Newbie UC's

[Stosh]

Okay, riddle me this Joker..... What's all this sage advice to the newbies who know very little if anything about scouting, looking for an entry-level position, etc. and UC turns up as a viable option.  With the UC one of the Key-3 of every unit what's with the newbie being part of that?  With units struggling, financially hurting, flipping CO's, riding out personality conflicts, dumping leadership personnel, folding up units, etc. why are we putting that all on a the new guy?

 

One would think that if nothing else, the old SM's who have all their boys Eagled out, and they want to keep their fingers on the pulse of a unit would be the better candidate.

 

A newbie Eagle, walks into the Scout office and volunteers.  They make him a UC that is the go-to person for when things turn sour, or the go-to person when the unit needs a bump push to the next level, or the go-to person that feeds the latest and greatest info from the council to the unit.  Yep, it's the new guy.

 

Why does this recommendation not seem all that productive to me?  And yes, I have a personal ax to grind with this issue.

[qwazse]

First, the personal axe to grind: if things turned out differently -- say a 21 year-old UCed three units whose SM's learned to better implement the patrol method on account of his experience with (and enthusiasm for) it -- you would no doubt open this topic with favorable words and an equal controversy.

 

The commissioner corps is what it is because senior scouters across the nation have abdicated their responsibilities. Some have only

UC'ed units in which their boys were members. Some put on the UC hat without taking off one or more other hats. Finally, some have tricked otherwise knowledgeable scouters into thinking that UCs are part of the unit key three instead of the Unit leader, the CC and the COR -- or that the UC could double in one of those positions for any length of time without the unit collapsing.

 

So, I would tell a young UC that he's been set up for failure. His 7-10 years of experience in troop life is no match for an SMs 15-20 years. For him to have a chance of success he needs to ask to be assigned to one smooth-sailing troop for every two distressed ones. What he learns from the one, he passes on to the other two, letting everyone know he's operating off of limited experience but lots of hope. They can take a pass on following his advice, but he will promise to give them the best advice he can. He should wear no other patch. This should be his only volunteer role. No filling in for SM, CC, or COR -- not even for a day. Anything else he may do (say escorting a crew to Philmont or working a camporee is just for fun), otherwise he gives every other committee a pass. His best volunteer time time is to be invested in finding out what might ail his troops, how they are fixing it, and going to roundtable to learn how different SMs solved different problems. If he does not do that, he can turn in the patch.

 

I would tell all of this to the young UC for one simple reason: to take the BS out of the BSA. If he knows he's been given the short straw, there's an outside chance he can make good. If everyone at HQ has been giving him attaboys for just signing on and that's all he knows, he won't stand a chance.

[CalicoPenn]

 

 

 

 

 

A newbie Eagle, walks into the Scout office and volunteers. 

 

I wonder if that one word:  Eagle  - has anything to do with it.

[JoeBob]

 

The commissioner corps is what it is because senior scouters across the nation have abdicated their responsibilities. 

ie: Choked on hollow promises, lied to, and undermined.

 

The new youth are more malleable to Irving BS.

[desertrat77]

ie: Choked on hollow promises, lied to, and undermined.

 

The new youth are more malleable to Irving BS.

Truth.

[Eagle94-A1]

There are a variety of reasons why someone who is young (under 30) may e go into the commissioner corps.

 

1) They don't want to be committed to a single unit as a leader.  That was my case once I quit being a DE. I didn't want to "show favorites" and work with one specific unit. It was interesting going from DE to UC, but very doable.

 

2) Have a Scouter who wants to help out, but can not commit to being a unit leader for whatever reason. A freind of mine and I just recruited someone under 30. Between his USAFR and med school commitments, he doesn't  have the time for weekely meetings. But checking on the units, helping with paperwork, He can do.

 

3) No kids in the program, and wants to help out as he can.  Have a UC with 2 daughters in that situation.

[Stosh]

 

 

 

 

 

 

I wonder if that one word:  Eagle  - has anything to do with it.

 

 

Absolutely not!  In the situation where I have an ax to grind ( ) I would have preferred an Eagle UC.

[qwazse]

Absolutely not!  In the situation where I have an ax to grind ( ) I would have preferred an Eagle UC.

Stosh, I think CP is saying that seeing "Eagle" on a kids resume, HQ will presume he's qualified for a position without considering if he actually is gifted in that area. I've seen that happen.

[Stosh]

Stosh, I think CP is saying that seeing "Eagle" on a kids resume, HQ will presume he's qualified for a position without considering if he actually is gifted in that area. I've seen that happen.

I got hit with the perfect story.

 

1) 2 parents went on the war path.

2) CC left because his boy Eagled and aged out.

3) New CC in (no training) for 2 weeks.

4) COR who knew nothing about the troop but pencil whipped applications.  Never met the gentleman after 3 years with the troop. Doubt whether he even knew he was COR or what that meant.

5) DE was less than 3 months on the job, just out of college.

6) UC was less than a week on the job, no training, never met him in my life, been involved in the council for 20+ years.

 

UC was called in to mediate the situation.  I was not invited to the meeting, I was removed and a month later, the CC finally worked up the courage to tell me.  The most experienced person in this situation was the DE with 3 months on the job, no prior scouting experience and the least experience was the UC, one week on the job, no scouting experience or UC training.

 

Within 6 months a different DE called me up and wanted me to start a new troop for her district, so everything turned out okay.

 

This is what happens when one has a boatload of untrained, inexperienced people running the show.  

 

Every UC needs to have 2-3 years unit experience (DL, CM, ASM, SM, CC, Eagle, etc.) experience under their belt along with complete UC training before being assigned to a unit.  The blind leading the blind really doesn't bode well for council/volunteer relationships.

 

With those on the forum suggesting UC as getting a foot in the door, at the present time, there's no real guidelines in selecting them other than they are warm bodies.  I just don't think that is enough.

Edited January 11, 2016 by Stosh

[tonkatim]

By looking at the timestamps... I can only assume that this explosion was caused by my comment on the thread about a Scouter that had a bunch of Cub Scouting experience and for reasons that are his own, is not taking on a leadership position in his sons Troop. UC for another struggling Pack is a very logical position.

[Stosh]

By looking at the timestamps... I can only assume that this explosion was caused by my comment on the thread about a Scouter that had a bunch of Cub Scouting experience and for reasons that are his own, is not taking on a leadership position in his sons Troop. UC for another struggling Pack is a very logical position.

 

Not necessarily, this UC thing has been batted around here and there over the past few years on the forum but there really hasn't been any in-depth look/discussion into the qualifications for many of these volunteer positions and rely on YPT, background checks, etc. as what makes a person a good candidate to be offered up to a unit to run the program for the boys.  Yeah, a bit of discussion about this other gentleman kinda sparked my interest in hearing what others think on such things.  Heck we have more qualification expectations for MBC's than we do for UC's, and a good UC can be a blessing for a unit, but a bad one can do a lot of harm.

 

Added:  I am also concerned that a person who was a DL for 5 years in a good pack is qualified to handle the conflict of a unit going down the drain.  They may know how to handle a bunch of rambunctious boys will know how to handle a room full of angry adults.

Edited January 11, 2016 by Stosh

[Sentinel947]

I got asked to be a UC. I sidestepped that job. I've only been an adult for 4 years. To dive cold into another units traditions, politics, finances and troubles sounded like hell on earth. Then multiply it by 3. No thanks.

[Stosh]

Smart boy! 

[NJCubScouter]

I guess I have to say I have no personal knowledge of what experience and training a UC needs to be successful, because as far as I know there has never even been a UC assigned to my troop during the time I have been involved in it, and I never saw a UC as a Cub leader either. But it does make sense that someone who is supposing to be assisting unit leaders should have some experience as an adult leader as well as full training for the UC position. And the idea of an inexperienced, untrained person being sent to "mediate" a unit's leadership issues sounds like a recipe for certain failure.

[gumbymaster]

Maybe some "junior UC" type position, for example a year of shadowing a UC or a role in a District Committee or RT staff for a while, is needed for this type of person.  I agree that a fresh Eagle Scouter probably does not have the right experience to jump into this role right away.

 

I do know, that If I had been more aware of the District Level Volunteer operations (I knew Troop level and Professional level), my ~17 year hiatus between college and my Son joining Cub would have been much shorter, and I would have very likely volunteered, if not as a UC - although I think I could have done the job - on District Committees, etc.