Bsa Amends Adult Leadership Standards

[Gone]

I believe his point is that prior to now, the anti-gay policy prevented his tech company from matching donations and volnteer hours with the BSA and that this has now changed.

 

ROFL....but no one has changed their local policy yet, so this is smoke and mirrors. What if 90% of units don't change? What if 90% of units do change?

 

I just have to laugh at how companies will run to whatever fig leaf they can to justify any actions or inactions.

Edited July 28, 2015 by Bad Wolf

[walk in the woods]

ROFL....but no one has changed their local policy yet, so this is smoke and mirrors. What if 90% of units don't change? What if 90% of units do change?

 

I just have to laugh at how companies will run to whatever fig leaf they can to justify any actions or inactions.

And will they stop donations if they find out the volunteer is working with a religious unit that exercises their local option?

[Gone]

And will they stop donations if they find out the volunteer is working with a religious unit that exercises their local option?

 

Yes, all sorts of issues still to be decided.

 

Way too early to believe the spigots are going to be turned on or dry up.

[desertrat77]

Yes, all sorts of issues still to be decided.

 

Way too early to believe the spigots are going to be turned on or dry up.

Very true.   Even if the spigot is on, it may be a drip instead of a flow.   Also, I'd welcome your thoughts on this article:

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/forbesleadershipforum/2014/07/09/the-coming-end-of-corporate-charity-and-how-companies-should-prepare/

Edited July 28, 2015 by desertrat77

[Gone]

Very true.   Even if the spigot is on, it may be a drip instead of a flow.   Also, I'd welcome your thoughts on this article:

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/forbesleadershipforum/2014/07/09/the-coming-end-of-corporate-charity-and-how-companies-should-prepare/

 

We don't need charities anymore because the Government will be there to fix everything. Where they don't corporations will fill the gap. Haven't you been paying attention since 2008?

[desertrat77]

We don't need charities anymore because the Government will be there to fix everything. Where they don't corporations will fill the gap. Haven't you been paying attention since 2008?

LOL! 

[mashmaster]

Stosh,

 

I believe his point is that prior to now, the anti-gay policy prevented his tech company from matching donations and volnteer hours with the BSA and that this has now changed.

yes that is correct.  The money goes to BSA not the local unit.  I wouldn't call it a trickle.  My company alone donated $2.1 Million last year and we are a small to medium sized tech company.

[koolaidman]

Can anyone point me to the full text of the actual resolution?  All I can find are sections of it in press releases and articles, but not the full text.---nevermind.  found pdf on UMM link:  http://www.gcumm.org/files/369/Adult%20Leader%20Resolution%20071015%20(Final).pdf

Edited July 28, 2015 by koolaidman

[Stosh]

Stosh,

 

I believe his point is that prior to now, the anti-gay policy prevented his tech company from matching donations and volnteer hours with the BSA and that this has now changed.

 

So now that BSA isn't just a bunch of bigots, the company doesn't need to be either.  I got the point and made mine.

[packsaddle]

We don't need charities anymore because the Government will be there to fix everything. Where they don't corporations will fill the gap. Haven't you been paying attention since 2008?

We should not 'need' charities anyway. We should be paying our own way as we go. We should not lament when someone decides not to give us something we haven't earned...that is entitlement. We should be paying the freight for the camps if we use them, and all the other stuff, same as families in our unit do every month, every week. It's called responsibility. The 'program' is an idea. The 'program' is not an overpaid, bloated superstructure that volunteers should worry about getting their bloated salaries. Sorry, end of rant.

[robert12]

Can anyone point me to the full text of the actual resolution?  All I can find are sections of it in press releases and articles, but not the full text.---nevermind.  found pdf on UMM link:  http://www.gcumm.org/files/369/Adult%20Leader%20Resolution%20071015%20(Final).pdf

 

It is in this document, https://www.scoutsforequality.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Adult-Leadership-Standards-Update-and-Resources-for-Key-3.pdf

 

(I am only assuming this is the actual resolution, it is what was passed by the Executive Committee)

[walk in the woods]

Very true.   Even if the spigot is on, it may be a drip instead of a flow.   Also, I'd welcome your thoughts on this article:

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/forbesleadershipforum/2014/07/09/the-coming-end-of-corporate-charity-and-how-companies-should-prepare/

 

Friedman, circa 1970?:

 

But the doctrine of "social responsibility" taken seriously would extend the scope of the political mechanism to every human activity. It does not differ in philosophy from the most explicitly collectivist doctrine. It differs only by professing to believe that collectivist ends can be attained without collectivist means. That is why, in my book Capitalism and Freedom, I have called it a "fundamentally subversive doctrine" in a free society, and have said that in such a society, "there is one and only one social responsibility of business–to use it resources and engage in activities designed to increase its profits so long as it stays within the rules of the game, which is to say, engages in open and free competition without deception or fraud."

 

Quoted from http://www.colorado.edu/studentgroups/libertarians/issues/friedman-soc-resp-business.html. 

Edited July 28, 2015 by walk in the woods

[Gone]

@@walk in the woods, Milton was the man. Make money, the rest will be taken care of.

[Stosh]

For years now the government agencies have taken away the need for corporate charity.  It's no longer necessary.  In the first half of American history it was the religious organizations that built the schools, hospitals, orphanages, etc. Whole denominations like Salvation Army were set up to attend to the needs of the unfortunate.  

 

Well, the vote of the poor people can be bought at a pretty low price so all these programs have been slowly taken over through political promises of being taken care of by the government instead.  Those votes produce sufficient leverage to make it happen.  Money that was once available to be freely given to charities is now systematically removed from consideration through taxation and through entitlement expectations is now given to the poor to secure their political leverage.  

 

Why would corporations continue this process?  There are the political forces now clamoring for more and more of their money through huge tax increases and once again, the need for charity pool funds are reduced.  The government will eventually need to make do with what it can generate through taxation to maintain its bureaucracy.  Eventually there will be no one left to provide funding for the government because the poor have voted them out of existence and the government will collapse.  Social Security and other such programs are on the verge of proving this out. 

[CalicoPenn]

It's interesting what the actual resolution says.

 

First, National and the local councils will no longer be able to use sexual orientation as an automatic disqualifier for employment.  Summer camps can hire gay youth and adults, Councils can hire gay DE's or support staff, National can hire gay employees.  That's pretty much standard for most large corporations now and large corporate donors are looking for those same kind of employment policies in the non-profits that they donate to.

 

Second, National and Local Councils can no longer use sexual orientation to disqualify a volunteer from a National, Regional or Local Council/District position.  This doesn't have a direct affect on units (other than those units that have people that don't even want to work with gay people at all).  Gay adults can now be commissioners, district staff, merit badge counselors (yeah, don't worry - no one's going to force your to send your Scouts to a gay merit badge counselor).  Their memberships are at the Council level, not the unit level.

 

At the unit level, Chartered Organizations can now set their own membership standards for adults - they can accept gay leaders if the want, they can deny gay leaders if they want.  Now here's where it get's a bit tricky and even the Bryan on Scouting blog isn;t getting it quite right (and this is going strictly by what the resolution says).  No where in the resolution does it say that a unit chartered by, say, an American Legion, can't set their own membership standards for adults.  There is no ban on non-religious units setting their own standards.  What the resolution does say is that if a bona-fide religious organization is sued for refusing to allow gay assistant scoutmasters, the BSA will defend that religious organization's right to make their own leadership rules.  What they aren;t saying is that they will defend the non-religious organizations for doing so.  In essense, they are saying if you're a religious organization, we'll take on the risk.  If you aren't a religious organization, you can bar gay adults if you want but you take the risk - if you're sued, we won't defend you (though I suspect they might file a friend of the court brief on their behalf but it won't go farther than that).  It appears to me that the BSA's lawyers turned this every  which way they could and realized that religious organizations have a much stronger potential to win a suit against them than a non-religious organization.

 

All that said, until we see any actual lawsuits, everything is mere conjecture -