Concerns with coed rules, leadership, liability

[Col. Flagg]

44 minutes ago, Tampa Turtle said:

I keep hearing that "Family Scouting" is NOT synonymous with "Girls in Scouting".

Aren't those the same girls from that "photo op"?

[Col. Flagg]

18 minutes ago, cyphertext said:

But we also have a Troop Guide that is assigned as their patrol leader to teach them scouting skills on campouts. 

Non-NSP units have these too.  They're called Patrol Leaders and Instructors. Adults drink coffee and train the Instructors when needed if a JASM is not around.

46 minutes ago, walk in the woods said:

Winter 2018 Commissioner Newsletter says some about Family Scouting (although nothing really new):

I've seen more four leaf clovers in the last 15 years than I have seen UCs.

[gblotter]

2 minutes ago, Col. Flagg said:

Aren't those the same girls from that "photo op"?

Sure looks like it to me. I don't think we can even assume these girls are actually enrolled in Cub Scouts. They could very well be child models recruited by a PR agency. That should not surprise anyone - such practices are normal and expected in corporate marketing campaigns.

[Tampa Turtle]

That's OK it is all 'interim' - nothing to see here. Please move along.

But swell, they sure are cute.

[Jameson76]

14 minutes ago, Col. Flagg said:

Aren't those the same girls from that "photo op"?

Sort of looks like them

FLYER - 

GIRL BEING INTERVIEWED ON CBS

 

You don't mean (SHOCKED FACE) that the whole thing was STAGED!!!

[Jameson76]

7 minutes ago, Tampa Turtle said:

That's OK it is all 'interim' - nothing to see here. Please move along.

But swell, they sure are cute.

I don't think you can say cute...but I have not taken the recently updated YPT, so not 100% sure

[cyphertext]

14 minutes ago, Col. Flagg said:

Non-NSP units have these too.  They're called Patrol Leaders and Instructors. Adults drink coffee and train the Instructors when needed if a JASM is not around.

We obviously have that as well.  My point is that even though it is a NSP, they have an older boy that joins their patrol to be their patrol leader and teach them their basic scouting skills.  Our Instructors lead demonstrations at the troop level, where our Troop Guides are directly tied to the first year patrols.

[Jameson76]

19 minutes ago, Col. Flagg said:

I've seen more four leaf clovers in the last 15 years than I have seen UCs.

For us they are sort of like a rare solar eclipse.  They come by, introduce themselves, then we never see them again.  As far as I can tell they have never directly contacted the SM, CC, or any adults.  They have (and I have seen 2 visits in 10 years) only come by, stayed about 30 minutes, and we never hear from them again.  We presume there is some sort of write up or report that is filed at the district, then filed at the council, then filed at regional, then filed at National.  Sort of a vision of Soviet era paperwork being shuttled along and boxes checked.

In theory commissioners are good, not sure in practicality if they actually do anything.

[Tampa Turtle]

We have one that stops by a couple times a month. It helps that he lives nearby and many moons ago his boy Eagled in the Troop. He watches some meetings, sits in on a CC or two, and attends the occasional COH. A couple times I have had some bureaucratic question and he did look into it and get back to us. Occasionally he has told us not to ask a question.

[FireStone]

Looks like those girls are not models, but actual scouts. Which is cool. I'm not against using models in advertising and marketing, but for something like Scouting, I think it's preferrable to show real scouts. Even if they are real scouts doing staged activities.

[Gwaihir]

2 hours ago, Tampa Turtle said:

I keep hearing that "Family Scouting" is NOT synonymous with "Girls in Scouting".

But I just got a scouting email with a FAQ to questions about "Family Scouting". (https://scoutingwire.org/3-places-to-get-answers-to-your-questions-about-family-scouting/?utm_source=scoutingwire&utm_campaign=swvolunteer2142018&utm_medium=email&utm_content=A) and when I go to BSA Brand Center for photos under "Family Scouting" it is clearly based on 90% girls for Cub Scouts. 

Attached is a screen shot. (It is from https://scouting.webdamdb.com/bp/#/folder/3482216/)  They couldn't show boys and girls together or a family with a son and daughter? I know this is for recruiting...but really? Is it just me? I mean none of this stuff is probably cheap. I'd much rather see something like @Cambridgeskip's picture of his "co-ed" scouts.

 

 

Devils advocate, if they're trying to set a tone of separate but equal, this is the mental imagery you'd do it with.  girls all together without boys, doing cub scouting. 

[RememberSchiff]

@FireStone  welcome to scouter.com

[Gwaihir]

side note, I love how the cap is no longer part of complete uniforming.  

[Back Pack]

3 hours ago, Col. Flagg said:

He may had misread what @Tampa Turtle wrote, thinking it was the mom of the Scout in the BOR. You know, the Scout's mom sitting in on her son's BOR...which would be highly odd.

I did misread it that way. I thought it was the same mom in both instances. 

[Eagle94-A1]

2 hours ago, cyphertext said:

I like the idea of NSPs... and how it was implemented in our troop.  Although I can see where you might say it is Cub Scoutish... maybe what Webelos should be. 

I think that is the major problem. Webelos IS suppose to be the transition period between Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts. They are suppose to be treated as Boy Scouts but still under the direction of an adult Den Leader,  and if lucky a Den Chief. My den growing up and my two older sons dens were just like that, and making the transition was/is smooth. Youngest son's den is also like that.

I think this is where many WDLs screw up. They keep treating the Webelos as full blown Cub Scouts, and not in transition. They are not  upping the expectations, and are still in "Do Your Best" mode. Had a nice chat with the SM and a few other adults about the differences between the Webelos we are getting from one pack, and the Webelos from another pack. Told them that any Webelos with Arrow Of Light should be able to automatically earn their Scout Rank the night they cross over since Scout Rank and the Scouting Adventure Activity badge is 99.99999% identical. Even made a bet on it with the SM. Which reminds me, I need to remind the SM to make me a "Death by Chocolate" cake on the next camp out that he owes me.

Because the feeder pack's Webelos dens are not fully transitioning,  I am considering going back to WDL once youngest crosses over in December. Out of 9 who crossed over in April, 4 remain, and 2 don't seem to be interested in the program. And out of the 3 we got in December, only 1 has been to any meetings or camp outs.