posts from our regulations friend we seem to have nothing more than BSA runs 8 on a boat with agreement from the Coast Guard, while other operations are limited to 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marinelaw Posted June 29, 2004 Author Share Posted June 29, 2004 Why the private response? ...Still waiting to see this document posted with authorizing signiatures, Bob....Mich.... you now have my private email (which I expect, you will respect)Scan it and fwd it to me... please. (This message has been edited by marinelaw) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mich632 Posted June 29, 2004 Share Posted June 29, 2004 This will be my last post on this subject. Sorry Marinelaw. It seems from your post that you have a specific "issue" with Seabase and/or the USCG and you are using this forum to express your opinion. Which you are welcome to do. But I will not be participating any more. I made some calls and was able to get the information I needed to make sure that my scouts will be safe and that Seabase is in compliance with the law and that is as far as I am willing to go. If you are not able to get a copy of the MOU from the government or Seabase then I suspect there is a reason. I can not even begin to guess why. But that does not matter. I am comfortable with my boys safety and I am done. Good luck getting your "issue" resolved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marinelaw Posted June 29, 2004 Author Share Posted June 29, 2004 Still waiting...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now