Alcohol

[5scoutmom]

Recently, my family and I attended a party celebrating a milestone for a scouting unit. It was held at a local catering hall. The boys in the troop and adult leadership wore uniforms; other guests dressed for an occasion. There was an open bar. I was surprised but admit that I had a drink since I wasn't driving. My adult children also had a drink; obviously, my minor children did not. The question came up at the party as many people were curious and most thought that no alcohol could be served at a function where scouts were in uniform. Is there such a rule and would it apply to a situation like this?

[packsaddle]

The key to the answer is whether or not this was a scouting event. If the troop organized it, someone probably goofed on this one. On the other hand, if it was a spontaneous gathering of several family members, some of whom happened to be wearing scout uniforms, it's open for discussion.

[5scoutmom]

It was not a spontaneous gathering, it was apparently planned for quite some time and it was organized by the scouting unit. There were more than 50 people in attendance.

 

Why do you say someone goofed and what might the repercussions be?

[Stosh]

All of our district recognition dinners, Golden Eagle Dinner, and a number of other district/council events are served in an alcohol served setting. Scouters who wish to drink come without uniform so they think they aren't noticed. The only non-alcoholic event is the council recognition dinner because the Eagle scouts are recognized at that event. They wouldn't want their double standard to be so evident in front of the Eagle scouts.

 

Stosh

[5scoutmom]

/when you say district recognition dinners, do you mean adult only? I have no problem with alcohol at that type of function. This was a family event, though, with cub scout aged children in attendance as well. There was one adult leader in uniform, and many boys in uniform.

[RememberSchiff]

Scout policy notwithstanding, I think you will find that your council, CO, and other adults will not much care about this issue after the fact just as you and your adult children were unconcerned during the event. Then again if the CO dismissed adult scout leaders that would be fine with Schiff. Seemingly, the reality these days is that the most we can hope for is for all to drink responsibly, i.e., adults are not driving after consuming and adults are not spending scout funds on alcohol.

 

My unit stopped attending events where alcohol was served - ball games and even CO events due to safety concerns.

 

My $0.02

[packsaddle]

5scoutmom, There will probably be no repercussions since there were no bad consequences during or after that event. I am pasting in the words from the Guide to Safe Scouting: "It is the policy of the Boy Scouts of America that the use of alcoholic beverages and controlled substances is not permitted at encampments or activities on property owned and/or operated by the Boy Scouts of America, or at any activity involving participation of youth members."

 

That last part (any activity involving participation of youth members) is the part that your unit violated, IMHO. My advice is to read the Guide to Safe Scouting. READ it, don't merely let the words pass by your eyes. There is much more in that document besides the policy on alcohol.

[Old_OX_Eagle83]

What happened was not only clearly a BSA policy violation, it was also very bad judgment. No drinking in the presence of youth period; if it's a scout gathering, it's a scout gathering. It makes no difference if a leader is in, or out, of uniform, he or she is still a scout leader. This is about safety and being the correct role model for all scouts.

[Stosh]

What happened was not only clearly a BSA policy violation, it was also very bad judgment. No drinking in the presence of youth period; if it's a scout gathering, it's a scout gathering. It makes no difference if a leader is in, or out, of uniform, he or she is still a scout leader. This is about safety and being the correct role model for all scouts.

Character is who you are when no one is looking.

[Papadaddy]

I agree, if this was an "official" function of the BSA, council, district or unit, with youth participation, then alcohol was not allowed under the G2SS. Whether in uniform or not is irrelevant.

[Rick_in_CA]

What happened was not only clearly a BSA policy violation, it was also very bad judgment. No drinking in the presence of youth period; if it's a scout gathering, it's a scout gathering. It makes no difference if a leader is in, or out, of uniform, he or she is still a scout leader. This is about safety and being the correct role model for all scouts.

I agree with Old Eagle. It doesn't matter if you are in uniform or not, if it's a scout function and youth are participating then it's against BSA policy.

 

jblake: great phrase! I'm going to steal it!

[5scoutmom]

Thank you all for your thoughts.

 

Packsaddle, I am familiar with the rules you mention and I have feasted my eyes on them. That is partly where my inquiry comes up. The unit involved is NOT my unit and I had no input into the planning of this event. My family left this unit a number of years ago because we didn't like how it was run but we attended this celebration to mark the time we had spent in it and to honor those who came before the current adult leadership. In my current unit, adults do not drink in front of scouts at any type of scouting related function and we emphasize that scouting and drinking do not mix. My husband's father died of alcoholism related illnesses and we are, therefore, incredibly diligent with our children and those we are responsible for in scouting about how we treat alcohol and drinking. I did have a drink at the function but only because there was an open bar; I would not have complained had there not been one. To that end, I was modeling responsible drinking for my own children but I told them that I was shocked that there was a bar at the event.

 

I will state that I did not see any adult uniformed leader drinking but I wasn't watching all the time and I wasn't sitting at the same table.

 

Someone at the party who was also upset about it told me that I should contact the DE but then I saw him at the party. I didn't see him drinking but he wasn't in uniform. Again, I wasn't paying that much attention to him.

 

After reading these responses, I think that I am not going to do anything other than make sure that my own scout functions, to which the other unit will be invited because we share a CO and some overlapping members, are properly run. We are planning a party for an upcoming unit anniversary and are going to hold it at our CO (a religious facility) which will doubly ensure that no alcohol is served.

 

I guess I was just surprised and wondered if there had been any changes in the rules that I was unaware of.

 

[SSScout]

If it was an "open bar", to me that indicates that the organizers of the event paid for the drinks.

Was this an "official" Scout celebration? or a privately organized (SM retirement party done by his family?) sort of thing. If the former, I would feel the necessity of politely, diplomatically , reminding the organizing party of the above named policy. Uniformed Scout youth were in attendance, and , it seems, were expected. If it was the latter case, perhaps it was only poor taste and not a violation with "prior intent"; but still, if it LOOKS like a Scout event and people ACT like it's a Scout event and folks come to it EXPECTING it to be a Scout event, then it IS a Scout event and should have been treated as such.

[5scoutmom]

SSScout -

 

The organizers didn't pay for the drinks. The attendees paid for the open bar and tickets cost a great deal of money. There was a discounted price for current unit members, everyone else paid much more. It cost me close to $400 to bring part of my family to this party. There was no choice given as to whether you wanted to pay extra for an open bar as is done at my company holiday party (I would have declined). It was a scout event honoring the unit, not any individual members. It was billed as a celebration of the unit, there was a glossy magazine with the history of the unit and advertisements. People were expecting a scout event.

 

I guess I just find it hypocritical.

 

 

[Torchwood]

This is wrong on so many levels... If this happened in my unit, I would complain loudly. There may be no repercussions this time, but it would never be allowed to happen again. A clear violation of G2SS, and common sense would tell you that it sends the wrong message to the Scouts.