Felon?

[ParkMan]

I'm confused. 

You didn't tell anyone about his felony record.  Did the Cubmaster tell you that he knows about it?

 

[scoutmom86]

Never told anyone about it. Never even really thought about telling anyone about it since it was that insignificant. He didn’t murder anyone or hurt any children. It’s simple possession.

CM knew because it’s a small town where everyone knows everyone and they all like to gossip! Especially the soccer Mom type of people who are the committee members of this pack.

[ValleyBoy]

As a former Cubmaster, I would have concerns about any cub scout attending pack activities with any non-family member without another adult family member present.  The reality is the only persons that a background check is preformed on are  registered adults inside the scouting program.  The difference between your father and your ex-husband attending events and your boy-friend attending events with your son is that the boy-friend is not a family member. 

[David CO]

10 hours ago, scoutmom86 said:

Never told anyone about it. Never even really thought about telling anyone about it since it was that insignificant. 

The judge didn't think so. The newspaper didn't think so. The scout unit didn't think so.

I think it is time you wake up and smell the coffee. A felony conviction is not insignificant.

 

Edited March 23, 2018 by David CO

[DuctTape]

The major point here for me (setting aside the criminal record for a moment) is that this is your boyfriend. He is not a parent, step-parent, legal guardian, or registered adult leader. For this reason alone he should not attend a cub function unless invited by the cubmaster and only within his /her parameters. 

I think you might be focusing too much on the criminal record piece and missing this important facet.

[Jameson76]

12 minutes ago, DuctTape said:

The major point here for me (setting aside the criminal record for a moment) is that this is your boyfriend. He is not a parent, step-parent, legal guardian, or registered adult leader. For this reason alone he should not attend a cub function unless invited by the cubmaster and only within his /her parameters. 

I think you might be focusing too much on the criminal record piece and missing this important facet.

Correct and good point.  For the Webelos visitation we have had Dads, Moms, Granddads, older brothers, aunts, etc and what we have termed Adult partners.  The expectation is they are there for that one Webelos (on in case of a Cub campout) that one Cub.  They are not leaders, they are not planning or directing. 

Now if the the conviction / probation may preclude being around youth, if the Unit leaders are made aware of that they would be within bounds to have them leave or not attend

[Hawkwin]

20 hours ago, scoutmom86 said:

almost done with probation with no infractions for a simple possession charge,

I can sympathize with your situation. I can also understand why you and he want to be active in this aspect of your scout's life.

But, let's keep in mind that scouting is not for us. It isn't for the adults or the parents or our close loved-ones. It is for the kids and there may be, and will be circumstances where we do things for the kids that may either disadvantage the adults or otherwise not be in the adults best interests.

If you and your boyfriend feel this strongly about him being an attending adult in activities then I encourage you to do two things.

1. Have him register as an adult volunteer.

2. Have him request an expungement and/or a pardon.

 

This could a strong life lesson for your scout as well as other scouts in the unit. Demonstrate that he is taking the steps to correct his prior transgressions and that he is willing to do the hard work necessary to be an active member of the unit.

Lastly, this isn't about what the other adults do in their personal time or what they might be guilty of. This is and should be about your boyfriend "doing his best" to be the best role model he can be to your scout and if that means his involvement is limited due to past behavior (even past behavior that might otherwise be legal today in some states), then what better way to illustrate that actions have consequences and that sometimes life is not fair.

How the two of you respond to this situation can either be an exceptional opportunity for growth or an exceptional opportunity to create resentment.

[perdidochas]

On 3/22/2018 at 1:46 PM, scoutmom86 said:

Back story: The guy I've been dating for almost a year has been quite active in my children's life and has taken interest in helping my 10 year old son with his scout activities. I'm a single mom to 3 children, and I've done everything from projects and derbies to volunteer and den leader in our pack up until now. It's a little of a relief to have someone in our lives to take the reigns for scouts, since it was intended to make time for my son and his dad once we split up. Since the divorce, my sons' father is inactive in their lives, and has been for the last 3 years.

Anyways, the guy I'm dating is a felon and is almost done with probation with no infractions for a simple possession charge, and has been rehabilitated and proven his sobriety over and over again thoughout the last year. He isn't looking to take leadership or do anything specific with the any other youth in the pack. But we would like to attend functions as a family. He is, after all, building their rain gutter regatta for this weekend.

SO...In conversation with the Scout Master about attendance to an overnighter scheduled for this Saturday, I was asked not to leave him alone--for this function and any other functions. Not that I intended to, but I felt like that was a little out of line and extremely pointless since he will be taking both my and his 2 year old daughters home for the night.

He has a son who will be scout age next year, so you mean to tell me he can't attend functions with his son without supervision?

My question is, I guess, how can a scout pack discriminate against someone who has been a significant and positive influence in my son's life for the last year? I know for a fact as an active member of the committee that they do NOT vet every single parent, only those who are in leadership. My father has taken my son to a campout, and has had some criminal issues from when he was younger. My son's father took him on one overnighter alone, and he is a convicted felon with a battery on a pregnant victim in the presence of a juvenile. All kinds of people mess up at some point in their lives. And I'd be willing to bet that if they did vet everyone, they'd find some skeletons. So we discriminate against anyone who has a criminal history from simply attending a function with a boy? I don't think that's fair. And if they will have a comment about one person, then shouldn't they HAVE to vet every parent who attends a function?

Needless to say, he has now decided not to attend this function or any other functions, and my scout loses out on a fun time as a family.

I think it was appropriate for him not to be alone with children. He's not a parent, nor a leader.  I wouldn't care if he's a felon or not, simply speaking. The only people that should be at BSA campouts are registered leaders and parents/guardians.  Anybody else should be escorted.   It's not discrimination, it's child safety.  Some Troops/packs  do vet every parent who attends a function.  They require all parents to fill out a leader form, and check them all out. It's a requirement for joining the Troop/Pack.  

[perdidochas]

On 3/22/2018 at 6:53 PM, scoutmom86 said:

I don't think she is out to get me either. And I understand protecting the children.

He has no desire to take leadership.

I also understand that not everyone has the greatest judgement, and I totally understand that it totally makes my life choices look pathetic. But the circumstances are not as they appear, and they surely aren't as they were portrayed in the newspaper.

Maybe I'm downplaying it in my own mind for my own sanity, but it doesn't seem like such a big deal to me. I just think that lots of people that participate in scout functions that aren't in any kind of leadership, but participate and attend have skeletons in their own closets. The only difference is that their skeletons weren't publicly exposed. And I think that if one person's shortcomings are going to be exposed, then all attendees should be exposed. It's a small town, and I'd be willing to bet the pack would downsize quite a bit.

In Scouts there is a difference between parents and Mom's boyfriend.  The standards are different.

On 3/22/2018 at 7:09 PM, ItsBrian said:

Your boyfriend and son wouldn’t be allowed to share a tent or anything either since he is not a legal family member. It’s really up to the cibmaster and committee since he really has no right to be there since it’s not his son.

Not saying it’s right, but saying how I interpret the rules.

Me, too.  

On 3/22/2018 at 9:38 PM, scoutmom86 said:

He’s not spending the night though, is the point in case. I didn’t ask the Cub Master anything. We were simply taking about the events of the day.

 Matter of fact, I never disclosed anything about him to anyone in the Pack! It is public record. Anyone can see it or research his or anyone else’s criminal history.

 As I said before, I’d be willing to bed MANY parents and guests have criminal records. And no one else has been pointed out or excluded.(As I said, even the sex offender attends.) I’ve never heard of anyone in any other organization single out or exclude people who willingly wanting to participate. And might I add, as step parents!

This hasn’t been some casual experience with some random stranger. He has been around for over 9 months. And as I also said before, it was never addressed before now. I know for a fact the Cub Master knee then too. He attended Blue and Gold Banquet &  Thanksgiving Feast.

It really is fine. I highly doubt he will attend any functions anymore, since he knows how everyone there feels about the situation. I mean, who wants to be somewhere where you know everyone things you’re a danger to the children?

I really wasn’t aware that this was such a huge issue. And I didn’t know if it was policy or just a decision made by the committee, or if she just made it up since she doesn’t really like him, as she has made that clear to me before on a personal level.

Thank you all for your clarity on the subject. Goodnight!

It's not personal, IMHO.  I think the way he treated you would be the way any mother's boyfriend should be treated, felony or not.  

 

On 3/22/2018 at 11:09 PM, scoutmom86 said:

Never told anyone about it. Never even really thought about telling anyone about it since it was that insignificant. He didn’t murder anyone or hurt any children. It’s simple possession.

CM knew because it’s a small town where everyone knows everyone and they all like to gossip! Especially the soccer Mom type of people who are the committee members of this pack.

IMHO, felony possession isn't simple.  It's major.  

 

On 3/23/2018 at 9:14 AM, David CO said:

The judge didn't think so. The newspaper didn't think so. The scout unit didn't think so.

I think it is time you wake up and smell the coffee. A felony conviction is not insignificant.

 

Yup. 

On 3/23/2018 at 10:11 AM, DuctTape said:

The major point here for me (setting aside the criminal record for a moment) is that this is your boyfriend. He is not a parent, step-parent, legal guardian, or registered adult leader. For this reason alone he should not attend a cub function unless invited by the cubmaster and only within his /her parameters. 

I think you might be focusing too much on the criminal record piece and missing this important facet.

I agree.  We have a lot of youth protection rules, and they distinguish between parents and mom's boyfriend.  It may be old-fashioned, but it's the rules.  

 

In terms of who you have at your meetings, it can be scary, especially in terms of Tiger Cubs. When I was in tiger cubs, we had one Tiger who was usually brought by his grandmother (dad was in the restaurant business, mom was across town with her boyfriend or husband (I never met her), but sometimes by his dad. Once the Tiger's uncle brought him.  A couple of weeks later, I looked at the sex offenders in the local area. Sure enough, the Tiger's uncle was on the list (and it was for a sex crime on an under 12 year old).  I immediately told the CM, and thankfully, the uncle never showed up again.  

 

 

[SSScout]

We are the results of our choices.  Trust lost must be re-earned. Your manfriend (he isn't a "boy", is he?) is not family , yet.  He shows much maturity by his patience.  

He should sign up in my dot scouting dot com and take the Youth Protection Training.  I assume you have already, if you were a Den Leader.  He will be accepted in the Scout "family" by his willingness to put the Scout's needs and activities first.   It will come, but as has been said, right now , he is not "family" per Scout definition, but he is your "guest".  Smile alot, accept the ignorance of others as something you may not change immediately. Educate them with your actions and forgive them their lack of tolerance (which is not the same as "intolerance", yes?) .

Your comparison of your manfriend's history with that of others (small town, gossip, etc.) is understandable and IMO should not be stooped to in your efforts to have your son's Scout career include his new adult friend.  

Good Scouting to the three of you. See you on the trail.

[scoutmom86]

SSScout,

 I appreciate your thoughts on this. I do believe that trust has to be re-earned. Especially in small towns where they make mountains of molehills. (And thanks for the manfriend, because “boyfriend” is not a word I use in reference to him). Some folks actually do live and learn, and walk the right paths. 

Although I doubt he will ever dare to make an appearance at another event after this, we will venture on, my son and I. One more year for his Arrow of Light, and we are off to bigger and better things. My guy is much more helpful at home with the girls (both his and my 2 years old). The 3 boys (my scout, his and my younger son) and I had a blast for the day events and came home to sleep in our own beds.

If he ever does decide to venture out with us, we will make sure to do things to the book. As for the “tolerance” of the pack, they’re going to have to swallow it all next year when his actual son is a Lion Cub. They’ll have to do more than “tolerate” his attendance.

 

[David CO]

11 hours ago, scoutmom86 said:

As for the “tolerance” of the pack, they’re going to have to swallow it all next year when his actual son is a Lion Cub. They’ll have to do more than “tolerate” his attendance.

Not necessarily. I have been focusing on the question you proposed to us. Now you are talking about an entirely different issue.

Next year, the unit will have several options they can choose from. They can accept him with open arms, they can deny his son from joining the unit, or they can avoid both extremes and  choose some middle ground that they can live with. Of course, the ability to find and choose a middle ground depends largely on the cooperation of the parent. 

If you think the unit will have to "swallow it" and do more than "tolerate" his attendance, you are very sadly mistaken. You may feel that they are trying to make a mountain out of a molehill, but they may feel that you are trying to make a molehill out of a mountain.

 

[WisconsinMomma]

Hi Scoutmom 86,

I did not read the whole thread, but it sounds like your Cubmaster is being cautious about the situation, and that's understandable.   If the Cubmaster does not yet know your boyfriend/fiancee very well, then give it some time. Attending events together at first sounds like a fair plan.  You have put in time with the Pack, and that is great.  I am so glad your son is having a great experience too!  I think that things will get easier as people get to know your fiancee better, but a slow start sounds appropriate to me.  It should get more comfortable for everyone over time assuming that he is a a great person and there are no red flags or other concerns that arise.   Try not to stress out over it too much.  In my Pack, there are certainly people with strong opinions but you can rest assured that we don't have everyone thinking the exact same thing, ever.  It just doesn't happen.  There should be some friendly people around, but it may take a while to find out who's easygoing and welcoming and who's not so much.  

Best wishes!  Big picture if your son is enjoying Scouting that is great!  Thank you for everything you do to support your Pack.  

[ItsBrian]

5 hours ago, David CO said:

Oh, come on!

He is a felon. He is not a great person. I don't want to go over the top in criticizing him, but let's not put him up for sainthood either.

She’s just being courteous.

[scoutmom86]

7 hours ago, WisconsinMomma said:

 If the Cubmaster does not yet know your boyfriend/fiancee very well, then give it some time.

They know of him, and they know what people say about him. I didn’t know him then, so I can’t vouch for that. And they didn’t know him then either.

I really do understand caution and protection of the little ones. Reading through this whole conversation makes it seem like I’m defending him for what he has done like what he did was okay. It wasn’t.

i just never realized how much it affected everyone around. I never intended to leave him alone at an overnight event, so I guess I just took it too personally in the moment.