Two questions regarding appropriate behaviors of adult and youth leaders

[st0ut717]

Was it a BSA breast cancer flask? Because that would make this thread go full circle.

http://www.cafepress.com/+bsa_initia...ask,1112068984

Is that from castle anthrax? wicked wicked Zoot.

[TAHAWK]

Was it a BSA breast cancer flask? Because that would make this thread go full circle.

http://www.cafepress.com/+bsa_initia...ask,1112068984

 

 

"BSA"is an iconic brand of motorcycle. But a BSA will go in circles. ^___^

 

 

My first, and beloved, SM smoked.

 

This was the 1950's, but the medicos were already muttering darkly about the health impact of tobacco. Although BSA had no rule against it, as they do now, Mr Smith didn''t want us to know that he smoked so he tried to hide it. He would sneak off each morning to have a smoke to stop the shakes. Of course, we all knew. As BP warned, the Scouts saw about everything. We saw the shakes. We saw the stains on his fingers. We smelled the stink. We suspected that he wanted to stop.

 

He died of lung cancer.at 56.

[O'Scouter]

I am fairly new to the forum, but I have brought a son from tiger to eagle and I think I have seen it all, from leaders ogling teen girls in bikinis at scout functions, to the full knowledge of the affairs going on at OA functions. Nobody is perfect, but really how can we expect boys to do right when they see us doing wrong? This is a volunteer run organization, and I have seen well liked (by adults) volunteers get away with some pretty awful behavior. Regarding smoking, I would hope that folks in uniform keep it discreet in front of the kids. We ask parents to avoid smoking in plain view if possible and provide an area with chairs and cover outside for them to use. Since I once overheard a scout say "it's not rape if she starts to like it halfway through" I would think the sexist/tasteless comments should be kept on a tight rein, since these are adolescent/teen boys who tend toward the vulgar and disrespectful anyway. I think the shirts were probably not appropriate in this circumstance and I think it would be good to suggest that. I agree that the cause and the volunteerism was meant well, but let's be honest, the term 'rack' in that context has never been meant respectfully. Not scoutlike. So if there was recruiting, and it was a pseudo scout outing, I would certainly at least point out that it may be offensive. People who are jerks will bow up and those who are decent human beings will think about it. Just my two cents.

[Sidney Porter]

 

 

"BSA"is an iconic brand of motorcycle. But a BSA will go in circles. ^___^

 

 

.

Absolutely. But in this context it stands for Breast Self Awareness. Although I am sure you can get a flask with the motorcylce on it.

 

[mattman578]

I am guessing the OP is a youth.

 

Smoking was the social norm until quite recently. so for the last 2000 years we have walk north america and men have smoked. Only in the last 20 years and more specifically the last 10 has it become socially undesirable. So your SM is probably in his 40's or 50's and has smoked since his teens or early 20's. Smoking is currently not illegal, or forbidden at scout events. Instead of complaining about the SM may be he should be grateful there is someone interested in providing a scouting program for him. Millennial parents are not volunteering like the previous generations.

 

Far as the Breast Cancer walk goes. I have found that mixing personal life and scouting a tough thing to do. I am a 50 year old american male. I ride motorcycles, smoke cigars, drink bourbon and meet my boys at hooters for bike night. So does that make me morally bankrupt????? Don't think so.

 

Yep some do gooder mom complained that her son saw me drinking and smoking a cigar on my back porch to our Institutional head. He lives 3 doors down and is a friend of my son spends more time at my house than his.....Yep I was drinking, smoking a cigar and swapping lies with the neighbor. When the IH called me to talk with me about it, the conversation started with why he never got invited. Discussion was over, although the IH got a bottle of Black Crown for Christmas.

 

Never Mix personal life with scouting.

 

Basementdweller can I be your ASM ? please

[ScoutNut]

From the BSA "Guide to Unit Money-Earning Projects" -

 

The BSA Rules and Regulations state, “Youth members shall not be permitted to serve as solicitors of money for their chartered organizations, for the local council, or in support of other organizations. Adult and youth members shall not be permitted to serve as solicitors of money in support of personal or unit participation in local, national, or international events.â€Â

 

For example: Boy Scouts/Cub Scouts and leaders should not identify themselves as Boy Scouts/Cub Scouts or as a troop/pack participate in The Salvation Army’s Christmas Bell Ringing program. This would be raising money for another organization. At no time are units permitted to solicit contributions for unit programs.

 

From the Rules and Regulations of the Boy Scouts of America - Article IX - Section 2 - Clause 1 -

 

With the consent of the local council, members of the Boy Scouts of America may cooperate with established nonpartisan and nonsectarian national movements for the relief of humanity in undertakings to raise money by giving personal service, provided, however, that this shall not involve the use of BSA youth members as collectors or solicitors of money.

 

If you want clarification, or approval for your unit's specific activity, I suggest you contact your local council.

 

 

[st0ut717]

ScoutNut. yes but participation in charity 5k does not equal solicitation. Haveing the boy sell entry tickets would be solicitation running a a troop in the event is not.

the BSA youth member would not be collecting monies or soliciting money.

[Basementdweller]

Scoutnut, I hope you had the should length rubber glove for that last one.

 

 

717 is NOT earning or raising money. His boys are participating in the race. Geezus,

 

I think you missed your meds this morning.

 

 

 

[Basementdweller]

 

Basementdweller can I be your ASM ? please

 

 

 

I don't know,

 

Let me ask you a few questions.

 

Ginger or Mary Anne?

 

IPA or Wheat or Stout?

 

Parejo or Presidente?

 

Woodford Reserve or Elijah Craig?

 

 

 

Awe heck, come on over and lets swap some lies.

[Stosh]

We are all held accountable for our actions in our personal lives. Those of us in Scouting take on additional rules so as to help young boys become men. Does that mean we automatically retrofit all of BSA's rules back into our personal lives? To a certain extend maybe yes, like the Oath and Laws. Does that mean I'm going to be wearing my scout uniform to work? to other non-scouting activities? Is the Mrs. and I going to living in a tent? Do I give up my biker buddies?

 

Do I try and set a good example for my boys? Not necessarily. Like they say, if you can't be a shining example, be a horrible warning.

 

Just because BSA has rules about carrying weapons, does that mean I can't carry them. BSA says you can't hunt, Does that mean I can't when I'm not around scouts? Is it hypocrisy to use charcoal lighter to start a fire when it's just the Mrs. and I? If I invite the boys over to the house to roast marshmallows, do I have to follow BSA rules? Does my wife need YPT if I invite the boys over to the house for a pizza party?

 

I choose what BSA rules I wish to follow for my personal life, not the other way around.

 

Sometimes I'm okay, sometimes I'm not. Can't please everyone all the time.

 

Stosh

 

BTW, do I have to get rid of my t-shirt with the buck head with a huge set of antlers on it and the saying below that says, "Ladies, please, my eyes are down here." I figure with the picture of the deer on it it might make a really good class-B with a little duct tape.

[packsaddle]

I would add to stOut717's offering this site as well, nothing wrong with those shirts:

http://www.keep-a-breast.org/programs/i-love-boobies/

 

I don't drink alcohol or use tobacco...guess that makes me even more boring than I seem already...but to IM_Kathy I ask if she has ever tried to quit smoking? If not I would encourage her, for her sake and the sake of her family, to try it or try it again....and succeed. I'm pulling for you.

 

 

 

[SSScout]

Language used is a choice. Drink is a choice. Respect for others is a choice. The message we present on our clothing is a choice. How we treat our bodies is a choice. The choices we make affect not only ourselves, but also our family and friends, our neighbors ("but who is our neighbor, Lord?") and the future. Yeah, your cigar today has an affect on me over here in Maryland.

I seem to remember that tobacco was once a ceremonial ritual item, a serious item among the Native Americans. And then an industry discovered they could make it even MORE addictive, and encourage it's use by giving out free cigs to our soldiers and wow, look at all the old movies , making smoking "glamorous".

The Iroquois held that all decisions, even personal ones, would benefit from considering the effect on the seventh generation hence.

Is that message on the Tshirt respectful of the women you are trying to help with your walk, or is it making too light of the serious situation?

There are funny things and not so funny things. The difference is how we advance as a species.

 

[imachristian13]

All of the comments here...for, against, other...are all appreciated. With a notable exception...

 

Basementdweller? Your overuse of "Geezus" is no less insulting to Christian Believers than simply uttering the name of Jesus Christ in vain. Whether you care or not, I don't really have a concern. Just think it shows poor taste on your part. Same goes for your comment about someone missing their "meds". Funny to some? Sure. Insulting to those who take meds for legitimate medical reasons every day? Absolutely.

 

You know better...you just choose to do otherwise.

 

[st0ut717]

Language used is a choice. Drink is a choice. Respect for others is a choice. The message we present on our clothing is a choice. How we treat our bodies is a choice. The choices we make affect not only ourselves' date=' but also our family and friends, our neighbors ("but who is our neighbor, Lord?") and the future. Yeah, your cigar today has an affect on me over here in Maryland. I seem to remember that tobacco was once a ceremonial ritual item, a serious item among the Native Americans. And then an industry discovered they could make it even MORE addictive, and encourage it's use by giving out free cigs to our soldiers and wow, look at all the old movies , making smoking "glamorous". The Iroquois held that all decisions, even personal ones, would benefit from considering the effect on the seventh generation hence. Is that message on the Tshirt respectful of the women you are trying to help with your walk, or is it making too light of the serious situation? There are funny things and not so funny things. The difference is how we advance as a species. [/quote'] If you drive a nonelectric car your internal combustion engine is far more damaging than a cigar. Or do only pollens that you don't like count?

[qwazse]

With a notable exception... Basementdweller? ... Just think it shows poor taste on your part. ...

 

Well that just about sums it up!

 

While we're all pulling enough motes from each others eyes to light a campfire ... let's not lose track of the two things from the OP we want to teach our boys.

 

1) Smoking cuts into your enjoyment of this great country. It's really sad to see scouters turn back a mile into a trail because his/her lungs can't take the climb. (Patrol method lackeys can take a powder. There are some things a dad shouldn't miss.) Our boys need to understand that if they want the most out of every adventure, nicotine addiction is best avoided. That said, the SM's bad habit is not likely contagious.

 

2) Sometimes a method can overwhelm the message. We need our boys to understand that early detection spares life and limb, but folks seem to have a psychological barrier to self-examining and getting those check-ups on schedule. Humor can break that barrier, but it's a blunt instrument that sometimes falls on the wrong ears (or, in this case, eyes). Not all of our boys are going to see beyond the objectification of a "save the breasts" campaign ... until they see the fear and despair in a relative's eyes.

 

In both of these cases, nothing in the rule book stands in the way of BSA leader and their vice. But, the parent has more control than we often give him/her credit. A simple sentence "I like SM/ASM __, but I don't like when he/she ___." to your son will let him know that there are boundaries.