Committee Chair problems

[Helper]

We are having a problem with our committee chair only doing the parts of the job she wants to do and making excuses for the rest. We have someone willing to take over the position, but we don't know how to remove her. Does anyone know the official way to remove the committee chair if she doesn't want to leave.

[dedkad]

You can never have too many volunteers. If she does a good job on the things that she wants to do, why remove her? Why not have co-committee chairs and let them split up the duties to serve their interests?

[qwazse]

A CC who sets personal limits is much different than a CC who obstructs and impedes. It's not clear which kind you have. If this is a person who simply isn't good at asking for help, encourage her to do so and ask the other person to come along side and encourage a better team effort.

[King Ding Dong]

Dedkad and Q have excellent suggestions. To answer your question the Chartered Organization is where you need to turn. The Institutional Head appoints a Chartered Organization Representative. These two people have complete unquestioned authority to hire/fire all unit Leaders. Call Scouter Services at Council to find out who these individuals are if you don't know.

[Tampa Turtle]

Our advancement chairs burn't out from work overload and kept quitting so we are trying dividing the jon into three persons (one does advancements, one keeps track of event attendance and service hours, and the third merit badge tracking.)

[ScoutNut]

What - exactly - is it that your CC is NOT doing?

 

A CC is not supposed to do the job of an entire Committee of volunteers (it seems Tampa's unit found that out the hard way).

 

A bit more information is needed.

[Helper]

Sorry I wasn't clear. She is the type that impedes the pack. While she has gotten our recharter completed on time or ahead of time every year she controls the calendar and cancels or "forgets" to plan events. She is ineffective at getting parents to volunteer and has run off several parents. She makes unilateral decisions and then claims they were discussed. She fails to complete tour permits for events. We had a scout get seriously injured and she claimed it was not a scout event. I understand the CC shouldn't do everything and I don't want her to. We just need to get rid of the willy nilly half done crap. We have a lot of parents that will help, but she thinks she can do it all by herself. I know she will fight tooth and nail if we try to get rid of her. I need to know if it is possible before I go to the council. Unfortunately, our district representative isn't much help and she has entrenched herself into the council office, but I have heard they have the same problems with her as we do.

[ScoutNut]

she controls the calendar and cancels or "forgets" to plan events.

Event planning is the job of the entire Pack leadership, discussed at the monthly Pack Leaders Meeting. Specific events are planned/run by the event chair (NOT the CC).

 

She is ineffective at getting parents to volunteer

Make a list of specific people (do NOT include CC on the list) that you feel would be a good fit for specific jobs. Show, and discuss it, at your next Pack Leader's Meeting. If it is agreed upon, ask if it would be OK if you approached the folks personally.

 

She makes unilateral decisions and then claims they were discussed.

Find someone (NOT the CC) interested in being Secretary, and have them take notes at Pack Leader's Meetings so everyone is on the same page as to what is going on.

 

She fails to complete tour permits for events.

Find someone (NOT the CC) to be the Pack Outings chair. Filing tour/activity plans should be the responsibility of the outings chair, or the chair (NOT the CC) in charge of the specific activity. Tour/activity plans are not always necessary. Outing/event chair should contact your council for it's specific requirements (this might be why previous plans were not filed).

 

Of course all of the above is based on the idea of having willing volunteers. Which you have said that you DO have. Start encouraging parents to volunteer, and your CC to take off some of her many hats!

 

I know she will fight tooth and nail if we try to get rid of her. I need to know if it is possible before I go to the council.

Your council will NOT, and I repeat - will NOT - interfere in what is basically a personnel problem within a unit. Unit volunteers are "hired", and "fired" by the Charter Organization which owns your unit. The Institutional Head of your Charter Organization, and/or your Charter Organization Representative, are the ONLY ones who can terminate the CC's volunteer position in the unit.

 

The ONLY way that a council will step in is if the unit volunteer has done something criminal, or seriously against youth protection. Then they can/will strip the entire BSA membership from the individual. Once that happens they will be banned from ever registering as a member of the BSA in any capacity at all, anywhere. It does not seem to me that your CC falls into this category.

 

Contact your District Commissioner, and see if he/she can help counsel your CC, and get her, and your Pack, running better.

 

 

 

[Sakitama]

Very good and helpful information. We left our pack last year because everything was run by a clique of 2 parents and heaven forbid anyone suggest anything else besides an extravagant party that does little to move advancements or even earn belt loops. The pack we moved to does a lot better in the Pack Leadership and Parents talking about what we want to do. Most activities are local freebies or cheap. The tone is "Do WE want to?" and not "We WILL" Downside to this pack, is the person that is listed on the Roster as COR is also listed as the Committee Chair. This person does NOTHING with the pack, yet holds on to the checkbook and financial records with a tight fist. She shows up at a committee meeting for Recharter, Council Fundraising Friends of Scouting event, and maybe crossover. She is late in getting recharter stuff in and doesn't verify that it is right (my family has been leading dens and such all year, but I just found out when I went to take money for the pack to Council for Resident Camp that I'm not listed as a leader though I teach Archery at District and Council events). She has people sitting in Committee positions, who should be listed as Scouter Reserve (folks who want to keep membership while away in college). She is COR, but does not involved in the Charter Organization. To remove her as a COR, we'll have to go to the Charter Organization directly. She's afraid to relinquish control of anything to the other leaders of the Pack.

 

[Helper]

Thank you scout nut. I will take these ideas to the rest of the leadership. We can't call in the Charter Organization because we are our own Chartered Organization. It is called the parents of pack 123. I have no idea who that really is. It was created before we entered the pack. We have similar problems with our recharter. She fills in the blanks with names of people not necessarily the people who are doing the job or even know that they are in leadership position. After the accident last year I clarified when we need to have a tour permit and when we don't. Our council wants one filed if the activity is not taking place at our regular meeting site. The strange thing is that the accident did happen at the regular meeting site. Why she tried to say it wasn't a scouting event I am not sure. It isn't like the parent was trying to sue. They just wanted to know how to file an incident report.

[chrisking0997]

Yikes. Good luck...thats a train wreck I would not want to be associated with

[dedkad]

 

After the accident last year I clarified when we need to have a tour permit and when we don't. Our council wants one filed if the activity is not taking place at our regular meeting site.

That's ridiculous! Hope your Hazardous Weather training is up-to-date because it can be pretty dangerous taking those Tigers on a go-see to the local library.

[King Ding Dong]

That is insane on the tour permit. Our council follows national guidelines which are reasonable. If your council is set up to use the online system if is very fast. I doubt anyone is really looking at the submitted permits, they are just in the database. Never has done questions or "approved" for that matter.

[mattman578]

This issue hit me right at home. I joined a pack with my son (Tiger) this fall and well it was not what I call scouting. The hole committee was the Pack Master and his wife his wife was really running the show. There was not any planning or organization. I had two choices Change packs or help this one. I tried to help this one became a Tiger Den leader brought new kids in to the pack started holding weekly den meetings with the Monthly pack meetings. The first monthly pack meeting was a joke they never pick up the badges said she did not have time. Did not ask any of the other adult leaders to pick up the rewards for that meeting also and there was no structure to the meetings at all they were just winging it. Then the Pack camp out same thing they just winged it I had made a schedule of events and they blew it off did their own thing. The last straw was when at the Den leaders round table witch the District had to tell me when and were it was they gave us the packet for the events that were planned and I wanted to take it home to look at and she was bound and determined to keep that information all to her self.

It was at that moment that I realized why the pack was failing and there was nothing I could do to stop the ship from sinking so I jumped shipped found a new pack that is run correctly it has only been a few weeks but it has been a lot nicer and easier.

 

Your CC and my CC might be the same person it sounds like. I would email your district let them know there is a issue. The scout that got hurt at the scouting event is a big one if she says it is not a scouting event and it was there is your ammo. They will try to work with CC and the rest of the parents to get things worked out my district was trying with this one but it was getting messy very messy so I changed packs I told them why should I fight when I there a really good program down the road I can lead a horse to water kind of thing.

[Brewmeister]

I've been down this road...

 

Where is the Cubmaster in this? You are talking about a lot of "program" stuff, which should really fall to the direct contact leaders including the Cubmaster, as ScoutNut points out.

 

The answer to this is to effect grass-roots change. At your monthly leader meetings just make things happen. Not having monthly leader meetings? Then have them. Make a calendar. Do what YOU, the collective group, wants to do.

 

Scouting is not a dictatorship unless the people involved give people permission to be dictators. Also, the CM should be the "face" of the Pack. That's the person parents and boys look up to as the "leader"--the guy (or girl) in front of the room at Pack meetings leading songs and games. In most Packs the majority of parents and 100% of the boys don't even know who the CC is, nor do they need to know.

 

Trying to remove the CC is going to go nowhere. Make the program what the group of direct-contact leaders want it to be and she will leave by herself or fall in line.

 

If your CM is not onboard with you, then you have another problem altogether that is likely not fixable. However, if the people who actually put on the program (den and pack) are on the same page, then just do it!

 

Regarding rechartering,don't worry about it. If the charter is late the council will deal with it--they hate to lose units. Regarding the tour plan (not "permit")--don't worry about it. The plan is to advise the council of goings-on and has absolutely no bearing on whether something is a bona fide scouting event, or not.