Star Wars: The Last Jedi and the Boy (Girl) Scouts of America

[scoutldr]

I'll just wait for it to run on free TV...when I have nothing better to do.  And save about $10.50 on a bag of popcorn and a coke.

[CalicoPenn]

On 1/1/2018 at 9:46 PM, TAHAWK said:

Another way to "vote" is to stay and work to brighten the corner of Scouting where you are.

 

Have J. Depp and "Babs" left the U.S. as promised in 2004 when they were unhappy?

J. Depp moved to France so at least one of them kept their promise.

[Sentinel947]

3 hours ago, scoutldr said:

I'll just wait for it to run on free TV...when I have nothing better to do.  And save about $10.50 on a bag of popcorn and a coke.

Not a bad plan. One of my former Scouts is a manager at the local movie theatre, so I went to see it a second time for free. A regular popcorn was $8!!!! What is this madness? 

[RememberSchiff]

21 minutes ago, Sentinel947 said:

...A regular popcorn was $8!!!! What is this madness? 

Yes but popped, ready to eat. I know youth groups that sell it for more $ unpopped!

[NJCubScouter]

Well, the movie tickets, the popcorn and the diet Cokes were a lot cheaper than any number of other things we could have been doing on New Year's Eve. 

[Tampa Turtle]

SSF I guess we are just going to ignore Yoda as an obvious Christ figure and Luke is Saul/Paul. Or is is Obi-Wan the Christ figure. Or is the Sith/Jedi issue more of a pre-Gnostic view of Dualism. Personally I saw the Casino scene at Canto Bight reminiscent of a Lutheran's Woman's Basement Coffee except you have to substitute Coffee Cake for graft and debauchery.

Admiral Ackbar is OBVIOUSLY a nod to St. Thomas Becket and frankly both deserved better. I'd direct your outrage there.

I was a bit bored with the Rey charactor (I liked the Rose one much more) in this movie. My son did not see her as male or female just the young Jedi propagandist. At the risk of seeming a wee bit sexist when I want my dose of liberal "You Go Girl" I prefer Gal Gadot's Wonder Woman for two reasons: (1) Wonder Woman's legs vs Rey's weird leggings/wrappings and (2) *sigh* Gal Gadot.

[Tampa Turtle]

17 minutes ago, NJCubScouter said:

Well, the movie tickets, the popcorn and the diet Cokes were a lot cheaper than any number of other things we could have been doing on New Year's Eve. 

Well we always do the matinee sans refreshments. The Turtle household entertainment hierarchy is  a tightfisted public library videos with the occasional Redbox and a rare matinee treat. 

[SSF]

11 hours ago, Sentinel947 said:

So the agenda is to accurately represent women in movies, how subversive.... 

 

As for Girls Rule, Boy's Drool. That's been a television trope/ pop culture for a very long time. Just look at Everybody Loves Raymond, Family Guy and The Simpsons. It's even somewhat present in the original trilogy, with Leia, the smart dignified leader, vs Han, the unethical, shady, shoot first ask questions never criminal. 

Let's look at the characters in Last Jedi and examine "Girls rule, boys drool" 

Spoilers below

 

 

Rey: Luke refuses to teach her  because she does not resist the darkness when it calls to her. She goes into the cave of the dark side for selfish reasons, to seek her parents identity. She only finally resists the darkness when she realizes it's full of lies.  She then naively goes to Kylo Ren and tries to turn him based off a feeling. She's definitely a hero of the film, and a strong female lead (and I think Ridley is a fine actress) but her character is hardly perfect. She makes several mistakes. 

Vice Admiral Holdo: All heroism aside: She fails to communicate with her subordinates, which causes them to mutiny out of desperation. Cluing in her subordinates would have kept the Finn and Rose misadventure from happening. That's as much on Holdo as it is on Poe. 

Leia: She spents most of the movie in a coma, so I'm ignoring her. 

Luke: Overcomes his loss and fear to stall the First Orders advance and save the Rebellion. 

Yoda: Comes back at the perfect time to break Luke out of his fear and loss. 

Finn: Goes on a heroic suicide mission to save the Rebels from Snokes Star Destroyer and later the Siege Cannon, is stopped by the sappy love of Rose. This was the character who was trying to run away all of Episode 7 and the beginning of 8. 

Poe: Learns his lesson to not always rush into battle, uses his brains to realize their is an escape route out of the Mining complex, saving the rebellion, even after Leia has basically thrown in the towel.

In summary; many of the charters in Last Jedi are flawed characters who grow throughout the movie. It paid homage to bit's and pieces of the original trilogy without being a slave to those movies. You're free to disagree, but I think you're inserting the culture wars into something that really doesn't have it. 

I just saw the movie again tonight, I totally don't agree that the added influence of women is ruining Star Wars. A New Hope was influenced in a large way by Luca's first wife Marcia. http://www.syfy.co.uk/news/3-ways-which-marcia-lucas-helped-save-star-wars-0 
 

 

True, it's an old gag about "smart women and dim witted men" in comedies (as well as a lot of commercials) but I think we can agree that Star Wars isn't a tongue in cheek or low brow comedy.

Sorry, the banter between Leia and Han in the original trilogy hardly constitutes a feminist agenda in the movie.

Lucas never made Han seem like an incompetent moron while Leia was perfect and always had the solution for everything. That's just not an accurate comparison at all.

When SW, ESB and ROTJ came out, there was no mass backlash against the movie because of subvert themes of feminism or any other social/political agendas...because there were none. Can the same be said of the Last Jedi...?

Obviously, I have a very different take on the portrayal of the Last Jedi characters than you do though, as do many others.

I'm genuinely glad you liked the movie though. If you liked it, then continue to support it and go see the sequel. A lot of people, myself included, have already written that off and washed our hands of Star Wars. 

[SSF]

1 hour ago, Tampa Turtle said:

SSF I guess we are just going to ignore Yoda as an obvious Christ figure and Luke is Saul/Paul. Or is is Obi-Wan the Christ figure. Or is the Sith/Jedi issue more of a pre-Gnostic view of Dualism. Personally I saw the Casino scene at Canto Bight reminiscent of a Lutheran's Woman's Basement Coffee except you have to substitute Coffee Cake for graft and debauchery.

Admiral Ackbar is OBVIOUSLY a nod to St. Thomas Becket and frankly both deserved better. I'd direct your outrage there.

I was a bit bored with the Rey charactor (I liked the Rose one much more) in this movie. My son did not see her as male or female just the young Jedi propagandist. At the risk of seeming a wee bit sexist when I want my dose of liberal "You Go Girl" I prefer Gal Gadot's Wonder Woman for two reasons: (1) Wonder Woman's legs vs Rey's weird leggings/wrappings and (2) *sigh* Gal Gadot.

I'm glad you and your son liked the movie. A lot of people who saw it were pretty let down by it though, but if what this movies conveyed is your thing, then I'm glad it worked for you.

[Sentinel947]

7 minutes ago, SSF said:

True, it's an old gag about "smart women and dim witted men" in comedies (as well as a lot of commercials) but I think we can agree that Star Wars isn't a tongue in cheek or low brow comedy.

Sorry, the banter between Leia and Han in the original trilogy hardly constitutes a feminist agenda in the movie.

Lucas never made Han seem like an incompetent moron while Leia was perfect and always had the solution for everything. That's just not an accurate comparison at all.

When SW, ESB and ROTJ came out, there was no mass backlash against the movie because of subvert themes of feminism or any other social/political agendas...because there were none. Can the same be said of the Last Jedi...?

Obviously, I have a very different take on the portrayal of the Last Jedi characters than you do though, as do many others.

I'm genuinely glad you liked the movie though. If you liked it, then continue to support it and go see the sequel. A lot of people, myself included, have already written that off and washed our hands of Star Wars. 

We'll agree to disagree. 

[Tampa Turtle]

32 minutes ago, SSF said:

I'm glad you and your son liked the movie. A lot of people who saw it were pretty let down by it though, but if what this movies conveyed is your thing, then I'm glad it worked for you.

As someone who saw the first one the first week wearing a homemade Starwars T-shirt because no merchandise was available yet it has all been downhill since The Empire Strikes Back.

[Tampa Turtle]

I am struggling to understand the angst. Perhaps I am overly sentimental about the franchise since my family too were once moisture farmers...

[NJCubScouter]

14 hours ago, Sentinel947 said:

I just saw the movie again tonight, I totally don't agree that the added influence of women is ruining Star Wars. A New Hope was influenced in a large way by Luca's first wife Marcia. http://www.syfy.co.uk/news/3-ways-which-marcia-lucas-helped-save-star-wars-0 
 

Thanks for that link, Sentinel, I didn't know about any of that.  Some of the comments below the article are, um, interesting too.  One guy tries to minimize the ex-Mrs. Lucas's role by saying that in later films, George did just fine without her.  Like when, the prequel trilogy?  Maybe she could have edited out Jar Jar and the whole midichlorian thing.  Maybe even the battle-droids.  ("Roger Roger.")

[qwazse]

19 hours ago, SSF said:

... Obviously, I have a very different take on the portrayal of the Last Jedi characters than you do though, as do many others. ...

Well there's no point in writing about something if you don't have a different take.

Many others have a different take than TT, but many have the same take. Americans have a lot of religious anxt, and depending on where you live, you'll hear more about it than others elsewhere.

@Tampa Turtle unlike you, I'm a fool for veiled heroines. Demographics, I suppose.

[Tampa Turtle]

@qwazse 'veiled heroines'? Like the new Ms. Marvel....I rather like her...

To be honest I am more Star Trek than Star Wars but broad minded enough to enjoy both universes*. I have an old acquaintance in the comics industry and you should read the threads that THOSE folks rage about...eclectic and opinionated group about culture in media. With pictures. 

*The Turtle teenage household DOES have a bitter dispute between the DC vs. Marvel universes that may need a latter-day 'Peace of Westphalia' to restore the domestic tranquility. And our dinner table (because we are one of those 'everyone sits down and eats dinner together no matter what" families) do express a full range of religious angst. Oy Vey!