Maybe girls in Scouts will be like girls in hockey

[WisconsinMomma]

My youngest son is starting to play hockey this season.  While hockey is boy-dominated,  some girls play hockey too.

I wonder if girls' participation in Boy Scouts will look like their participation in hockey.

This is what I have observed as an inexperienced hockey parent:

1)  Some girls play hockey

2) Some teams include boys and girls, these teams generally have more boys than girls

3)  Some organizations have boy only  teams and girl  only teams.

4) An organization that needed more girls borrowed some girls from another organization to have enough girls for their second girls' team.

5)  Hockey girls play hard.  According to an experienced dad -- there are no princesses out there.

6)  There are not enough girls teams for girls to only play girls,  so the girls teams play other girls teams and mixed-gender teams, and boy teams.

 

Just food for thought.   There are not as many girls playing hockey as boys but the youth hockey organizations make it work so girls have an opportunity to learn and play.

 

[Eagle94-A1]

How do the boys on coed teams feel? How do the boys feel playing against girls?

I know my youngest hates the idea of girls joining Cub Scouts because he said it will ruin the program. When I asked why, he told me the story of the Boys Club and Girls Club the homeschool group had. Boys Club had a very active program, with lots of running around and Nerf gun fights. he didn't know what the girls did, but there was not a lot of attendance, and they started cancelling meetings. Someone came up with the idea of merging the two groups. Activities the boy wanted, life Nerf gun fights were stopped because of the girls. Eventually attendance at the coed club dropped because the boys no longer were having fun. The club folded within months of going coed.

Maybe boys joined the Boy Scouts because it was one of the few safe places to still be a boy? And now that is taken away from them. Something to consider.

[WisconsinMomma]

My biggest takeaway from observing girls and girls teams in hockey is how youth hockey organizations work together to create opportunities with limited resources.  Maybe this is something that Troops can do , or Districts -- to help interested girls and their families find each other and work together to benefit the girls' program and form some girls' "teams" in the BSA. 

With girls in hockey, I think there is some natural hesitation in a game to play hard against female opponents, but in my observation, the boys get over that pretty quick. How do the boys feel when they are out skated by a talented female player?  I don't know if it's that different when they are out skated by a male player. I imagine it's frustrating either way. 

In hockey uniforms, they all look nearly the same, except for the ponytails.  

My son is on a C team and he didn't really have a choice to have girls on his team or not. One of our C teams has girls on it, I would guess 3 or 4, and the other C team is all boys.   Our boys' team beat a girls team earlier this season,  my husband insinuated it was less of a victory.  We play another girls team later in the season that has a very strong record and the boys are going to have to work hard for it if they want to win. 

The only thing I told my son about playing with the girls is: don't be afraid to play hard against the girls.  You play hard every game. 

Edited to add:  Note that the rules of hockey are exactly the same for male and female players. 

Edited December 28, 2017 by WisconsinMomma

[WisconsinMomma]

Girls in hockey truths:

https://www.buzzfeed.com/crystalro/things-girls-who-played-ice-hockey-know-to-be-true?utm_term=.xkqOYdPDD3#.bigr7AOPPQ

 

Mote girls joining hockey

http://wgntv.com/2017/12/20/more-girls-are-stepping-into-the-rink-joining-youth-hockey-leagues/

 

Getting rid of ice girls

http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/article/hey-nhl-lets-treat-women-as-equals-and-ice-the-ice-girls

 

Struggles of a female hockey fan

https://www.theodysseyonline.com/the-struggles-of-female-hockey-fan

 

Being a girl in a male dominated sport

 I remember shaking my opponents hands and then out of no where, one of their dad's comes over, looks at me straight in the eyes and says, "you are a girl. You should not be here, I have no respect for you." I was in shock. It stuck with me throughout the whole night, but what that man said inspired me more to keep on wrestling.

https://www.theodysseyonline.com/girl-male-dominated-sport

Edited December 28, 2017 by WisconsinMomma

[WisconsinMomma]

I realize this topic is not pulling people in, but thought I'd follow-up with a breakdown of the kids at my son's practice last night. 

Two teams practicing, approximately 26 kids -- that's 22 boys and 4 girls.

I noticed that the girls stuck together for the partner practices, so things like skating around and passing a puck back and forth.  Also when they were lined up to do some drills the girls were sticking together.  

However, I noticed my son having a brief chit chat with a female player.   

Overall, the coaches kept the kids very busy with their practice.   These are squirts, ages 9 and 10. 

[ianwilkins]

On 12/28/2017 at 3:41 AM, Eagle94-A1 said:

How do the boys on coed teams feel? How do the boys feel playing against girls?

I know my youngest hates the idea of girls joining Cub Scouts because he said it will ruin the program. When I asked why, he told me the story of the Boys Club and Girls Club the homeschool group had. Boys Club had a very active program, with lots of running around and Nerf gun fights. he didn't know what the girls did, but there was not a lot of attendance, and they started cancelling meetings. Someone came up with the idea of merging the two groups. Activities the boy wanted, life Nerf gun fights were stopped because of the girls. Eventually attendance at the coed club dropped because the boys no longer were having fun. The club folded within months of going coed.

Maybe boys joined the Boy Scouts because it was one of the few safe places to still be a boy? And now that is taken away from them. Something to consider.

Then your boy needs to talk to their leaders and say "if you do have a girls den, my programme must not change". Like the anecdote says, if you change the programme to accommodate some perceived difference, then it might not suit the majority. Girls will be joining because they want to do "Cub Scout" things, if those things go away, yes, expect membership to hemorrhage.

WisconsinMama's experience of mixed hockey chimes with my experience of my boy playing cricket, they had a couple of girls on the team, not enough to make a whole team, they all played to the same rules, and the bowlers didn't go easy on the batters if they were girls.

Do kids really go into all that "safe space to be a boy"? Do they not join because (a) a parent sends them, or (b) their friends do it, or (c) it looks like fun? Or a subtle combination of the three. If your boy joined to have a nerf war, and that's what Boy Scouts do, then girls joining should be girls that want to have a nerf war too, and the nerf wars should carry on. 

Or to take an example from my (mixed) explorers

Me: You want to play a physical game? What physical game do you want to play?

Ex: Mat Push!

Me: What?

Ex: You put a gym mat down on the floor and you try and push each other off it.

Me: Okay, remove jewellry, no punching scratching biting hair pulling or gouging...go!

No quarter given or asked for. It was asked for by boys and girls because that's what they wanted to do, so we did it, and everyone joined in. I think it's often the adults overthinking things that can be a problem.

 

[NJCubScouter]

I have hidden two posts in this thread, one because it contained a personal attack and the second (which was fine in and of itself) because it quoted the personal attack.  Further action is possible after moderator review.

The requirement to "be Scoutlike" may be applied slightly more leniently here in Issues and Politics, but it still applies.  Personal attacks are not permitted.

[Hawkwin]

In my area, there are no girl wrestling teams. If you are female and want to wrestle, you wrestle the boys (or any other girls that wrestle). My daughter did it for one year but did not go back last year. There are a handful of girls that do it at various grades including high school and more and more colleges are starting to develop teams (and of course USA had a gold medalist in the Olympics!). No standards have been reduced to allow for girls to participate in a coed environment - but I am not sure that such experience is really comparable as there really isn't the same social dynamics.

I never saw a boy hesitate in taking her down or by treating her any differently - and she of course had to do all the same stuff that the boys did. I am hopeful that she will go back at some point and that she will help create enough demand to create girl weight divisions.