Merlyn_LeRoy Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/10625840/GirlGuiding-removes-God-from-pledge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ding Dong Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 "develope my beliefs" IMHO seems more in line with what the BSA wants its members to do. "duty to God" could mean "do absolutely nothing" depending on one's belief system. I am sure most will not see it that way. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stosh Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 The UK was the first to introduce Scouting to the world. They just might be the first to run it into the ground, too. Stosh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJCubScouter Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 The UK was the first to introduce Scouting to the world. They just might be the first to run it into the ground' date=' too.[/quote'] I see no reason to believe that removing explicit references to God from the oath of a youth organization is "running it into the ground." It is a legitimate choice. It evidently will not be the choice of the BSA. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stosh Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 "Run it into the ground" = change the program so much that one can't tell what it originally was. Sure Scouts will be around, but will it be anything resembling what it was 100 years ago? Obviously not. So what then has it become? It's called Scouting, but is it really? Jury's out on that ... Stosh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st0ut717 Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 The UK was the first to introduce Scouting to the world. They just might be the first to run it into the ground, too. Stosh perhaps you should go to geography cass instead of sunday school it New Zealand not the UK. Besides what else has been the same for 100 years? Baden Powell did ALOT more to scouting than introducing religion into the scouting oath. He was a man a great man and a flawed man, his word for lack of a better term is not gospel. Lets take the good he did and move forward with that. TBH i hate the this religion thing is tearing scouters apart. scout should be about what scouting is about, being outdoors, doing good for the community and nation, making boy the men that will lead the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
O'Scouter Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Of all the things that have changed scouting over the years, I sincerely doubt that would be among the most negative changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cambridgeskip Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Er.... Stosh..... New Zealand got independence from the UK in either 1852, 1919, 1926, 1931, 1947 or 1973, depending on how you read the history books. Whichever way I'm not sure what the link is. If there is a link though I'd respectfully point out the way our numbers are increasing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stosh Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 The sun never sets on the British Empire. I know where NZ, Australia, Canada, the UK, Ireland, the US, Gianna, Bahamas, South Africa and the Fauklands are... Point being, one would think that with enough changes it will become impossible to identify the original, and the originator would be a bit more careful of preserving it. Stosh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadenP Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 As an ordained minister this is a difficult topic for me to take sides. Stout is correct that this issue has torn scouting apart and maybe taking religion out of scouting would make it easier to recruit again in schools, and bring in new members from families who do not practice any religion. Just because Baden Powell originally incorporated it into the program doesn't mean it has to remain. In our crew we have Christians, Jews, Muslims, Quakers, Native Americans, Buddhists ,etc.. and the subject of religion can be a real minefield if not discussed in proper context. The teens are more than open to hearing about other faiths, it is a few of the parents that are usually the problem. The Venturing Trust Award handbook is an excellent resource for all scout leaders who want to discuss religion with their boys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeCastor Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Change is all around us whether we like it or not, but what we must realize is that Scouting is much more than what it was 100 years ago in BP's head. Just because God is removed from an Oath doesn't mean that you, as an individual, have to stop being a believer. There are plenty of non-believers who are decent human beings who live by the Scout Oath and Law whether they call it that or not. Milennial parents want their children to be good citizens just as much as Baby Boomers want their children to believe in God. (See that generational generalization I just made there?) The times they are a-changin' and maybe that's not such a bad thing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walk in the woods Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Well, to be clear, religion isn't doing anything to scouting. People professing belief systems (religious or not) and taking inflexible positions based on those belief systems, might be tearing scouting apart in the US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeCastor Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 @dcsimmons, you have a good point and I respect that. But that inflexibility can be seen on both sides of the coin. There's a lot of missing-the-forest-for-the-trees mentalities at play today and I think we are holding onto things so tightly for the sake of keeping things they way they are rather than doing Scouting and keeping the boys as priority number one. Sometimes change happens on its own and other times it takes some inflexibility by one group to pull other folks into the next generation... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stosh Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 @dcsimmons' date=' you have a good point and I respect that. But that inflexibility can be seen on both sides of the coin. There's a lot of missing-the-forest-for-the-trees mentalities at play today and I think we are holding onto things so tightly for the sake of keeping things they way they are rather than doing Scouting and keeping the boys as priority number one. Sometimes change happens on its own and other times it takes some inflexibility by one group to pull other folks into the next generation... [/quote'] or it draws like minded people into the in-group and the rest simply vote with their feet. Stosh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeCastor Posted October 17, 2014 Share Posted October 17, 2014 Trail Life USA...they walked and created their own narrow group. Certainly their choice. Things change, Mr. Blake, and it's not always a bad thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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