Where do District/Council leaders come from?

[NeilLup]

Proud Eagle wrote this in another thread

 

"I think part of the problem is, no one wants to do anything for the district. All the competent leaders currently in Scouting are up to their eyeballs in unit level stuff. No unit has any leaders to spare to move into district positions. The district hasn't had much luck in getting people outside of Scouting to help out either"

 

This hits extremely close to home. If I had a nickel for every time a leader in my council told me "The only place that real Scouting takes place is a Troop" I'd be a wealthy man.

 

I was Council Commissioner of my council for about 4 years. To meet the needs of our units with one UC for every 3 units, I would have needed about 150 Unit Commissioners. When I started, I had twelve names on the books and several of those were names only. In four years, our District Commissioners got the number of Unit Commissioners up to about 40 but still, many many units got no Commissioner service.

 

There is somewhat of a paraphrase of JFK's "Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country." It goes "Don't expect to get a lot from your council unless you contribute a fair amount to your council." This isn't some kind of threat or extortion; it is just a statement of fact. Commissioners don't grow on trees or come down from Mars, particularly if they are experienced. They are leaders who got experience in units and then choose to contribute to units other than theirs by being a Commissioner.

 

I don't agree that units don't have leaders they can spare, but I certainly agree that I often see my picture posted at the door of units with "Shoot on sight if seen recruiting."

 

So my challenge and question is this. How can we get leaders to look beyond their own unit and contribute to Scouting and youth by serving as a Commissioner or other District/Council leader and helping other units? How can we make doing the job of a Commissioner something that good, experienced leaders will want to do?

[Fat Old Guy]

One of the biggest mistakes that any organization makes is to try to recruit people for new jobs from the group that is already giving up their time to the organization. People only have so much time to give and they have to prioritize the requests.

 

Let's take a somewhat average white collar worker. There are 168 hours in a week. The normal sleep deprived person spends about 42 of them sleeping. Let's allow 7 hours for the three S's every morning. About 50 are spent at work. Add in another ten for commuting. That's 109 hours, leaving 59 hours.

 

Sunday mornings for most are taken up with church, so that takes another four hours. Meals with the family take another 10 hours. Mowing the lawn takes two hours. Helping Junior with his homework takes five hours. What about paying bills, taxes and such things? Let's say two hours a week. Now we're down to 36 hours.

 

All work and no relaxation makes Jack aggrevated so let's let him read the paper, watch Star Gate, read a book, and check his email. All that takes about 10 hours a week. 26 hours left.

 

What about getting ready for bed? No one just jumps into bed. Well, maybe an 11 year old does but it takes at least a half an hour to change into your PJs, brush your teeth and make sure all the lights are off. There go another three hours. 23 hours remaining.

 

If he's involved with the Troop, he puts in an hour a week that really takes six hours. 17 hours remaining.

 

17 hours left. Tha't just over two hours a day. Two hours a day to go shopping, catch a movie, squeeze in doctor's appointments. Two hours a day to go camping, play catch, take the dog for a walk, go to the gym?

 

Even though it often happens, we can't expect people to make Scouting their life to the exclusion of all else.

 

 

[Fat Old Guy]

What is the solution? Districts need to identify people who are still willing to help that have stepped away from activity with a Unit. The guy who put in six years as SM and now is stepping aside because his son is off to college, probably has the time to give the district ten hours a month.

 

Our District Commissioner, District Chair and two of the three ADCs have no real unit level jobs. Some are registered as Committe Members or ASMs but they don't do much with their units any more.

 

The UCs need to pay attention to what's going on with registered adults in their units and when someone is leaving, tap them for a Distric job. Unit leaders need to listen to the parents who say, "Gee, I'd love to do something but I don't camp," maybe they could help at the District level.

 

 

[Eamonn]

I don't think that we ought to be taking Leaders away from their units. Makes it hard for us to say that we are supporting them, when we are raiding their leadership pool.

Finding/ Selecting people to serve on the District Committee is easier then finding people to serve on the Commissioner staff.

For the District Committee, most of the positions that need to be filled can be found in the community. Prior knowledge and know how of Scouting is not really needed.

By far the best way to strengthen the Commissioner Staff is to follow the plan for the selection of Quality Leadership.

Our Council has a list of adults that for one reason or another don't appear on or have dropped off a unit charter. This is a very useful tool. Having someone on the selection committee who has been around for a while and has knowledge of the district is a big help.

A couple of years back we had a unit that folded and from that unit we managed to find two really good unit commissioners. In fact they are far better serving as Commissioners then they were serving as unit leaders. It is worth remembering that just because someone is an outstanding unit leader does not mean that he or she will make a good unit commissioner.

While I an against raiding units of their active leadership, we do have units that recharter with pages and pages of adults, many who never attend any Scout function. I think they only agree to recharter in order to receive the council newspaper. These are fair game. The fact that they are interested enough to still want the newspaper is a good sign.

Once we have a person on the Commissioner Staff we have to remember that this is their job. Very often they become the dogsbody of the district and are so busy doing non-commissioner work that they don't have time for what they are supposed to be doing.

As a District we need to ensure that we are doing everything that we can to support them. If they report that there is a problem we need to act and act quickly. There is nothing as disheartening then for a unit commissioner to attend the monthly meeting and having to report the same problem month after month.

While the monthly Commissioner meetings are kind of dry they need to be planned. Some sort of training should be presented. Commissioners need to be recognized for doing a good job. When I was District Commissioner we had dinners for the commissioner staff. Around rechartering time we had the Great Commissioner Chile cook off. All the commissioners cooked the chili and the people who came to the meeting to recharter were the judges.

The R/T commissioners would have the commissioners sing the songs that they were going to use at the next R/T.

We tried to make being a commissioner a lot of fun.

Eamonn

[bt01]

Where do the come from???? From Units that have enough leadership that the other members can pick up slack??

[Bob White]

Most District and Council Voulunteers I know come from one of two categories. Current unit leaders ro former unit leaders. they all share one trait. An understanding of the bigger picture. A realization that for scouting at the unit level to succeed, scouting in the community needs to succeed. And the understanding that scouting is a chain of ever widening communities.

 

District and council volunteers come from knowing what job needs to be done, identifying the best person to do it, and asking them on a personal level to make a difference by being a BSA volunteer.

[Proud Eagle]

I think I should revise my statement, after having read the posts here and considered the matter more closely.

 

I think part of the problem is, no one wants to do anything for the district. All the competent, active leaders currently in Scouting are up to their eyeballs in unit level stuff. No unit has any active leaders to spare to move into district positions. The district hasn't had much luck in getting people outside of Scouting to help out either.

 

 

[NeilLup]

Hello Proud Eagle,

 

I would be very comfortable with your statement if you would have written "The units claim that they don't have any leaders to spare to move into district positions."

 

We have one unit that has 10 ASMs, 20 committee members and a war chest of over $10,000.

 

They say:

 

1) We don't have any leaders to spare

2) We don't have any money to spare and won't have a Friends of Scouting campaign

3) Besides that, the District and Council never do anything for us.

 

I don't necessarily fault this unit too much. It is our responsibility to make District and Council service sufficiently worthwhile for them to participate. But Lordy, Lordy, they make it difficult.

 

The problem as Bob White has written is getting them to look beyond their own unit. But almost as a matter of faith, they refuse to do that.

[ASM1]

Well, I don't post here much anymore but this hits to the quick with me. And is the reason for all of our family's problems in Scouting. Bob White is correct and so is NeilLup. Scouting is rooted in its volunteers, plain and simple. I used to be in a "WarChest" troop like Neil mentioned. They had plenty of brag, plenty of equipment, 22 ASM's 60 boys. They did support FOS and I always wrote my check for $100 every year. As one of those ASM's I thought it my duty since I have been in Scouting for more than 35 years.

 

But then my wife and I wanted to do more. We got involved in the District and Council level committees because I beleive in the program and wanted to give back to Scouting what Scouting has given our family. Sounds perfect doesn't it? Well not so. We were then on the outdside with our troop. We were spys, we were not to be trusted. Our last remaining son of 3 was to be deliberately derailed from his Eagle project. And lastly, we were to removed from the troop because, "we did not share in the advancement of the troop priorities".

 

Now because I own my own business we chartered two units, a troop and a crew. We are so small that it takes me and my wife about 40 hours a weeks to make all the plans and forms to file with Council. But quess what? We are involved with most of our Council and District planning committees and we attend every Council and District event. Mostly as staff, but we are there, we find the time to dedicate to what is most important, Scouting! Plain and simple! And our units are growing.

 

ASM1

[Proud Eagle]

I think a few people have hit on a good point. In many cases the choice to move to a district position is seen as leaving the unit entirely. In fact, I think many unit leaders promote that idea to keep their leaders. Also, some unit leaders are automatically suspicious of district or council related things. Further, the district and council people spread the same idea. The tell people they want people that will dedicate their full Scouting time to the district to fill positions. They tell people they will be moving "beyond" the unit and other things that would make it sound like you will never see that cozy troop campfire again. I think the district is motivated by the desire to get leaders that are not going to be stretched too thin by trying to do unit and district jobs, but in the process they are scaring people away.

 

[KoreaScouter]

Just like a stool can't stand on one leg, Scouting can't survive at any level if only the units are healthy, or only the District staffs are running smoothly, or only the council is squared away. All three have to be in some sort of equilibrium. If any one of the three isn't, the other two have to compensate somehow.

 

I see this issue in my District, a recent breakout that's still going through growing pains. We have plenty of leaders at the unit level, but most don't understand Scouting above the unit level -- several reasons. They're not all trained up, we haven't historically been big participants in District-level activities (with some exceptions), and many haven't been at it long enough to have been solicited to help at the District level. To the typical unit-level volunteer, Scouting functions above the unit level are akin to the College of Cardinals.

 

I think the best source of District-level volunteers is from the ranks of experienced unit-level volunteers. People who consider you a traitor or spy are showing their ignorance, and underscore the point I'm making in my last paragraph. They have to be educated and converted first, so they make the connection between dedicated volunteers wearing silver shoulder loops, and the quality of the unit level programs. Then, they'll have a more mature viewpoint.

 

What a great topic. I'm on the road this week, and when I turned over my "SM box" to my fill-in before I left, we had a conversation just like this. In fact, I plan to do another year+ as SM, then move to the UC ranks...

 

KS

[Twocubdad]

Can you imagine running a business were your customers were of the opinion -- correctly or not -- that you never really did much for them and tried to hire away their employees when every you came around? Perception is everything.

 

I've been on our district committee for about two years. Most of the members are also unit volunteers. The committee works much like a cooperative. The unit leaders come together to do things as a district that they could not do (or could not do efficiently) as a unit. Like district-wide camporees, day camp and school night roundup. By and large, the units see a direct benefit in those things. The district committee members also serve as our representatives to their respective council committees and are our chance to be heard. I suppose FOS and new unit recruitment are exceptions, but most everyone understands those necessities. Those who are going to complain are going to do so regardless.

 

I think the Council has a bit tougher sell. I see a bit more of the attitude the others have described in many units relationships with the council. Aside from maintaining the two Scout camps, the things done at the council level are of less direct benefit to units.

 

Commissioning is another matter. I would hate to be a DC trying to fill all those slots. I think many folks, myself included, see the commissioner corps as a net drain on manpower. We've had several threads on the problems with the commissioners and I won't rehash them here. As I noted in the other thread recently, it seem like everything our commissioners do creates more work for the units.

[fotoscout]

Ive been watching this thread for a few days now, thinking that someone will try to set the perspective straight. No one has so Ill try.

 

If you were a newbie reading this thread, you would be drawn to the conclusion that someone from Council or District, (wearing a dark suit and cape, and using a very draconian voice) is visiting Units in the middle of night telling them .....You must sacrifice a leader to higher callings!

 

Where did the concept of Taking leaders away from Units or ... units claim that they don't have any leaders to spare, come from? Units dont provide or give up leaders to District or Council positions. No one goes around looking for units with large numbers of leaders, asking them to donate someone to a Council or District position. Thats preposterous!

 

These people come out the ranks of leaders who are willing to do more than their fair share to support scouting. Unfortunately many or probably most of them are active in a unit or two.

 

Rather than asking Where do they come from?, maybe the question should be , Where are they found? To that I would answer, Roundtable, District/Council events, and training. Leaders that never leave the womb (the unit) never get the big picture and most likely could care less. Leaders that are out and about, attending various activities with their kids, are simply more interested and committed to Scouting.

 

Weve heard a lot about the BSA How to Recruit Leaders literature lately. Although Id argue against the real world application of those concepts in recruiting new unit leadership, the concepts put forward in that literature are a case study for recruiting District and Council Leaders.