Where Do Knots Come From, Daddy?

[Gone]

Youth can always nominate adults, and those nominations carry a lot of weight during the selection process.  I recall my wife's Silver Beaver.  The selection and presentation was done entirely by a youth.  Those concerned about Vigil selections should remember that those selections are made by youth.  No adults are allowed a vote.

 

There's a Leslie Nielsen joke in there somewhere.

[Stosh]

When my Webelos boys crossed over into Boy Scouts, they presented me with a Cub Scout coffee mug.  20 years later I'm still drinking coffee out of it.  My Banana Republic General's uniform hangs in the back of my closet and I have bins of collected awards out in the garage.  

 

Did I mention I'm still drinking coffee out of my Cub Scout mug?.  Met the dad of one of the Webelos boys in church yesterday,  Asked about him.  He's out of the Air Force now and married, Has a new little one born a few months back.

 

I have a mug collection.  Most just sit on the shelf and look pretty.  I have one that's kind a special and gets used a lot,

 

District Award of Merit plaque is in a box someplace.  My Cub Scout mug is on the kitchen counter.

 

Like Eagle Mentor pins, some things have greater value than other things.

[chrisking0997]

thanks to everyone who chimed in on this thread so far.  I was hoping it would spark some spirited debate and was not disappointed.  Im still not sure where I fall on the issue as I can see both sides.

[BDPT00]

Then you're right where you belong.  It's a personal decision, and lots of people have different opinions.  The only opinion that matters is your own.  I think many made it clear that there are some bad apples out there, and what they wear on their shirts doesn't make any difference.  Some think it does.  Some don't.  And I'd have to think that most people just don't care.  We all have a tendency to judge people for whatever reason, and some think that knots on a shirt should have an influence on how we measure others.  Is that wise?  Is it not?  Do you care?

[davemetrano]

I've always believed that what people think of me is none of my business. They only person I judge is the guy looking back

at me in the mirror.

 

I always tell my scouts,"Do the best you can with what you have, never give up and hope for the best".  It has always worked for me.

 

Yours in Scouting,

 

Dave Metrano

[Stosh]

I've always believed that what people think of me is none of my business. They only person I judge is the guy looking back

at me in the mirror.

 

I always tell my scouts,"Do the best you can with what you have, never give up and hope for the best".  It has always worked for me.

 

Yours in Scouting,

 

Dave Metrano

 

I've always had the same philosophy.  If you have a problem with me, let's take it out back.  I'll join you after I've finished my coffee.... don't wait up.  

[cchoat]

Ok, I wear three rows of knots and multiple devices that I have earned as a Cub Leader, Scoutmaster, Unit Commissioner and finally District Commissioner over the past 35+ years, but I can understand what eagle 94 is saying.

Because I work in an area that is heavy with soldiers and retired soldiers (sailors, airman and marines) I have found that these parents tend to think less of those with no knots, equating them with new privates as opposed to seasoned veterans.  Even though I have had numerous opportunities to explain that wearing them is at the discretion of the wearer, the message never seems to get through.    Throughout thier careers they saw rows of ribbons to mean that the individual has been there, done that, and sometimes to a high degree of merit. 

I find them also to be good taking points in my role as DC, because new scouters ask "what are those for?" I can pitch training opportunities. 

 

"Banana Republic General"   Hey now there's a new rerason for National to make a few bucks.  They could sell flags with one, to four Flur-de-lays" to signify ego. 

[Eagle94-A1]

"Banana Republic General"   Hey now there's a new rerason for National to make a few bucks.  They could sell flags with one, to four Flur-de-lays" to signify ego. 

 

Sea Scout leaders can have their own personal flag like general and flag grade officers.

 

http://www.scoutstuff.org/sea-scout-leader-flag.html#.VhgaC27ig40

 

http://www.scoutstuff.org/sea-scout-flag-rating-stars.html#.VhgaDG7ig40

[cchoat]

Sea Scout leaders can have their own personal flag like general and flag grade officers.

 

http://www.scoutstuff.org/sea-scout-leader-flag.html#.VhgaC27ig40

 

http://www.scoutstuff.org/sea-scout-flag-rating-stars.html#.VhgaDG7ig40

Sea Scouts love their flags.  The history of the sea scout position flags can be found at http://retentioninscouting.org/V_Sea_Scout_USA_Flags.pdf.  but why stop there? National could sell Commissioner flags, Scout and Cubmaster penants, the money making opportunities are enless.  (ha ha)

[Ankylus]

I admit I wear knots. Some of it has to do with the  "Bananana Republic Generals." Way back in the day, I had some folks who were not very scoutlike because I didn't have rows of knots. I was rather interesting because I could suggest something and be ignored. Yet when a friend of mine, who had his beads and multiple rows of knots, would repeat what i said about something, it was freaking brilliant.

 

 

Depending upon the shirt depends upon which knots and how many. Only shirt that has everything is the commissioner shirt, my "camping" BS shirt has none. Sea Scouts khakis don't have knots, and my whites are officially limited knots to 6, The rest have anywhere from 4 to 8.

 

Now the only time I wore the devices and stars was when I worked for national and had to. They were pain, literally and figuratively.

 

I have always used the phrase "Russian General shirt", but same concept. I too have a shirt that is all "generaled up", including all kinds of knots. I only wear it, though, on "formal" occasions (like Courts of Honor) or when I want to establish some degree of experience or authority. (Weird how some people mistake experience for authority, competence, knowledge and/or skill.)  Most of the time, though, I wear my "simple shirt" that has the bare minimum of patches-council strip, troop number, position, World Crest, and American flag, I believe. 

 

Our local council shop is a national store. I have never been asked for paperwork on any adult award. They run me through the ringer for youth awards, however.

 

And I don't worry about the paperwork either. I know you're supposed to fill that out, submit it to council and all that, but I don't see the point.  There are too many ways to go about it anyway. People will be honest, or they won't. I'm not worried about policing that, especially for adults.

[Ankylus]

I've always believed that what people think of me is none of my business. They only person I judge is the guy looking back

at me in the mirror.

 

I always tell my scouts,"Do the best you can with what you have, never give up and hope for the best".  It has always worked for me.

 

Yours in Scouting,

 

Dave Metrano

 

Agreed wholeheartedly. However, I have learned over the years that sometimes what other people think of you can be useful. For example, The lady down at council thinks a lot of me, and that helps me get her assistance for my scouts when I need or want it. I don't spend a lot of time worrying about it, but its also not always inconsequential.

[TAHAWK]

"Weird how some people mistake experience for authority, competence, knowledge and/or skill."

Yes, experience may be of only one way to do a thing.  And yet application is the critical step in learning a skill:.  "Knowledge without experience is just information."

Can we agree that it is not a matter of one or the other?

 

Experience may be best advertised by Service Stars.  None of those are for writing checks.

 

I like your last observation.  For me, that has finally turned into, "If I can't trust you, . . . ."

[cyclops]

Agree with TAHAWK. I think of experience as information that can't be communicated any other way. The two,  information and experience, compliment each other and can be applied in either direction, information first or knowledge through experience.

I sometimes wear two knots. I have earned many. I don't care much for the 'Russian general' approach so I don't employ it. If parents tend to base their opinions on something that superficial, then so be it.

[qwazse]

Although esteeming them for the sense of dedication they convey, I have not considered service stars as representing the experience I might need in a pinch.

 

I'm not sure there's anything I might look for on someone's uniform that would tell me that.

[desertrat77]

Although esteeming them for the sense of dedication they convey, I have not considered service stars as representing the experience I might need in a pinch.

 

I'm not sure there's anything I might look for on someone's uniform that would tell me that.

Qwazse, I understand and concur.

 

These days, I'm happy to find a fellow scouter that is friendly.   This quality means more to me than what may or may not be on his/her uniform, or what they may have done in the past.