Membership fees increasing again

[Snow Owl]

@@Snow Owl  My troop has always collected dues the calendar year. I haven't heard of many troops around me that follow the academic year.

 So you collect dues in January not Sept or Aug?

[Snow Owl]

$34 to join

$12 for Boys' Life

$xx unit join fee

$xx council add on fee

$30/month for camp outs ($300/year)

$200 for summer camp

$87-$134 for Scout uniform

$74-$357 for adult inform

 

When BSA actually adds up all the costs to be a Boy Scout and compares that with select sports, they are actually just as expensive as many sports. So their logic for raising fees is a lie. Supply doesn't operate at a loss, it's paid for through cost recovery and profit from sales.

 

http://www.scoutstuff.org/bsa/uniforms-insignia.html

 

I have posted a similar argument several times.  The total cost for scouting is just as high as other activities.  I'm not saying its not worth it but that BSA needs to stop using that argument.  From a schools prospective, looking at programs, Scouting has a high indirect cost.  leaders, leader training, uniforms, handbooks etc.  It is not like the scout paying the fee is the only cost.

 

And the notion that they can easily raise the money by selling popcorn is another ridiculous argument.  That is akin to saying the Mercedes is not expensive, you just need a better paying job.

 

BSA is top heavy, way too many paid professionals.  I would happily pack our SEs boxes for him and load it into the moving van

[fred johnson]

It would be nice to see the adult fee drop -

even if the youth fee had to rise a little more. At some point it will be hard to ask adults for the money to volunteer.

 

I hugely agree with this.  when the fee went from $15 to $24, our pack revisited our budget.  To make the numbers work, our pack changed adult rechartering practices because the pack pays the cost and the adults mostly didn't care.  Specifically, the pack only rechartered the bare minimum committee members (committee chair plus 1 ??).  Direct contact adult leaders were reduced to CM, ACM and DL.  No more rechartering assistant den leaders.  So while the cost went up to $24, our pack cost was about the same or even lessened a few dollars.  

 

We did the same at the troop level.  Best thing we ever did.

 

The sad part is we have fewer adult leaders getting BSA info and chasing BSA training.  

[fred johnson]

The total cost for scouting is just as high as other activities.

Absolutely true.  At one point , I had four sons concurrently in scouting.  It was bleeding me dry.  I remember seeing my cost at about $7500 per year.

 

Right now, I only have two active sons in scouts as the others aged out.  I project my explicit cost right now at $2500 per year for them.  That includes splitting cost of one high adventure and several moderate adventures over the term of their membership.  Add another $1000 for indirect costs (spending money, patches, trinkets, tenting equipment and supplies).  Plus, another $1000 for being a committed leader (training, meetings, pulling trailer, lots of expenses not reimbursed).

 

I'd project our family cost every year is about $5000 right now.  

 

Now if we were not doing scouts, we would do an extra vacation or more incidental travel or other items.  So cumulatively scouts probably adds an extra $3500 of cost per year.  

Edited September 5, 2017 by fred johnson

[qwazse]

...

The sad part is we have fewer adult leaders getting BSA info and chasing BSA training.  

The reduction in paid adults no doubt added to the increase.

[fred johnson]

The reduction in paid adults no doubt added to the increase.

 

Absolutely direct connection.  It costs unit more to charter them.  So we don't charter them.  So they don't commit to training and background checks and ....

[Eagledad]

It isn't the cost that bothers me so much, it's the disdain for the members demonstrated by a complete lack of transparency. Show us some respect by just honestly answering your own first two FAQs:

"1. Why are you increasing the membership fee?

2. What is directly contributing to the need for this increase?"

 

 

This pretty much is normal operation for National. We only need to refer to the coed change discussions to find ourselves reflecting on the same thought. In fact, where is the transparency for any changes pushed on the membership. Is there any method for volunteer members to hold professionals at National accountable. Maybe they come up with some of these ideas at the water cooler or coffee pot. I would like to know that my opinion on their performance counts.

 

Barry

[CNYScouter]

This morning my council posted the notice about YPT and registration increase and the grumbling has already started.

Last year when National registration increased my council also increased the insurance cost from $1.80 per scout/leader to $10 per. They also added a “resource†fee of $24 to each registration to bring thetotal to $60. The resource fee was to pay for the DE salary increase due the federal regulations.

I know a lot of long-time scouters who dropped from the program due to this big jump. Most of these were Scouters who stayed in the program when their sons aged out and would help out once or twice a year.  I think with another increase this close together a lot more will drop the program.

I also think these increases are going to greatly reduce the number of new scouts just because of the cost. The area where I live is still losing jobs and population in general and I don’t see it getting any better.

[skeptic]

Obliquely related.  I know that certain BSA costs, uniforming for adults, gas and travel expense, and mandatory fees, such as the adult registration, are tax deductions.  Do the groups with whom the comparison is made also get similar deductions?  For most of us the deduction is not large enough to make a tax reduction, especially over a certain age when the personal exemptions are doubled.  They did make a difference 15 years ago or more, at least for me.  

[ItsBrian]

I also think these increases are going to greatly reduce the number of new scouts just because of the cost. The area where I live is still losing jobs and population in general and I don’t see it getting any better.

Yeah, honestly mostly the long-time volunteers and adult volunteers I think will stop due to the increase, rather than new scouts.

[skeptic]

One less meal out or a half dozen fewer coffees at the fancy houses.  Or, for some, one less pack of cigarettes or one less bottle of booze or six-pack of beer or case of soda.  Let us get this in perspective.  Yes, it may be a bit of a sticking point, but IF the program is worthwhile, we will work around it.

[walk in the woods]

I hugely agree with this.  when the fee went from $15 to $24, our pack revisited our budget.  To make the numbers work, our pack changed adult rechartering practices because the pack pays the cost and the adults mostly didn't care.  Specifically, the pack only rechartered the bare minimum committee members (committee chair plus 1 ??).  Direct contact adult leaders were reduced to CM, ACM and DL.  No more rechartering assistant den leaders.  So while the cost went up to $24, our pack cost was about the same or even lessened a few dollars.  

 

We did the same at the troop level.  Best thing we ever did.

 

The sad part is we have fewer adult leaders getting BSA info and chasing BSA training.  

The email I received about the YPT changes and Fee Increase also included this:

 

 

Effective for the 2018 BSA summer camp season, any adult accompanying a Boy Scout troop to a residence camp or other Scouting activity lasting 72 hours or more must be registered as a leader, including completion of a CBC and YPT, even if they are the parent of a youth on the trip.

So I wonder how effective the "minimal leadership" strategy will be going forward.

[ItsBrian]

The email I received about the YPT changes and Fee Increase also included this:

 

So I wonder how effective the "minimal leadership" strategy will be going forward.

That is not going to be effective at all. I bet some troops won’t be able to attend summer camp, some adult leaders may not be able to get off for a week.

[Fehler]

My District already charges $144/annual per scout. 

[Col. Flagg]

My District already charges $144/annual per scout.

 

District? $144!!!! How are THOSE costs justified? Curious as to what they are offering.