News flashhh...Meeting cancelled for Sunday

[Oldscout448]

Ya know I just discovered that I am not as "over "  my sons old SM as a grownup should be.  I am still pretty angry about the boys who had their scouting lives wrecked. 

 

Zuzy, you might want to keep that in mind should you try to follow my "in your face " ideas

 

Oldscout

[David CO]

Where did you get the impression that the UC (dad) contacted anyone?

 

In the other thread, Zuzy indicated that  UC (dad) already knows three units are interested in having SPL (son) after he eagles.  How else would these three units know that SPL was planning to change units after he eagles if UC hadn't already told them so?

[TAHAWK]

Hard to have a conversation about son being available without talking about son being available.  I suppose someone else could have told them first.

[MrBob]

In the other thread, Zuzy indicated that  UC (dad) already knows three units are interested in having SPL (son) after he eagles.  How else would these three units know that SPL was planning to change units after he eagles if UC hadn't already told them so?

 

Oy vey...   

[qwazse]

It sounds to me like someone has tipped off the SM that  SPL is shopping for a new unit.  Perhaps it was one of the SM's that UC just contacted.

Hey Zuzyson's SM,! Yeah, you with the mystical hacker skills that can actually make scout net work ... Are you reading this forum? If so give us a nod. We're all,friends here. Don't feel like you have to explain yourself or anything. Message our moderators if you'd rather not air laundry here. They can relay to us only that you're reading.

 

I just figure it would be healthy if folks understand who might be on the other end of thier keyboard.

[David CO]

I hadn't thought of that.  I suppose it is possible that SM is following our conversation.

 

Zuzy indicated on July 6, in the thread about SPL going to camp with a cast on his leg, that SPL was thinking of leaving the troop after he gets eagle.

 

How many senior patrol leaders, with Asperger's, up for eagle, with a cast on his leg, happened to go to camp that weekend?

 

Add to that the later posts saying dad is the unit's UC.

 

It's possible, but I don't think it's likely.  Qwazse does give us something to think about.  Hmm?

Edited July 24, 2016 by David CO

[NJCubScouter]

If zuzy's son is really "done with this troop", I don't see why it matters what the SM knows and how he found out.

If the SM has in effect relieved the SPL of his duties, what does it matter? Except for the unprofessional way the SM has gone about it, which there is nothing SPL can do about. SPL should probably ask SM point blank, "am I still SPL?" If the answer is yes, the next question is, "Since you do not seem to be letting me do my job, what do you want me to do?" If the answer is no, then that's that. But even if the answer is yes, if your son is "done with the troop" anyway, what's the real difference? He will just go along for a few more weeks with an empty title - unless he transfers to a new troop before his term expires, in which case he should resign as SPL at or before the time of transfer.

 

The important thing from the Eagle perspective is whether he has already served at least six months in a position of responsibility since his Life BOR. I assume he has done so, since you said in a past post that all of his requirements have been completed except for SMC and EBOR.

Also, if it were me, I wouldn't worry about the SM and his computer activities and his son and his son's Eagle. Your son is done with the troop, right? The only thing I would be concerned about is if the computer antics are affecting YOUR son's Eagle status.

Edited July 24, 2016 by NJCubScouter

[David CO]

Speaking of unprofessional behavior, SM might be able to say the same of UC.

 

In my position, I have a lot of confidential info about our scouts and scout leaders that I can't take home and discuss with my family.

[Hedgehog]

Speaking of unprofessional behavior, SM might be able to say the same of UC.

 

 

Yes, how dare he have the audacity to try to get someone to run the program they way it is designed.  

 

Really?

 

I can't understand how you can stick up for an SM that ignores the way the BSA tells us the program is supposed to be run and runs it like his own personal scouting program.  I realize you are just the Chartered Organization Representative and SM Training is not required for that position, but you should take SM Specific Training so you understand the program that your SM is supposed to be offering to your boys.

[Stosh]

I think the "professionalism" of the UC is the fact that he has a conflict of interest in that his son is a member of the unit he is assigned to.  That would never happen in my council.  As a mater of fact the conflict of interest turned into just plain conflict in the long run.  It might have kept the hounds at bay had the UC not been the SPL's dad.  Sometimes this arrangement works, sometimes it doesn't.  In this care it didn't.

[Hedgehog]

Although I agree having a UC with a son in the unit isn't optimal, I think the key conflict of interest is that Zuzy's son was elected SPL over SM's son. That is what lead to the repercussions for Zuzy's son. It seems to me that UC didn't do anything different because his son is in unit. The SM sounds so disfunctional that any UC would have tried to help him get on the right course.

[Eagle94-A1]

It sounds to me like someone has tipped off the SM that  SPL is shopping for a new unit.  Perhaps it was one of the SM's that UC just contacted.

 

I think this is an appropriate action.  I wouldn't allow a SPL to remain in the units top youth position of responsibility while he is in the process of changing units.

 

I would appoint the ASPL to take over until the new elections

 

Until the SPL resigns, just stops showing up, or the youth want a new SPL, Zuzy's son  is till the SPL, regardless of what the SM or any other adult wants.. The youth voted him in, and the adults need to keep out of it. Adult interference WILL (emphasis) destroy a troop. My troop is currently having issues because of adults constantly interfering. It's only been since we have stepped back that things have gotten somewhat better. Most of the youth are still not happy with the situation, but are tolerating it now that we adults have backed off and let them run things.

[Eagle94-A1]

While having a UC affiliated with a unit, let alone having a Scout in a unit, is not optimal, there are times when districts have no choice. I had to take over as UC when the UC of the CO's units died unexpectedly back when my older two Scouts were in the pack. 5 years later, I'm still the acting UC for the pack, not the troop though, because the two UC's they had assigned to use got frustrated enough with the troop to quit.

 

And some SM's are so obstinate that they refuse to listen to anyone who is trying to help them. It sound as if this is the case with the SM of this unit.

 

And one of the keys to being a good SM in my honest opinion, is being able to treat all Scouts as if they were "your sons," or "my Scouts" as I phrase it. Initially I wished my son had NOT been elected as SPL, wanting one of the older Scouts to get it. However the way he handled the job surprised all the adults, including me, but not the Scouts.

 

The youth know things better than us old fogeys. We need to listen to them and let them do what is needed to be done. Our job is to mentor and support them, not throw up obstacles and issue orders to them.

[David CO]

Until the SPL resigns, just stops showing up, or the youth want a new SPL, Zuzy's son  is till the SPL, regardless of what the SM or any other adult wants.. The youth voted him in, and the adults need to keep out of it. Adult interference WILL (emphasis) destroy a troop. My troop is currently having issues because of adults constantly interfering. It's only been since we have stepped back that things have gotten somewhat better. Most of the youth are still not happy with the situation, but are tolerating it now that we adults have backed off and let them run things.

 

This is simply not true.

 

Everyone in a unit serves at the pleasure of the Chartered Organization. The IH and COR have the authority to remove any person, youth or adult, from any position at any time.

[David CO]

While having a UC affiliated with a unit, let alone having a Scout in a unit, is not optimal, there are times when districts have no choice. I had to take over as UC when the UC of the CO's units died unexpectedly back when my older two Scouts were in the pack. 5 years later, I'm still the acting UC for the pack, not the troop though, because the two UC's they had assigned to use got frustrated enough with the troop to quit.

 

And some SM's are so obstinate that they refuse to listen to anyone who is trying to help them. It sound as if this is the case with the SM of this unit.

 

And one of the keys to being a good SM in my honest opinion, is being able to treat all Scouts as if they were "your sons," or "my Scouts" as I phrase it. Initially I wished my son had NOT been elected as SPL, wanting one of the older Scouts to get it. However the way he handled the job surprised all the adults, including me, but not the Scouts.

 

The youth know things better than us old fogeys. We need to listen to them and let them do what is needed to be done. Our job is to mentor and support them, not throw up obstacles and issue orders to them.

 

I don't agree with you that youth know things better than adults.

 

Scouting is a game for boys, and I agree that we adults should step back and let the boys play their game.  We adults are a little bit too old to be playing a boy's game, aren't we?

 

We should not forget, however, that this game is adult owned and adult supervised.  

 

I have spent a lifetime teaching kids.  I can tell you from experience that kids are generally not wiser or more competent than adults.  They're still learning.

 

We do occasionally do see a very gifted child who can outshine his teachers, but this is the exception, not the rule.

Edited July 25, 2016 by David CO