Boy Led High Adventure

[scoutingagain]

"Outfitters, going for a fifty mile award, oh my eyes, the pain, why do you people need a patch in order to get out in the woods, and then why do you need to pay someone to do all of the planning, mapping, and Im sure paddling if you asked, this isnt camping people, this is a vacation. Have we forgotten about this little thing called leadership, and letting the boys plan the trips. There ought not be any need for a guide. "

 

 

This response was from another thread requesting info on 50 milers. I didn't want to distract that thread anymore than it looks like it might get so I started this one. While somewhat irreverant, the statement above has somewhat of a point. How much do you involve boy leadership in longrange trip planning? What types of thing do you have boys do? For example, we are looking into a High Adventure Trip for the summer of 2005. The camp is booked for 2004 and is currently taking reservation for 2005. The current boy senior leadership in the troop is 16 - 17 years old. They will most likely not be around when this trip takes place. They will probably be working or getting ready to go to college. The active boy leaders on this trip will probably be the 14 year olds that have just reached STAR and have very limited leadership experience. Any thoughts, ideas?

 

SA

 

 

[Fuzzy Bear]

Guides, car camping, hiking; one troop's goal is another's joke.

 

What is it that the guys want to do?

 

You most likely already have a division of labor based on past experience. I am not sure that you want a long string of people writing their buns off explaining it.

 

Leadership is a method and it is additive and progressive, in many ways. Your 17 year olds should be able to plan and do more than the 11 year olds. Without a context, most of us would rather quote the book to you or fill in the blanks with all kinds of tripe.

 

If you are truly without a clue, first get trained and then I would suggest finding another leader in the district that you trust and get them to mentor you for a while. They will be able to see what you are doing and let you see what they are doing. Most likely it will not be right until you arrive at what fits you and your style.

 

Always keep safety as a priority,

 

FB

 

[Bob White]

The scouts can do whatever they are taught how to do.

 

How much do you involve scouts in long range planning? If you want them to be interested it has to be there plan.

 

Do not worry about who will be leader down the road. If the task needs to be done now have it done by the scouts who are there now. The ones following can retain, build onto, or alter those plans as they come into leadership.

[NWScouter]

Many of the Scouts in my old troop come back as Asst. SM and go on high adventure after they go to college. Let them help in planning. You also dont need to go to a high profile trek location, out here we head out to the Cascades or Olympics and hike fifty miles. I would hope there are opportunities near by you to do the same. Have the Scouts planned a less ambitious one this summer to work out the kinks for your big one.

Last summer they hiked the Chilkoot trail from Skagway, Alaska to the Yukon Territory, Canada. It took a lot of planning but this is a Troop that has go one or more High Adventure treks since my then 12 yr. old son set off in 1988. He is a Eagle as are many other who have gone on those treks. Now he climbs mountains (had to turn back in a whiteout last summer on his attempt to climb Mt. Rainier)and has run with the bulls in Pamplona.

[fotoscout]

BSA has people called Voyagers. They work out of the High Adventure Bases as guides or outfitters. These individuals are very highly trained and experienced in running high adventure trips in the BSA model. You may want to contact your nearest high adventure base and get more information about planning a trip with these guys.

[mk9750]

Hey Scouting!

 

Great question, I think. Here's my take.

 

You don't hear the President of the United States begin cutting back on his programs or plans just because he's a lame duck. He pushes forward with his vision, and the plans necesary to make it happen. He does this knowing that another leader is going to be sitting in his chair in a few months. It might be someone who has similiar visions, in which case it's a good thing he started the ball rolling when he did. All that would be required is for the new guy to make minor adjustments to meet his own expectations. Or, the new guy might have a completely differnet philosphy, and might even want to scrap the whole idea. This is one of the leassons in leadership guys get in Scouting - Transfer of "power". Maintaining continuity between different leaders is a valuable skill to learn.

 

In your case, it's likely that 14 year old Scouts have the same interests as the 17 year olds that begin the process. In addition, it is likely that the PLC planning this trip. If so, is it possible that there are no middle age Scouts on the PLC? I know every Troop is different, but our PLC has more guys under 15 than over 15.

 

To answer the question specifically, in our Troop, when the PLC decides what they want to do high venture - wise, they appoint a boy to lead the trip. We call him the SPL for the trip, which I've never liked, but it's been that way forever, and even when we've agreed to stop this, everyone just kind of reverts back to it.

 

Anyhow, the person (or pair, sometimes) is responsible for investigating possible sites and reporting back to the PLC so they can make the final decision. He works with an adult to secure the site. He develops a list of resources required, and if we don't have what we need, he presents the PLC with options for obtaining them. For instance, when one group wanted to start kayaking, the boy in charge evaluated whether to raise money to hire a guide and rent equipment, or raise money to buy equipment and get people in the Troop trained to lead the event. Our Troop chose to do it ourself, and then started flipping pancakes and cleaning up yards for more than a year to purchase 4 kayaks.

 

Once the PLC has decided how to obtain the resources, this boy oversees any training that is necesary, schedules any pre event activities like shake down hikes, and coordinates stuff like meals and a duty roster.

 

Last spring, the PLC wanted to "kick it up a notch" with the kayaking program. They wanted to do real whitewater, which was more intense than we had done in the past. The "SPL" (I still hate that!) for this effort was 16. This year, as they start going to the next step, the "SPL" will be my son, who is 14. And I am confident he can do this. The only factor I have seen that has stood in the way of any of our guys being successful as a leader is not age, but commitment. If the guy is interested in the trip - if it's important to him - We've never had a boy let us down. Our only disapointments have come when boys who really aren't interested in the trip are appointed "SPL".

 

Well, after a string of relatively short posts, I see I'm back to my old habits. Better stop here.

 

Your guys can do this. Give them the chance. There's no better feeling in the world as an adult than watching a trip come off with few problems after a boy you put your trust in makes it happen.

 

Mark

[scoutingagain]

Thanks for the replies gang.

 

The reason we are looking at a BSA High Adventure Base experience is that this Troop has never really done a High Adventure camp before. A planned program, yes will make the planning easier but will also give the scouts a chance to see what is possible. Then maybe they can work on planning their own trip.

 

I'll admit I'm somewhat new to the scouter game compared to many on the forum and appreciate your experience. I should clarify my role though. I'm not the Scoutmaster(who is trained), but am a member of the committee and advancement chair. While I am not fully trained, I am getting there. I also have been the one that has brought up the idea of a High Adventure trip and am the one adult leader that seems to be willing to put in the effort to help make it happen. There are several adults who are willing to go on a High Adventure trip and help out. The scouts are definately interested.

 

Based on your responses I am starting to get a better picture on how to involve the Boy Leadership. Since this is our first high adventure experience we will need to do some shakedown trips, and that seems like a good place to have some of the more experienced scouts get more involved in planning than they have in the past. We are just in the beginning stages of this so details can still be worked out. So any additional thoughts and ideas are welcome.

 

SA

 

 

[Mike F]

SA,

 

You're on the right track. When we planned our Boundary Waters canoe trip last summer the adults also did most of the detailed planning, but we did get the scouts involved in the following ways:

1. We presented them a range of options and they decided on Canadian canoe trip.

2. Scout researched area and decided on the specific area they wanted to visit and came up with a list of priorities -- for them, number 1 was good fishing.

3. Several Scouts researched fishing in the area and gave us a training session on the different fish, habitats, best equipment/lures, etc.

4. When we got up there, the scout Crew Chiefs from our two crews sat down with the outfitter and together came up with an itinerary.

5. On the water, Crew Chiefs were responsible for leading the crew, navigating, and selecting options. Adults did their fair share of the daily work, then fished or read a book on a sunny rock. (I want to go back!)

 

In hindsight, our biggest mistake in preparation was not having the crews work together more as crews before we hit the water. Our shakedown activities were done as one big group (both crews together), so the Crew Chiefs didn't have a chance to really establish their leadership role and had to learn fast later.

 

For Philmont 04, we're changing a few things.

After our first mass shakedown hike in a few weeks to determine basic capability, we'll be establishing 3 crews and selecting Crew Chiefs. From that point on, the Crew Chief will be in charge of his crew and they will operate as a separate patrol. (Not a real troop patrol - they will remain in their existing troop patrols - will just operate as a patrol whenever we're doing Philmont preparation stuff.)

Each crew will have a Crew Quartermaster. We don't have all the equipment we need, so they will help us select and later train their crew on how to use and maintain it properly.

We plan to have scouts prepare information and conduct crew training on different things like advanced map/compass, blister prevention and treatment, etc.

 

For 2005, some of the scouts are already talking about "rolling our own" backpacking trip in NM or CO. With their Philmont experience under their belt, we plan to let them totally take the lead. Of all the trips, I'm most excited about this one.

 

Best of luck and enjoy the journey!