Push for Coed Scouting

[blw2]

I haven't been following or participating in this thread, & I'll admit to only skimming it.... so I hope this doesn't derail things

 

I'm currently reading "Rocks in My Backpack", good read so far by the way.... I find myself chuckling every few pages.

But on the subject here, the section I'm currently reading is about his troop in the 1970's.  They were running a decent outdoor program in colorado.  Lots of backpacking and a little repelling and such.  The GS leader contacts him concerned that she's loosing her older girls, and asked if the boy scouts would teach the girl scouts about these things.... after a tepid start, it seems to be taking off, with some joint coed outings and backpacking trips.  Seems like some good times were had.....

[EmberMike]

For all the comments about too much cub scouts. I agree. My son and I took 2 years off in the middle. I was waiting for boy scouts.

 

 

That's not a bad idea, taking a break. Or waiting a year or two to join. 

 

Technically a kid really only needs one year (or less) in a pack to earn AOL. Maybe two years in cub scouts really is plenty for many kids.

[Eagledad]

Still, the resources are there if parents care to invest the time to make it work. It's the same for the mom who is thrust in to coaching her son's soccer team or the dad who has to coach his daughter's volleyball team. If you REALLY care you can make it work. The rest is just excuses IMHO.

Todays parents both work full time jobs and then come home to fix dinner and wind down as a family. REALLY caring sometimes takes away from family time. There are ways to help this, we tried to get assistants to help with the planning, but leading a den can still be a pull on the leaders life. When a leader called to vent on their struggle, I always listened and tried to find a fix that didn't require more of their time or change of their lifestyle. I believe den leaders are the hardest working scouters in the BSA.

 

Barry

[fred johnson]

Maybe two years in cub scouts really is plenty for many kids.

 

For my boys, I think the 2.5 years would have been right.  One year earning Bear.  1.5 years in Webelos.  No kid benefits from 5 or 6 pinewood derbies.  Two yes.  Three maybe.  Four no.  Five no.  Six save me.  

[JasonG172]

Let me add my .02 cents.  I wouldn't have any problem opening up "Cub Scouts" to girls.  I get so many girls wanting to join Cub Scouts its un real.

[blw2]

For my boys, I think the 2.5 years would have been right.  One year earning Bear.  1.5 years in Webelos.  No kid benefits from 5 or 6 pinewood derbies.  Two yes.  Three maybe.  Four no.  Five no.  Six save me.  

agreed.  In fact I've had this exact discussion with one of the dads in my unit.  Bear is just about perfect to start in my opinion..... maybe even wait for 1st year WEBELOS....although I suppose that would depend on having a well run pack for older boys introducing patrol method and such.... if it's too babied down maybe not so good...

[Adamcp]

When UK and Ireland and Canada went to co-ed Scouting, did they just go "all in" (any girl 12-18 could join right away) or did they "phase in" girls joining in some way (younger girls first and letting them grow up in the troop)?

[Cambridgeskip]

When UK and Ireland and Canada went to co-ed Scouting, did they just go "all in" (any girl 12-18 could join right away) or did they "phase in" girls joining in some way (younger girls first and letting them grow up in the troop)?

In the UK girls were admitted to what was then Venture Scouts (15.5 - 21) in 1971.

 

They were admitted to all age ranges on a local option basis in 1991.

 

All groups became coed in 2007.

[RememberSchiff]

From wiki Scouts Canada

 

In 1972, Scouts Canada began accepting female participants as part of its Rover Section who are ages 18-26. This was expanded in 1984 to include the Venturer Section who are ages 14-17. In 1992, co-ed Scouting was an option for all program sections (Beaver: ages: 5-7, Cub Scouts ages: 8-10 , Scouts ages: 11-14) and became policy for all sections in 1998.

Edited February 24, 2017 by RememberSchiff

[cchoat]

Anyone think that GS\USA would be happy if the BSA opened it's ranks to girls?  Any thoughts on what would hapen to their membership numbers?

Edited February 24, 2017 by cchoat

[EmberMike]

Anyone think that GS\USA would be happy if the BSA opened it's ranks to girls?  Any thoughts on what would hapen to their membership numbers?

 

 

I don't think they'll care much. The GSUSA program is pretty different from the BSA program, hence the frequent resistance to the idea that the programs are actually similar and there should be no need for girls to want to join boy scouts or vice versa. The reality is the programs are quite different, and many families will still want the GSUSA program. 

 

I would guess that GSUSA knows this and is confident in what they offer. And that it won't hurt them if the BSA opens the doors to girls. 

 

I don't think GSUSA would see much impact initially. There will be a number of girls who jump ship if they've wanted a more outdoorsy program, or those who want to pursue Eagle. Overall I think the effect will be much more gradual. Those 1st grade girls interested in scouting will now have a choice, and when presented with a choice before committing to anything, over time more and more will opt for BSA. 

 

I think we'll also see a few super-scouts go for a Gold award and an Eagle rank. Some interesting "firsts" to look forward to if this ever happens.

Edited February 24, 2017 by EmberMike

[Stosh]

I thought there was an agreement between the two organizations that they wouldn't do that.

 

And one can add to that the U. S. Congressional charter for the Boy Scouts says:

 

1. U.S. Code › Title 36 › Subtitle II › Part B › Chapter 309 › § 30902

36 U.S. Code § 30902 - Purposes

 

• US Code
• Notes

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The purposes of the corporation are to promote, through organization, and cooperation with other agencies, the ability of boys to do things for themselves and others, to train them in scoutcraft, and to teach them patriotism, courage, self-reliance, and kindred virtues, using the methods that were in common use by boy scouts on June 15, 1916.

(Pub. L. 105–225, Aug. 12, 1998, 112 Stat. 1325.)

 

LII has no control over and does not endorse any external Internet site that contains links to or references LII.

 

Somewhere along the way things seem to have veered off course.  Kinda strange for those that espouse knowledge of map and compass.

[cchoat]

 

I thought there was an agreement between the two organizations that they wouldn't do that.

 

if there is, it's a handshake deal.  Cant see either side putting something like that in writting.

[NJCubScouter]

if there is, it's a handshake deal.  Cant see either side putting something like that in writting.

 

There has been a lot of speculation and reporting of rumors in this forum over the years on some reasons why the BSA might be unable/unwilling to simply open the doors of all its programs to females, having to do with the GSUSA.  Some people say there is an agreement between the two organizations.  Some say the BSA is afraid of a lawsuit from GSUSA.  (This could conceivably be based on the GSUSA charter.  Stosh quotes the BSA charter, but I think the more relevant one, if someone is going to sue someone, is the GSUSA charter.  The GSUSA might claim that the BSA charter is relevant to the intent of the Congress in granting the GSUSA charter, but it would be the GSUSA charter that is the basis of the claim.  Just speculating here, no legal advice being given.)

 

All I have ever heard about this in "real life" was when I was a Scout, probably around 1973, when some of us were speculating on why the then-new uniforms no longer said "Boy Scouts of America" over the pockets but now said "Scouts B.S.A.", and someone (who that may be is lost to history) responded that "Oh, the Boy Scouts is going to merge with the Girl Scouts."  That was about 44 years ago and it hasn't happened yet.

[cchoat]

 

 

All I have ever heard about this in "real life" was when I was a Scout, probably around 1973, when some of us were speculating on why the then-new uniforms no longer said "Boy Scouts of America" over the pockets but now said "Scouts B.S.A.", and someone (who that may be is lost to history) responded that "Oh, the Boy Scouts is going to merge with the Girl Scouts."  That was about 44 years ago and it hasn't happened yet.

Crossed over in 1972 to a scout troop.  Ah the good old days in GNYC, Oscar de Loren uniforms, hiking the Palisades trail from the GW bridge and camping weekends at Alpine Scout Camp without any adults.  Good times, good times...