Same CO...multiple CORs

[CNYScouter]

I am at a scout youth training training event. I was discussing COR's with an adult leader from another unit who said that their Pack, Troop and Crew had the same CO but each had a different COR. When I said that each CO should have only one COR the person responded that they had just gone through an issue with having to replace the COR and the BSA has changed the rules and allows a CO to have multiple COR's. A few years ago I ran COR training and it wasn't like this. Did this change? If so when?

 

Edited February 17, 2018 by CNYScouter
Fixed spelling

[Eagle1993]

We just had an issue in January where my Pack charter was held up as the Troop (same CO) listed a new and different COR. The council eventually let my charter go thru but they made the Troop change their COR back.  So, I think this is still the rule.... at least in my council.

[NJCubScouter]

Chartered organizations that operate more than one unit must register the same individual as the chartered organization representative.

THE CHARTERED ORGANIZATION REPRESENTATIVE GUIDEBOOK, https://filestore.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/511-421(16)_WEB.pdf, 2015 printing, page 13.

Although the printing date is 2015, it is still on the BSA’s official web site.  So if we assume that the BSA does not keep publications on their web site with outdated information (more of a hope than an assumption, actually), the one-COR-per-CO rule is still in effect.

 

[David CO]

I am wondering if the units might actually have different CO's. My school has both cub scouts and boy scouts. The PTO is the CO of the cub scouts. The Athletic Association is the CO of the boy scouts. 

[ItsBrian]

3 hours ago, David CO said:

I am wondering if the units might actually have different CO's. My school has both cub scouts and boy scouts. The PTO is the CO of the cub scouts. The Athletic Association is the CO of the boy scouts. 

Maybe. It’s two different nonprofits and have no ties to each other so I guess it wouldn’t count as one CO.

[Eagle94-A1]

After I left the troop I grew up in, I stayed in contact. Don't know how, but they had 3 different CORs: one for the pack, one for the troop, and one for the crew.  I could understand how there were 2 different CORs since the pack was one number, and the troop left a CO and kept the original number. So I could see how that got overlooked. But the crew had the same number as the troop. 

 

What was funny was the SM of the troop was the COR/CC of the crew, and the crew advisor was the COR/CC of the troop.

[SSScout]

Simple.  One CO , one COR.    Check and see what your Unit signed on with. THAT is your CO.    Three units with one CO (my home Pack/Troop/Crew), one CO.   Yes, we had to correct that misperception some years back (Pack registered with a Different CO than the Troop and Crew. Council never questioned it), it was easy.   Now, however, the present COR (fine, interested in Scouting man), is over 80, in declining health, and wants to resign.  The Pastor of the church (the fabled "IH"), is having a problem finding a church member who is Scout Positive and will serve.... 

 

[CNYScouter]

Thanks for confirming my understanding that there is only one COR for each CO. Without going into details it seems that the Pack and crew had issues with the COR and asked for the COR to be replaced. The troop didnt want to switch CORs. Our councils compromise was to have each ubit have thier own COR. They asked that the key 3 from each unit take COR training and this us where they were told it was ok to have multiple CORs.

 

[5yearscouter]

Our Chartering Org has a different COR for the pack, troop and crew.

But national wants it to be one person

Every year at recharter whoever's charter that gets renewed first resets the cor for each unit and then council registrar has to go in and change em back.

 

[blw2]

I never really thought about this...as our COR, not once in my years with the pack and troop ever showed up to a single meeting that I attended...committee or otherwise.  I never personally have ever spoken to the man.

BUT

If I were appointed COR for a unit, I'd pretty much insist on doing just one unit, and I'd tell BSA to take a hike on any such rule.  I say this because I'd like to think that as COR I'd try to attend at least a majority of the committee meetings, and at least some of the troop meetings and events....I'd recon that to be at least maybe 1-3 meetings per month.  That would be double the meetings if I were doing a troop + pack....and triple if there was also a crew.  No thanks

[David CO]

21 minutes ago, blw2 said:

I never really thought about this...as our COR, not once in my years with the pack and troop ever showed up to a single meeting that I attended...committee or otherwise.  I never personally have ever spoken to the man.

BUT

If I were appointed COR for a unit, I'd pretty much insist on doing just one unit, and I'd tell BSA to take a hike on any such rule.  I say this because I'd like to think that as COR I'd try to attend at least a majority of the committee meetings, and at least some of the troop meetings and events....I'd recon that to be at least maybe 1-3 meetings per month.  That would be double the meetings if I were doing a troop + pack....and triple if there was also a crew.  No thanks

It is obvious that you do not understand the role of the COR. 

[The Blancmange]

On 2/18/2018 at 11:19 AM, CNYScouter said:

Thanks for confirming my understanding that there is only one COR for each CO. Without going into details it seems that the Pack and crew had issues with the COR and asked for the COR to be replaced. The troop didnt want to switch CORs. Our councils compromise was to have each ubit have thier own COR. They asked that the key 3 from each unit take COR training and this us where they were told it was ok to have multiple CORs.

 

Are each of them allowed to vote at council annual meetings?  That would seem to give that particular CO disproportionate influence. 

[blw2]

3 hours ago, David CO said:

It is obvious that you do not understand the role of the COR. 

well, you're right that I've never seen it done or attempted...

....but let's see... a few random bullet points from the first few pages of the BSA's COR handbook

1. help their unit be successful
2. help coordination between scouting (the unit/council) and the CO
3. be a voting member in district and council (I would assume that means to represent the CO and The CO's unit)
4. help recruit unit leaders (and this would also involve knowing when a key leader needs to be replaced)
5. Assist with recharter
6. suggest good turns to your unit
7. promote well planned programs
8. bring in district help
9. coordinate with other units in your area
10. cultivate resources to help your units

Pretty much all of these things would require a working knowledge of the unit and the CO. 

Which of these would imply that the COR shouldn't attend at least some of the meetings and activities to see what's going on?

I get that the COR is a voting member in the district or council....so in that way you need ONE representing the CO

My bigger point was that the BSA should be more mindful than they seem to be of the sacrifice of time that it requests from it's volunteers....and from the charter orgs too!

Edited February 20, 2018 by blw2

[NJCubScouter]

I do not think it is typical for the COR to attend meetings on a regular basis (or at all, probably with an exception for ceremonial occasions), unless of course the COR is also a member of the committee.  (In which case they would attend committee meetings, not necessarily troop meetings.) In my experience about half of the COR's also choose to be on the committee.

I think the BSA rule of one-COR-per-CO is reasonable.  It makes sense to have one person be the official liaison between the CO and all of the CO's Scouting units.  Unless there is some unusual situation, the time involved is really not all that substantial.  (Unless the COR is also on one or more of the unit committees, which of course is voluntary.)  Most of the items are "help" or "assist" with things that are someone else's day-to-day responsibility.

Edited February 21, 2018 by NJCubScouter

[CalicoPenn]

The Chartered Organization Representative is appointed primarily to represent the CO at District and Council meetings.  It is a secondary responsibility to represent the CO at unit meetings.  The COR isn't a regular member of the committee and should rarely meet with the committee.  The COR should, however, meet several times per year (with no definition of several - since 2 is more than one, that might count as several) with the other two members of the Unit Key 3 (Committee Chair and Scoutmaster/Cubmaster, etc.). 

Each CO only gets one representative to District and Council, regardless of the number of units the CO has.  Thus the "rule".

If COs want to have a different representative of the CO liaise with each unit, they can do so - but those people would not be the CO's Chartered Organization Representative.