Cross-over Mess

[JasonG172]

I believe most of it is the fault of the Webelo Den Leader!  Webelos should be treated differently than Tigers, Wolves and Bears (Cub Scouts) these are Webelos Scouts.  You have 2 years to transition these boys into Boy Scouts and get them ready.  This is the time where parents involvement drop off some, a time to put up the crayons and used tools to make a patrol flag.

[JosephMD]

Of the three dens you noted, how many had den chiefs?  Den chiefs that were trained and engaged?   Den chiefs that come from healthy troops?

[CNYScouter]

We are seeing the same thing as meyerc13 at the Troop level.

We see most WEBELOS crossover but about 50% drop after 1 or 2 meeting.

I think one big issue is camping. The Troop starts inviting WEBELOS to camping trips when they first become WEBELOS.

Very few sign up to join us. (and we have trained Den Chiefs working with them)

It seems every year most of the WEBELOS wait until the last minute to do the "outdoor activity with a Boy Scout Troop".

And every year at least half are "sick" and don't show up.

 

I can't put 100% blame on the Den Leader, the parents are the ones who won't usually come camping with their Cubs.

 

Most of the ones that do make AOL and cross into the Troop stay.

The ones that don't make AOL are invited to start coming to Troop meeting and work on finishing AOL.

Only one in the last few years has ever finished and stayed with the Troop.

[JasonG172]

Of the three dens you noted, how many had den chiefs?  Den chiefs that were trained and engaged?   Den chiefs that come from healthy troops?

 

I do not have a healthy troop at all.  To answer your question, none!

[JasonG172]

It seems every year most of the WEBELOS wait until the last minute to do the "outdoor activity with a Boy Scout Troop".

And every year at least half are "sick" and don't show up.

 

This is where my Pack Shines, we are very much an outdoor pack and camp out very often and when I say often more than the troop!

[MattHiggins]

This is where my Pack Shines, we are very much an outdoor pack and camp out very often and when I say often more than the troop!

I don't want to derail this thread, but I'm curious how often is often. Our pack went from one annual family camping event in a local park to four total (two Webelos campouts and two pack campouts). I imagine fix or six is the max.

[John-in-KC]

Observation:  The Troop that does the best support of a Pack tends to get the boys, no matter any "enforced" relationship.

 

Here, @@Stosh supports the 2 troops in getting the youth to AOL, and whoa, he gets not quite half of the "available" youth and 1/4 of the total youth.

 

It's the deploy Den Chiefs story all over again

[F-P]

I started Fall of 2015 with 10 Webelos.  I had them act as two patrols, and they were on course to be done with their AOL by December.  I got them involved in the schedule, let them pick activities, etc. - as much Boy Scout experience as I could offer.  I gave them the option of crossing over when they were finished or after B&G so they could do that and the pinewood derby one more time - they voted to stay through B&G.  I set up activities and meetings in the fall with 3 of the 6 troops in town.  1st event campout - 3 scouts showed up.  2nd campout was two scouts and third was one scout (my son).  Meetings were slightly better attended.  Total fail by the parents.  Every excuse you could think of, and honestly I was a little put off.

Anyway, I had two who did not register for cubs in 2016 because they knew they didn't want to join Boy Scouts.  Of the 8 that remained, they all crossed over to troops - three troops in total.  Six are active, and I just heard that the other two have not been going to many meetings.

Totally agree with the comment about active parents means active scouts.

[F-P]

Our pack is a little different when it comes to cross over successes and failures. I've been Cubmaster for a couple of years. Our previous Cubmaster was great. Well liked for good reason, and her business skills made for a well run pack. She admittedly wasn't super into the outdoors and or well versed in Scouting as a whole. Anyway, we have 100% cross over every year. Mostly because until recently the two Webelos years weren't any different than, say, Bears. The Webelos weren't getting a taste of making their own decisions. They weren't ramping up towards Scouting. They showed up for Blue & Gold because they were told to and they crossed over to a troop because they were told to previously pick one. Anyway, the downside to our 100% cross over rate was a significant drop out rate. Our cross over is no longer at Blue & gold, but that's besides the point. I am also the Webelos den leader and try to gently influence the Arrow of Light den leader (I get the idea he's generally not my biggest fan). The new Webelos hear a lot about Boy Scouts and how they are getting ready for a much bigger adventure. They hear a lot about how the Scouts run the troop. As a pack, we get outdoors a lot more. I don't doubt we'll still cross over 100%, but hopefully we'll have a lot fewer drop out due to culture shock.

 

Have your guys not crossed over yet?

[Stosh]

8 boys crossed over into the troop this evening.  My two boys that were in the troop earned TF.  It was a good night.  The WDL for next year does not have any Webelos II boys but he and I talked at length about working closer to make the transition a bit smoother.  I would love to have a DC to toss their way, but this year they're going to be either the PL's or TG's for the two NSP's.

 

At least with 10 boys, it should be a lot more fun for everyone.

[MattR]

I never push den chief but any scout that asks gets my full support. An engaged den chief is a great way to get new recruits.

 

We thought we weren't going to get many webelos this year so our backup plan was to go to the middle schools and recruit. Turns out we got 10, so we put that idea on hold. It seems that a lot of kids are way over scheduled in elementary school but that drops off in middle school because sports starts getting more selective. The end result is that there are more kids with more time in middle school than in elementary school. My hunch is it might be easier to get 7th graders than 4th graders. Our DE is trying that idea as well.

[Stosh]

With a drop out rate of +50% of boys coming from Cub Scouts,  I can't imagine not doing a recruiting in the middle schools.  Not everyone is choosing sports and if one hasn't had Cub Scout experience, maybe Scouting isn't an obvious option.

[RememberSchiff]

Some middle schools here have outing clubs which are growing in popularity.

[Stosh]

YMCA, Boy/Girls Clubs, City Parks/Rec, KAMO, Trail Life USA, Pioneers, and any number of organizations out there that are in direct competition to BSA and all seem to be doing well, while BSA's numbers drop.

 

Too often we BLAME sports, schools, etc. for the problems, but when other programs out there are picking up kids directly using BSA's #1 draw, the outdoors.  What's with that?

[Krampus]

YMCA, Boy/Girls Clubs, City Parks/Rec, KAMO, Trail Life USA, Pioneers, and any number of organizations out there that are in direct competition to BSA and all seem to be doing well, while BSA's numbers drop.

 

Too often we BLAME sports, schools, etc. for the problems, but when other programs out there are picking up kids directly using BSA's #1 draw, the outdoors.  What's with that?

 

In my area is you want outdoors adventures your direct competition is family and friends. Next would be church groups or companies that put together or specialize in outdoor stuff. Parks and Rec departments have some things and in Texas I have to admit they are pretty good.

 

Clubs or groups like the Y are really not that popular here and really don't compete with Scouting. It is really sports, school, church/faith and clubs that compete for time in our area.

 

There's just so much to do out there that if you wanted an "outdoor" lifestyle, with plenty of parks, outfitters and companies out there catering to the recreationalist in all of us, you could do every Scouting adventure without Scouts.