Krampus Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I'm defending the GSUSA's official policy and vilifying the BSA's official policy. I have no problem when units ignored official policy (and when they continue to ignore it now and admit atheists). Show me the official GSUSA policy that says they will discriminate against heterosexual men please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSScout Posted March 4, 2016 Share Posted March 4, 2016 " It depends"... When first wife abandoned our marriage, I had a four year old daughter to raise. I was helped by inlaws and Gmom. I was "visited" by my daughters school (it was a private school that I helped by being the maintenance man and "daddy with the pickup truck"). Daughter wanted to join Brownies, local GStroop was a tea party troop, not outdoorsy. When I offered to lead hikes, it didn't happen. Daughter dropped out in less than a year. A couple of parents at school did not want kids to visit our home. No reason given, just "no thank you" for birthday parties. Supervisors at work often asked me "how do I raise a daughter?" No accommodation, just the same expectations as everyone else. I was blessed by family and friends and paid babysitters and daycare that were there when I needed them. I got her to other birthday parties, we went for hikes, she was a whiz at soccer,I commiserated with a friend in the same situation, we even went vacationing together, he and I and out two five year old daughters and had a good time. I coached her soccer team (15 ten, eleven, twelve year old girls). We lost alot , then won the league championship. When she found her love and we planned her wedding, there was a misunderstanding and her mother refused to attend the wedding (I had remarried by then, new wife, two step sons, one new son, nice new family). Then, daughter said she finally understood where she stood with her mom, and what I had done for her. This discussion has rambled from Catholic church leadership problems, to church doctrine vs BSA and GSUSA, to church abuse of parishioners young and old, to GSUSA problems (cookies? To what purpose? Chef Ramsay says they look like dog biscuits), to fund raising as testimony against intolerance to gender intolerance, to Believer versus hypocracy, to Biblical inspiration to jealousy of experience as a Scouter to fear of expected possible perversive acts by opposite gender parent to where I had to relate my experience in the opposite parent guilty by inference situation. I hereby forgive all those unfortunate folks that I couldn't help in their angst at my daughters situation. See you on the trail. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stosh Posted March 4, 2016 Share Posted March 4, 2016 Hmmm, I went through the Ex situation and like good governmental judicial system in it's quest for fairness "allowed" me visitation with my daughters. When Daughter 1 graduates HS, she goes off to college, gets job and stays a loooonnngg way away. When Daughter 2 graduates HS, she goes off to college, gets job and stays a looooonnnnnnggg way away. (she moved even further away) Then they both get married. Then they both have grandchildren. When the Ex retires and moves to Arizona. They both quit their jobs and move back to town where Dad is..... The whole process of politics is who's ox is getting gored on what day of the week..... Fair is only when I win and I get my way. It's a simple enough rule, I just can't figure out why everyone doesn't know it...... I must be a bigot, I hate hypocrites..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlyn_LeRoy Posted March 4, 2016 Share Posted March 4, 2016 Show me the official GSUSA policy that says they will discriminate against heterosexual men please. You can't even follow a conversation, can you? I've said a number of times now that their official policy is NOT that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John-in-KC Posted March 4, 2016 Author Share Posted March 4, 2016 MODERATOR'S NOTE: If you are asked by another member to directly cite a policy, please do so. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlyn_LeRoy Posted March 4, 2016 Share Posted March 4, 2016 What if you are asked to cite a policy that you never claimed existed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSScout Posted March 4, 2016 Share Posted March 4, 2016 Ah, Merlyn! Mi amigo! I was afraid you were hospital bound, or moved off shore or something dire had occurred to you. So let us recap: A Catholic Bishop declares , apparently for himself and not on behalf of all Catholicism, that BSA, Girl Scouts USA and Amnesty International (among other organizations of note) are not up to Catholic standards of behavior and values. We are reminded that many Catholic priests and leaders have not themselves exhibited the epitome of good Christian behavior. GSUSA has become known for not being very welcoming of male Scout leaders (note to self: Contact friend Ted who was his Daisy Scout daughter's Troop leader and is now his Cadette daughter's Troop leader, with mucho other girls in Troop, who all apparently like to hike and get dirty). GS cookies are ubiquitous and of various types and elicit various opinions as to their desirability. GSUSA has no known "offishul;" policy on gender of approved leaders. That said, step up and see what the local service area (much like the BSA District/Council) leaders say to you individually. Many girls, as they grow up, will voice their desire to hike and get dirty by either joining the Venture Crew nearby or pushing the GS Troop leaders to allow "high adventure" activities. Anything left out? That about all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattHiggins Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 I bit my tongue for page after page of this, but this thread--and it's not the only one on this forum--are horrible examples of Scouting values. There is a ton of great information on this forum, but threads like this are a total disappointment. I know forums bring this out in people, but if I wanted to show Scouts how people should treat each other online this isn't where I'd take them. Like I said, lots of great info here on this forum, but also lots of egos and attitudes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sentinel947 Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 I bit my tongue for page after page of this, but this thread--and it's not the only one on this forum--are horrible examples of Scouting values. There is a ton of great information on this forum, but threads like this are a total disappointment. I know forums bring this out in people, but if I wanted to show Scouts how people should treat each other online this isn't where I'd take them. Like I said, lots of great info here on this forum, but also lots of egos and attitudes. Issues and Politics is kinda the wild west. It's the spot on the forums for people to debate/argue the more contentious issues, without having that spill into the rest of the forums. Took me a while to get used to how rough this subforum is. I'm always pleased when its quiet and not active in this particular subforum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stosh Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 Gotta remember that we are all human. That might be a good thing and it might be a bad thing. If we all agreed and got along together in a Pollyanna world, there would be no need for a forum. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertrat77 Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 Nothing wrong with a good dust-up. Chasing rabbits in a thread--I'm good with that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle94-A1 Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 Training as well. 21Century, IOLS and most other courses were a result of the female leader policy change. But it had little to do with their gender, bringing females into the program more than doubled the membership without a youth scouting experience and very limited outdoors experience. The training had to change to fit the needs of the demographic membership coming into the program. I know of a few cases where Scouters WITH youth Scouting experience, including an Eagle, needed the IOLS course because they were not campers. Yep, they grew up under the ISP of the 70s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stosh Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 The new Parlor Eagles are titled that for a reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sentinel947 Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 The new Parlor Eagles are titled that for a reason. I imagine Eagle scouts have been forgetting or losing their scouting skills for a long time. I have some memory issues. I have to practice regularly in order to keep my knot skills useable. I'd think it's normal if somebody leaves Scouting for several years or decades that they would forget a skill they don't practice. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stosh Posted March 5, 2016 Share Posted March 5, 2016 I imagine Eagle scouts have been forgetting or losing their scouting skills for a long time. I have some memory issues. I have to practice regularly in order to keep my knot skills useable. I'd think it's normal if somebody leaves Scouting for several years or decades that they would forget a skill they don't practice. Naw, that's not how I use that term. There were/are boys that attain the rank of Eagle that might have all the boxes checked but their love of the outdoors just isn't there for them. They tend to find Holiday Inn camping more to their liking. Yes, they have jumped through all the hoops, but regardless of their skills, they will always be Parlor Eagles in their hearts. The Paper Eagles are the ones with the, I-got-the-box-checked-once-and-i'm-done skill level. Just yesterday I had to move furniture for my daughter. A lot of stuff needed to be tied down on the loads. Scout knife I've had since I was a scout back in the 1960's got pulled out of my pocket many times. My trusty bale of twine is always in my pickup. I have no idea how many knots I tied. ..... and I'm not even an Eagle. .... I wasn't even FC. I was having too much fun going camping with my buddies to get all the boxes checked. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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