Eagle Scout Extension for new 2019 Scouts

[HashTagScouts]

In an article just last summer, Sydney commented she was preparing to work on her project, the last step of to earning her Venturing Summit Award.  Yes, right now it does feel to me as this has become a total "me first" statement, sadly.  Troubling piece for me is the father commenting that she shouldn't be expected to work on this into college- uh, the Scouts Canada program is also for college age youth, and Venturing is as well- so, we have someone who wants to be an Eagle Scout and is also signalling that they want to be "done" with scouting as soon as they have it? Life is not about handouts...  

[FireStone]

I feel scammed. I really do. I backed her on this journey because she, like all of us in favor of girls in the BSA, voiced our desire for all girls to have the opportunity to do what the boys were doing. Sydney herself often said she just wanted the opportunity her brother had.

Well, turns out that was a lie. She wants her own unique opportunity, to earn Eagle on her own special terms. And what the Ireland family asked us to do, supporting the movement to include girls in all levels of BSA scouting, really it was always just about supporting Sydney and her goal to do it on her terms.

What a shame. I question if she's even worthy of the Eagle rank anymore. Not that it matters, obviously she has enough adults around her to push through any and all resistance to her getting signed off.

Edited February 6, 2019 by FireStone

[RememberSchiff]

Can out-of-council Scouters bid to serve on EBOR? 

[Jameson76]

42 minutes ago, HelpfulTracks said:

She has been given the opportunity she asked for, but now that is not good enough. 

Well.  When you want what you want, just keep moving the goal posts until the organization accedes to your demands.

[Jameson76]

2 minutes ago, RememberSchiff said:

Can out-of-council Scouters bid to serve on EBOR? 

That would be awesome....

Challenge is daddy would likely already have the lawsuits typed up and ready to file if things did not go 100% their way

[HelpfulTracks]

10 minutes ago, HashTagScouts said:

In an article just last summer, Sydney commented she was preparing to work on her project, the last step of to earning her Venturing Summit Award.  Yes, right now it does feel to me as this has become a total "me first" statement, sadly.  Troubling piece for me is the father commenting that she shouldn't be expected to work on this into college- uh, the Scouts Canada program is also for college age youth, and Venturing is as well- so, we have someone who wants to be an Eagle Scout and is also signalling that they want to be "done" with scouting as soon as they have it? Life is not about handouts...  

She is (was) a Canadian VENTURER SCOUT and earned their highest honor Chief Scout’s Award, but everything I have read she has eschewed Venturing, even asking “If the Venturing program is so similar why can’t they be the same program if they’re the same award?” when she was pointed toward Venturing by National who equated earning the Summit to being equal to Eagle. 

[HelpfulTracks]

15 minutes ago, FireStone said:

I question if she's even worthy of the Eagle rank anymore. 

You would not be the first. 

[Jameson76]

40 minutes ago, FireStone said:

I question if she's even worthy of the Eagle rank anymore. 

Careful...you could get labeled a conditional Scouter and un-Scoutlike for posing such questions......

[walk in the woods]

1 hour ago, qwazse said:

WiW, which candidate is being endorsed? This is the reverse: an elected official is endorsing a particular citizen.
We're going to expend a lot of energy if we go around chasing every issue button and ball cap off of every uniformed scout.

I don't know that I said she was endorsing a candidate.  She was however using her uniform to push a political position at a political event in which politicians were exploiting her and her uniform for political gain. 

I agree that it's a lot of work to chase around every button and ball cap.  However, if we're going to say it's too much work, one should be equally laissez-faire when one sees a scout wearing an "Abortion is Murder" button on their uniform in the same way.  So what say you?  Anything goes or anything goes for her because she's her?

 

[Jameson76]

Just now, walk in the woods said:

She was however using her uniform to push a political position at a political event in which politicians were exploiting her and her uniform for political gain. 

Use of the word (or it's longer form) POLITICAL 4 times in one sentence is impressive.  And I would agree.  The setting, use of the BSA uniform with a rank patch she knows very well was not actually awarded, and wearing an ERA button is very much a political (see definition below) statement and not happenstance.  She is putting as much pressure as possible to get what she wants, sort of scorched earth at this point.

A definition of politics (and there are many)  - Politics is the process of making decisions that apply to members of a group. It refers to achieving and exercising positions of governance—organized control over a human community, particularly a state

[RememberSchiff]

6 minutes ago, Jameson76 said:

Careful...you could get labeled a conditional Scouter and un-Scoutlike for posing such questions......

Thanks . 

Let's stay away from personal attacks particularly on a youth.  

[Eagle1993]

https://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2017/01/17/scouts-and-presidential-inaugurations-have-a-long-interesting-past/

Perhaps the uniform police can go after all of these Boy Scouts who wore their uniforms at Presidental inaugurations..... (actually, an interesting history, but I would say a good parallel to attending a SOTU).

Note I do agree with you about the button & patch.... so perhaps the rest is an agreed to disagree.

@RememberSchiff makes a good point.  She is a 17 year old kid who is bound to make some mistakes.  

BSA seems to be holding strong to no exceptions outside the extension process released... I hope and expect they will not make further changes.

[RememberSchiff]

45 minutes ago, Jameson76 said:

Challenge is daddy would likely already have the lawsuits typed up and ready to file if things did not go 100% their way

I think that is the root problem - adults afraid to confront. at the unit and council level and hence no quality control.  

I have seen scouts arrive with used uniforms complete with previous, unearned rank. The SPL or SM has a brief talk and problem solved. 

[TAHAWK]

14 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said:

https://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2017/01/17/scouts-and-presidential-inaugurations-have-a-long-interesting-past/

Perhaps the uniform police can go after all of these Boy Scouts who wore their uniforms at Presidental inaugurations..... (actually, an interesting history, but I would say a good parallel to attending a SOTU).

Note I do agree with you about the button & patch.... so perhaps the rest is an agreed to disagree.

@RememberSchiff makes a good point.  She is a 17 year old kid who is bound to make some mistakes.  

BSA seems to be holding strong to no exceptions outside the extension process released... I hope and expect they will not make further changes.

Attendance in BSA uniform as a member of a Color Guard at a political event is allowed - even traditional.  They do need to promptly leave the stage after the flag ceremony is over.

[skeptic]

So, here we are on the edge of history, in a position to move forward in postive ways with long existing challenges that have simmered for years, in reality.  Do we put our best feet forward, or do we drag them while we kick and scream about how terrible changes are and how unfair to those in the past, and maybe even some in the future?

If we go back and examine the specific example that is causing most of the uproar, we must, if we are honest with ourselves, admit that the young woman likely did far more than many young men in achieving the standards overall.  From all that I have seen, she overreached on many of the requirements, either because that is her approach or she wanted to make "sure", or she was thinking it would strengthen her cause.  So, reality says other than the time frame and so on, she DID do the requirements, and really surpassed many of them.  Also, from what I have read over the past year or two, there may be a small number of others that did similar things, but with far less success and/or support.  So, then the complaint now is that she seems to have been given credit by her new unit leader immediately, rather than making here go through all the time frames again.  Aside from her, how many similar young people/women would actually have met that standard and have the verification?  Few, I would think.  So, how to respond?

Nobody with an ax to grind will be satisfied most of us will recognize, and a few without axes too.  But, on the other had, do we continue to push the image of fair versus unfair in the public view, or do we work through it as calmly and the best we are able?  Two or three years hence, will it really matter?  And, as far as Sydney being recognized as Eagle, I can honestly say that from what I have seen and read she may be far more qualified in many aspects than some of whom I know.  Any of us around for a while have seen our share of "they met the requirements barely" candidates.  

So, can we work on bringing down the curtain on the over the top acting and simply make the best and fairest decisions and move on?  We come back to our definition of Scout Spirit.  From my perspective, some of us still struggle with it in some instances.  Again, from what I have read in many and varied BSA and world related sources, BP would be likely standing on the side of young Sydney.  

So, let us go back to our unit and local trenches and work the program to the overall betterment of Scouts BSA and the young people for whom it is intended.  ⚜️