Eligibility to be Elected

[meschen]

I agree, but if you hit them just before elections with the fact you don't think they should be approved it better be something that just happened to cause them to not be a candidate. It would be unfair to let the last few months count against them with the SM not saying anything.

 

Just like with PORs, you cannot deny them UNLESS you have been managing their expectations over a period of time by counselling them on how they are not living up to the Oath and Law.

 

Agree 100%. If you haven't counseled them on their Scout Spirit before, now is not the time to start. 

 

Looking for advice on OA elections for my troop, I have a couple of scout that are technically eligible, meeting the rank and camping requirements.  But their attitude and 'Scout Spirit could still use some work.  The good kids, but just not always very enthusiastic and helpful to other scouts.  Also, they go on camp outs because their parents send them more than because they want to.  So, as I understand it they also need their scoutmaster's approval, that's me, and 'm not sure I approve.  But I also don't want to seem like I'm being an a%# about this.  So tell me am I being to picky on this, I do believe it to be and honor to be elected into the OA, and don't think we should be too loose with who we allow on the ballots.  

 

What do you all think.....  

 

Look at the first three words of your third sentence. "The good kids..." That is your answer. Look at the first sentence on http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/BoyScouts/OrderoftheArrow.aspx. Scout. Scout spirit should be primarily about how you live the Scout Oath and Law in your daily lives. 

Edited March 25, 2016 by meschen

[Stosh]

I make opportunities for my boys, not roadblocks. 

 

I find out who's eligible, tell them that, then they decide whether they want to be voted on for OA.  With the OA in our council as poorly run as it is, not many put their names in for the vote.

 

The council O/A advisor accused me once of standing in the way because I would have 10 boys eligible and only 1 or 2 would be voted on.  He was assuming I was blocking them from being voted on.  He came finally to the election night, the OA made their preso, the PL's let their boys know who was eligible for election and gathered up the names of those wanting to be on the ballot.  No one did.  Some of those boys had had 3-4 opportunities they walked away from.

 

For a few years there I was the only OA member in the troop.  Eventually a boy did put his name in, was elected, became the OA Rep, and other than that, nothing changed.

[The Blancmange]

  But their attitude and 'Scout Spirit could still use some work.  The good kids, but just not always very enthusiastic and helpful to other scouts.   

 

 

 

Wouldn't the scouts who will be voting whether or not to elect them be in a position to judge this?

[qwazse]

Wouldn't the scouts who will be voting whether or not to elect them be in a position to judge this?

Most days, yes.

I'm giving @@ScouterJLM some benefit of the doubt that he's picking up more than what he wrote. There might be a reason that these particular boys or the other boys in the troop have him in gatekeeper mode. That's why giving a lodge advisor a call might help sift through the specific circumstance.

 

One other thought. These boys sound like they're over-taxed with activities. Maybe a friendly query about how each boy would want to add an ordeal weekend to their busy schedule would do the trick.

[Krampus]

The council O/A advisor accused me once of standing in the way because I would have 10 boys eligible and only 1 or 2 would be voted on.  He was assuming I was blocking them from being voted on.

How would he even know how many you had eligible until you told him?

[Stosh]

How would he even know how many you had eligible until you told him?

 

Many were older boys that would have been eligible many years earlier and still were.  Just didn't put their names in on the ballot.  When one has 15-16-17 year old boys and none are in OA, it kinda stands out at district/council functions.

 

I think this pre-screening by the SM amounts to an adult veto even before the balloting starts.  Kinda runs a red flag up in terms of adult controlled.  If nothing else it's an obvious testimony that the adults don't trust the boy's ability to elect decent members to the OA. 

[Eagledad]

I think this pre-screening by the SM amounts to an adult veto even before the balloting starts.  Kinda runs a red flag up in terms of adult controlled.  If nothing else it's an obvious testimony that the adults don't trust the boy's ability to elect decent members to the OA.

 

Demonizing the adults again are you. The SM approval is a required part of the process. If the SM is a guide of taking care of your boys, then they are likely using the same wisdom in how they approve OA candidates.

 

Barry

[Krampus]

I think this pre-screening by the SM amounts to an adult veto even before the balloting starts.  Kinda runs a red flag up in terms of adult controlled.  If nothing else it's an obvious testimony that the adults don't trust the boy's ability to elect decent members to the OA.

 

But @@Stosh, it (adult approval) is required by the OA election process. There's no criteria given other than what's in the eligibility requirements. The lodge literature and script adds "being a friend to all" and " cheerful service" which, to me, adds to the requirements.

[qwazse]

But @@Stosh, it (adult approval) is required by the OA election process. There's no criteria given other than what's in the eligibility requirements. The lodge literature and script adds "being a friend to all" and " cheerful service" which, to me, adds to the requirements.

Really? The 4th 8h and 3rd points of the Scout Law add to the requirements?

They seem to me to simply highlight that aspect of First Class that defines arrowmen.

[Stosh]

So under what conditions would an adult NOT approve if the scout is eligible?  Being eligible is being eligible.  Looks pretty much like a rubber stamp operation from where I sit.  To deny a scout would in fact be a denial based on some subjective judgment implemented by the adult.

[sst3rd]

.....unit leader approval before the election. Call it what you like. That's the requirement.

[Stosh]

.....unit leader approval before the election. Call it what you like. That's the requirement.

 

  That's why OA Election eligibility is rubber stamped with a signature, why MB's are rubber stamped with a signature and Eagle project proposals are rubber stamped with a signature.  All required. Why pretend there's this big adult approval process inherent in the process.  The only way one would NOT sign or approve would be to act as the Keeper of the Gate and strip the opportunity from the boy for whatever reason du jour is floating around.

[Krampus]

So under what conditions would an adult NOT approve if the scout is eligible?  Being eligible is being eligible.  Looks pretty much like a rubber stamp operation from where I sit.  To deny a scout would in fact be a denial based on some subjective judgment implemented by the adult.

If the scout was not living up to the law or oath AND he'd been given notice he was on the bubble b

[Krampus]

  That's why OA Election eligibility is rubber stamped with a signature, why MB's are rubber stamped with a signature and Eagle project proposals are rubber stamped with a signature.  All required. Why pretend there's this big adult approval process inherent in the process.  The only way one would NOT sign or approve would be to act as the Keeper of the Gate and strip the opportunity from the boy for whatever reason du jour is floating around.

If the project does not fully answer wha the workbook requires, then no signature.

[sst3rd]

I don't "rubber stamp" my signature on anything.