Adult Activities

[Tampa Turtle]

It is a fine line.

 

The oldsters have their own Patrol Box and cook more complicated meals which occasionally inspires some Boys for the next campout. We make a big show of being courteous and helpful with each other. We try to model a good patrol.

 

But sometimes the more competitive adults want to compete with the boys in the Patrol competitions. It is their time not ours. I think the only time I would think it was OK would be if we were invited by the boys and the chance of adult humiliation would be high.

[Eagle94-A1]

Looks like we will need to do something when one pack's Webelos Cross Over. Had a brief conversation on summer camp, and several of the parents want to tag along, not a scouters but as parents. One dad commented how his son isn't ready for summer camp by himself, and one mom stated that since they joined Cubs as Tigers, the family has done all of the camp outs. Another family went to a Webelos weekend in a camper. They made the comment that another troop has no problem with parents, including moms, camping with them. Had to comment that the hardest part is moving from being a Cub Scout leader to a Boy Scouter because you need to learn to step back and let the youth run things and make mistakes. Heck my wife, who should know better, is complaining because the Scout working with her den is having communications challenges.

 

Me thinks it will get interesting

[Stosh]

With the big push for family events in Cub Scouts, one is going to see an increasingly difficult transition process into Boy Scouts.

 

When we get to the day when we have to tell our Cub Scout parents that their child is too immature for Boy Scouts because he can't sleep in a then with anyone other than a parent, things won't bode well for Boy Scouts.

[Eagle94-A1]

With the big push for family events in Cub Scouts, one is going to see an increasingly difficult transition process into Boy Scouts.

 

When we get to the day when we have to tell our Cub Scout parents that their child is too immature for Boy Scouts because he can't sleep in a then with anyone other than a parent, things won't bode well for Boy Scouts.

 

DON'T. GO. THERE! (emphasis)

 

Wife has a Webelos who has some emotional/maturity issues. If dad or mom is not there, he has a meltdown. Even with mom or dad there, meltdowns have happened.  While I believe there is more to it than maturity, The wife and I don't think the Webelos is ready for Boy Scouts at this time.

[Stosh]

Every boy needs to be evaluated as to their readiness for Boy Scouts.  Some boys are ready and their parents are not.  Some parents are ready and the boys are not.  Sometimes they go into Boy Scouts for all the wrong reasons, (father/son bonding, dad was Eagle, etc.

 

So, that's been going on for 50 years, but I think that with the current crop of boys, they tend to spend more time on the sofa, in sports, etc., etc., than before and the desire, maturity, experience of the boys just isn't there as much as it once was.

 

I wasn't trying to rile anyone up, but I do think the Cub program doesn't really do much, especially at the Webelos level to facilitate the transition into a more mature, outdoor, character building program it once was.  Either one is going to need to change one or the other.... or both to accommodate the cultural change in America. 

 

If Boy Scouts is not going to be the premier program in this area, not to worry, there are others out there that can pick up the slack, I am seeing it more and more recently. 

[qwazse]

Go ahead, bring your pop-up camper. We're hiking five miles through rocks and bogs to pitch our tent. No motorized vehicles, so have fun dragging it.

 

Seriously, if I can get physical distance between the adult sites and the boys ... I'm not gonna sweat the one-off anxious kid who has to hike the hundred yards to us to talk to mom or dad.

 

Son #2 did just that in the middle of the night (?early morning?) on his first camp-out after crossing over. I tucked him in beside me thinking that it would probably be the last time. It was.

[Eagle94-A1]

@@Stosh

 

No worries.  That was me lamenting. Both the wife and I are concerned about this Webelos, her since it is one of her Scouts, me as a potential ASM for him. And we both see where the family camping is going on the Cub Level, and the pack encourages Webelos' parents to step away, prevent siblings from coming etc. I really do not like siblings tagging along on Webelos only events, nor having parents acting like parents.

 

But I admit  am a bit hypocritical at the moment. Troop has a survival camp out that Webelos are invited to attend. Wife feels obligated to attend with her den since she is the WDL. doesn't matter that the old WDL (now TDL), the CM and the ACM will be there. It's her den her responsibility. And I will be with the troop that weekend. So we have no one to watch the Bear. Guess who is going.  On a positive note, he's been building survival shelters for over a year now with his brothers an by himself. And when he found out about the survival camp out his brothers are going on, he's been begging, pleading, and building even more shelters. Yes, last camp out, after all the fun stuff was done, he was building shelters. Ditto in the backyard. But I know it's a bad precedent that I don't like.

 

In all honesty we have 2 like that in the troop already. One more so because of his mom. Overprotective, drop-everything to protect her "baby." I honestly think Mom has the harder time when he is away then him. The other is an ASM's kid. Sometimes he is OK, and does very well. Other times, he has break downs.

Edited December 7, 2016 by Eagle94-A1

[Eagledad]

I have said many times on this forum that Cub Scouts is all about the adults, not the boys. I know that sound wrong, but in reality if the adults are happy, they will bring their sons and their sons will stay in the program well into their teens. I've done it over and over.

 

So, with that in mind, I also feel that if the Cub program is supposed to build a boys maturity for moving up into the Troop outdoors lifestyle, its' just as important (if not more important) for the adults to grow and mature into that lifestyle. As a Scoutmaster, I have taken many young boys without any outdoors experience and developed their confidence to enjoy the outdoor experience. At the same time, I lost a whole Webelos den because they were so bored that they quit before summer camp. Their Den Leader took them camping every month for two years before joining the troop and taught them all the first class skills. There was nothing they hadn't done that most of our 2nd years scouts still hadn't even experienced yet.

 

Getting back to the adults; our culture today is at place where 3/4 of the new adult leaders joining the program have little or no outdoors experience. Is it really so hard to imagine parents concerns for sending their son out into the wilderness with just a couple of adults? In my opinion, the BSA has to step up educating the parents during their son's cub years of the wilderness experience to help them feel more comfortable about joining the Troop. I'm not sure how they should do that, but we are dealing with a whole new demographic of parents today.

 

Barry

[Eagle94-A1]

Getting back to the adults; our culture today is at place where 3/4 of the new adult leaders joining the program have little or no outdoors experience. Is it really so hard to imagine parents concerns for sending their son out into the wilderness with just a couple of adults? In my opinion, the BSA has to step up educating the parents during their son's cub years of the wilderness experience to help them feel more comfortable about joining the Troop. I'm not sure how they should do that, but we are dealing with a whole new demographic of parents today.

 

Barry

 

SO TRUE!!!!!!

 

You're going to laugh, but I started the process as Tigers. Working with the district's Webeloree chief, I took my Tigers to the webeloree so they could not only see what they had to look forward to as Webelos, but also see the Scouts in action running the events. That was part of the hike they had to do back then.  My council does a combined camporee, with an area for Cub Scouts Only, Area for Boy Scouts only, and a common area for both. Cubs can hike inthe Boy Scout area and look around. Take the Cubs there every year.

 

Our Webeloree is run like a camporee, and that introduces them to some aspects fo Boy Scouts too. And having a Den Chief is also a good step forward.

 

BUT THE KEY IS HAVING WEBELOS DEN LEADERS WHO WILL GET THE PARENTS TO UNDERSTAND THEY NEED TO SIT BACK SOME AND START WATCHING THE WEBELOS DO THEIR THING!!!!!!!!! (emphasis, ok maybe shouting at the top of my lungs   ) I started explaining the differences since Tigers. I used Den Chiefs when I could, I talked to parents about the differences between Boy Scout leaders and Cub Scout leaders and I have demonstrated the ideal position of the Scoutmaster, aka "The Al Bundy," i.e sitting in a chair with a cup of coffee, or herbal tea or hot cocoa for our LDS brethen, and repeating the mantra "Have you asked your patrol leader?"  What's interesting is to see my pack's Webelos dens, especially the ones I was involved with at one time, act and compete, versus the other packs. Also the only time I had a NSP work somewhat like the book was my old den.

[Eagledad]

Well your experience as a Cub leader is very much like mine. While I was involved with the pack, our Webelos crossover rate went from something like 20% to over 90%.

 

The problem with you and me is that we were experienced scouts when we joined as adults, so we had a bit of a clue of what the families needed to see. When I worked at the District and Council level, I saw and felt the problem of units without any adults who had a scouting youth experience. I created some programs in our district that resemble a lot of your camporee programs and they worked very well. But, the integrity was only there as long as the district person responsible understood the value and purpose of the programs. Some district leaders just find warm bodies to replace previous administrators and the result is failure.

 

The best way to maintain integrity of a program is for it to come from National in a written format that anyone can follow. Of course we get into the problem of National then, but that is a different story.

 

Barry

[Tampa Turtle]

Just had campout where the mom came out as a MBC (did super job BTW) and the boy (2nd year) slept with her on the adult side AND then the boy asked the SM for a sign-off on a tent camping requirement. *sigh*

[Ankylus]

Go ahead, bring your pop-up camper. We're hiking five miles through rocks and bogs to pitch our tent. No motorized vehicles, so have fun dragging it.

 

We literally had a father who brought his pop-up camper and stayed at a campsite not far from the troop. Brought his family too. The son was supposed to stay in a tent with an assigned tent mate, but got up and went to the camper when it started raining. When we told him that would not be permitted, he quit in a huff and took his son to another troop. Nobody missed them.

[blw2]

Makes me think of the last time I went to council's camp.  It was a WEBELOS event of some sort.....maybe WEBELOS Akela Weekend.

 

Some friends were joking that I should take my motorhome, and I was playing along.  Not serious about it at all  but thinking that I suppose I could drive and just set it up in the parking lot.    When it came time to turn in, i could stroll over to the parking lot, no different to walking back to my parked pick-up truck after all.  & Who'd stop me?  

Well I didn't do it since I actually enjoy tent camping.... but

 

When i got there, low and behold someone was doing just that.  I'm thinking that they were just there as a day tip thing though, i don't believe they stayed the night.... but I do remember walking past at some point mid day and the generator was running

[Stosh]

Hmmm, I own a WW II army surplus pup tent.  I've been known to leave it at home and do the meadow crash option, but I also own a Class-B camper.  (No, that's not a camper with a T-shirt on it)

 

Depending on what's going on, I have just about every combination in between. 

 

And no, I can't blame the Mrs. for the Class-B camper, she prefers tenting.  We travel a lot and the camper simply cuts down on the restaurant and hotel expense.

 

There's a time and place for everything.

 

When all else fails, a poncho and blanket will do just fine.

[clemlaw]

We brought our camper one time to a Cub Scout "family camp" weekend.  Almost everyone else (the ones who stayed overnight) were staying in the cabin.  I don't mind sleeping in my own tent, but I really don't enjoy sleeping on an old mattress in a cabin (especially if it's advertised as "camping").  So we set up the camper in the parking lot, which seemed like the best option.

 

Before the purists jump in, I'll point out that like Stosh, the main function of our camper is as a portable hotel room to save money on hotels and food.  As they say, a Scout is Cheap--er, I mean Thrifty.