Felon?

[David CO]

1 hour ago, scoutmom86 said:

I still think that what’s good for one is good for all! 

BSA would probably agree with you. They think everyone should be scrutinized like a convicted felon on probation.

[scoutmom86]

25 minutes ago, qwazse said:

So your bf may be singled out, but in the grand scheme of things he's not alone.

Except he was singled out in my Pack. In 4 years on the committee, never have I ever had anyone ask about anyone else’s criminal history unless they applied for leadership. One was a sex offender and it was brought before the board.

[scoutmom86]

9 minutes ago, David CO said:

1 hour ago, scoutmom86 said:

 

BSA would probably agree with you. They think everyone should be scrutinized like a convicted felon on probation.

So long as we only scrutinize one person in particular who we know because your friend is a gossip? Not all the other people participating as felons, as you all have said that it didn’t matter if it was blood related or not.

[Eagle1993]

2 minutes ago, scoutmom86 said:

Except he was singled out in my Pack. In 4 years on the committee, never have I ever had anyone ask about anyone else’s criminal history unless they applied for leadership. One was a sex offender and it was brought before the board.

I think the question right now are your options.  Assuming this is the only local pack then first try sitting down with the Committee chair and cub master. If that doesn’t work you could talk with leaders of the Charter Organization.  If they also push back on your boy friend you could try to reach out to the council (district executive) for support, but as he is not the parent then I’m not sure they would get involved.

This completely changes with his own son.  Is the boy’s mom in the picture?  If not, then banning the boy’s father essentially bans the boy as well.  I think the council would probably be more likely to get involved in that case. 

I would definitely recommend the softest approach as possible.  Even if he “wins” by escalating the issue you’ll be stuck in a pack that may not be fun (with leaders resenting the outside involvement).  

BSA does not ban parents who had felonies from being Adult Partners.  I saw a few comments that seemed to allude that is policy.... it isn’t. My sister who has a felony (credit card fraud... she had a bad drug issue in her late teens/early twenties) was approved to be a Den Leader.  

In the end, scouts are for the kids.  Find the best path possible to have your children enjoy scouting even if you and your bf have to deal with some humiliating situations.  That is the role of a parent sometimes.

[David CO]

21 hours ago, scoutmom86 said:

However, the only reason the CM knew is because she knows family of his ex wife. 

...or because it was in the newspaper. Either way, it really doesn't matter how the unit learned of his felony conviction or probation status.

[David CO]

 

Quote

it is entirely judgmental of anyone to shun someone who was trying to step in for a child who hasn’t had a decent father in his life at 10 years old. My kid is awkward. He has a hard time making friends at scouts. He has ADHD and a touch of autistic tendencies. And after 3 days of hard work on his regatta with this strange but great attention, he was psyched to show it off.

No, it isn't. It is the opposite of judgmental.

As a scout leader, I try very hard not to judge the personal relationships of the parents and scouts in my unit. It's really none of my business, and I wouldn't want to touch that conversation with a ten foot pole. It goes both ways. I wouldn't take any position, positive or negative, on whether or not the relationship is good for the scout. That is not for me to judge.

As far as I can see, there are only two issues that should be considered. He is not a relative. He is a felon on probation. All the rest is just smoke and mirrors.

 

Edited April 7, 2018 by David CO

[perdidochas]

On 4/6/2018 at 4:41 PM, Eagle1993 said:

Depends on how fast you are going and which state.  

I stand corrected.  

[bearess]

I’m not completely sure what you want here.  It sounds like your boyfriend is free to come to activities, but he has to stay with you— is that right?  He’s not banned.  It sounds like he planned to go to the event with you for the day and then bring the younger children home for the night.  The Cubmaster’s request didn’t make this impossible.  I’m sure it was embarrassing— it’s hard to be reminded that he’s still a subject of gossip.  But by then refusing to attend when conditions were placed on him, he also contributed to the outcome.  You say his son will be a Lion next year— how much better for his son if his dad, who has a history, has already begun the hard work of proving himself to the Pack.

You seem very focused on the unfairness of this.  Gently, I’d urge you to let that go if possible.  Your boyfriend’s worst moment was in the papers.  He’s going to have to deal with that and face the consequences, including the social consequences.  Why can’t he go to events?  Why should his embarrassment and feelings prevent him from supporting your son?  If he has changed, the only way for people to j ow that is if he shows them.  Refusing to attend events and comply with requests makes it seem like he will only be involved if his past is forgotten or swept under the rug.  He’s going to have to come to events, be involved, be positive.  That’s how you get people to move on, not by refusing to attend and staying home.

I also think you are forgetting how quick this all is.  I don’t know when the conviction occurred, but he’s not even off probation.  You’ve been together less than a year.  I don’t know when his marriage ended, but he has a two year old daughter.  In ten years, nobody will think a thing of this.  Right now, it’s still very fresh.  Be patient.

[scoutmom86]

I honestly just wanted to know if the Pack, or the cub master, had the authority to say what was said. My mind began to race and wonder why this was an issue, if it had been discussed at a committee meeting, or if it was just her own personal issue with him, specifically. As I said previously, I had never heard of this being an issue with anyone else in the Pack, aside from the sex offender issue. When I first began to date him, she made a comment about his character in a private conversation, which led me to believe she had a personal problem with him. You must also understand the small town mentality of the community I live in, where every rumor is true. It is also very awkward when we attend Pack events. So I know that this was mentioned in a public forum with other parents. Which is fine. It is what it is... he is not my son’s father. Understood.

The cubmaster made too many presumptions, and could’ve asked, instead of making her own judgment, creating tension for me. I didn’t do anything wrong or that warranted what was said. Nor did I ever have intentions of leaving him alone at an event with his “nonchildren”. 

Al that to say, I really just wanted to know if the cubmaster had the authority. And apparently she does. Rules are rules.

[ItsBrian]

37 minutes ago, scoutmom86 said:

Al that to say, I really just wanted to know if the cubmaster had the authority. And apparently she does. Rules are rules.

She’s just fulfilling her responsibility as cubmaster. All you have to do is prove her wrong & that the felony does not show who he is now. As bearess said, it’ll take a long time. Just make sure your children’s program are not affected.  

[FireStone]

On 4/6/2018 at 8:33 PM, scoutmom86 said:

So long as we only scrutinize one person in particular who we know because your friend is a gossip? Not all the other people participating as felons, as you all have said that it didn’t matter if it was blood related or not.

I've just read through this entire thread and I think my problem with this whole issue is your focus on your boyfriend being singled out. If your CM, Committee, or CO don't know about other possible felons attending activities, we don't know how they would react if they did know. But based on how this has been handled so far, I suspect those other folks would endure similar scrutiny. 

Regardless, I would suggest just accepting things as they are and not pushing the matter. Even when his son is a Lion, there is no guarantee of accepting him as a participant. Your CO has the right to exclude anyone, for any reason, criminal record or not. I have no criminal record, not even a speeding ticket, but if my CO decided they just didn't like me, they could send me packing tomorrow. That's the perks of the CO, they are the absolute authority on who can participate in a unit and who can't. Press the issue too hard and you could find your whole family asked to leave. 

Is that right? I don't think so. But again, COs can decide whatever they want. If you approach this with the attitude that "they’re going to have to swallow it all next year when his actual son is a Lion Cub," I think you might find things could actually get worse. 

Accept the decision of the CM, and use the time between now and his son joining to help him prove his commitment to living a better life. You can't be concerned about any other families, parents, participants, and their backgrounds. This is just about you and your boyfriend. And don't give the CM or anyone else a reason to make an even bigger issue of it. 

Edited May 27, 2018 by FireStone

[scoutmom86]

2 hours ago, FireStone said:

I've just read through this entire thread and I think my problem with this whole issue is your focus on your boyfriend being singled out. If your CM, Committee, or CO don't know about other possible felons attending activities, we don't know how they would react if they did know. But based on how this has been handled so far, I suspect those other folks would endure similar scrutiny. 

Regardless, I would suggest just accepting things as they are and not pushing the matter. Even when his son is a Lion, there is no guarantee of accepting him as a participant. Your CO has the right to exclude anyone, for any reason, criminal record or not. I have no criminal record, not even a speeding ticket, but if my CO decided they just didn't like me, they could send me packing tomorrow. That's the perks of the CO, they are the absolute authority on who can participate in a unit and who can't. Press the issue too hard and you could find your whole family asked to leave. 

Is that right? I don't think so. But again, COs can decide whatever they want. If you approach this with the attitude that "they’re going to have to swallow it all next year when his actual son is a Lion Cub," I think you might find things could actually get worse. 

Accept the decision of the CM, and use the time between now and his son joining to help him prove his commitment to living a better life. You can't be concerned about any other families, parents, participants, and their backgrounds. This is just about you and your boyfriend. And don't give the CM or anyone else a reason to make an even bigger issue of it. 

Can the CM do whatever he or she wants t? It’s a chartered organization. She doesn’t own it. There is a committee. And a company that sponsors the Pack.

With that being said, in any instance of any ingrievance anyone has, does she truly have the authority to make decisions that affect the Pack on her own without committee approval?

[David CO]

12 minutes ago, scoutmom86 said:

Can the CM do whatever he or she wants t? It’s a chartered organization. She doesn’t own it. There is a committee. And a company that sponsors the Pack.

With that being said, in any instance of any ingrievance anyone has, does she truly have the authority to make decisions that affect the Pack on her own without committee approval?

That is an excellent question. I think you are asking if the Chartered Organization can over-rule the unit leaders. Yes, it can.

[FireStone]

1 hour ago, scoutmom86 said:

Can the CM do whatever he or she wants t? It’s a chartered organization. She doesn’t own it. There is a committee. And a company that sponsors the Pack.

With that being said, in any instance of any ingrievance anyone has, does she truly have the authority to make decisions that affect the Pack on her own without committee approval?

The Chartered Organization is the authority over anything else at the unit level. As it relates to who can be a member of the pack and who can't, the CO outranks the CM and committee. 

In my pack the CM actually comes in fairly low in terms of authority on policy and procedure. The committee has, on occasion, voted to override a CM decision. Not sure if that is standard BSA procedure or not, though. 

Edited May 27, 2018 by FireStone

[David CO]

41 minutes ago, FireStone said:

In my pack the CM actually comes in fairly low in terms of authority on policy and procedure. The committee has, on occasion, voted to override a CM decision. Not sure if that is standard BSA procedure or not, though. 

This can happen if the COR (Chartered Organization Representative) is also a member of the unit committee, creating a sort of super-committee.

I don't think this is a good idea because, as you mentioned, it tends to undermine the authority of the Scoutmaster/Cubmaster.