Which Eagle do you regard higher?

[RememberSchiff]

So, you meet a gentleman (young or old) and, he mentions he is an Eagle Scout. Do you question him on his family, and scouting, life in order to decide how high you should "regard" his accomplishment?

 

What do you do if you decide his answers are not "good" enough, and you do not feel he is a very "worthy" Eagle?

 

If you would really judge someone based on YOUR criteria of how/why they EARNED Eagle, what kind of person (not simply Scout/Scouter) does that make you?

 

Personally, I could care less about the minutia. He completed all of the requirements, and EARNED Eagle. That is something.

 

Heck, I think plowing thru all of those boring as heck merit badges in itself deserves some kind of award!

My polling question was meant in the context of your own unit, as otherwise how would you know. Sorry for the confusion.

 

We have a scout who is working on his Eagle project now. His parents have had minimum involvement with the troop. This scout has said no thank you to having an Eagle Scout Advisor, "I can do it". Self-confident, self-motivated, yeah, he impresses me.

[Horizon]

Thinking about this again. I do love the slaps at 13 year old Eagles, since I was one (a month before my 14th Birthday). Nothing like telling a committed Scout he is not good enough.

 

So I meet a young man on the campus who tells me was an Eagle. Things I might find interesting:

 

What was your project?

Did you serve as SPL? (this gets more points for college admissions)

Philmont or equivalent?

Which merit badges do you remember?

 

Regardless though, I know that in one youth activity he did what it took to earn the highest achievement. He gets my respect, and my expectations for any future discussions as well.

 

One of my favorite compliments at the office one day was "You must have been an Eagle."

One of my favorite memories from college was that 1/3 of the men in my dorm were Eagles. None of us compared what it took, we just led the dorm campout to Yosemite.

Maybe a misread your statement. I do grow tired of people who put roadblocks in the way of young Scouts who are "moving too fast." Insults on this board towards young Eagles not being good enough also get my attention. If that was not what you meant, apologies. I hear them regularly.

 

For college admissions - a faculty member on the admissions committee for the local university. This school recognizes that SPL is the "President" of the Club, and that gets points towards admissions.

[kjmillig]

Parents should be involved in a boy's Scouting advancement. What matters more to me is the personal initiative of the Scout and how much he really worked to earn the award as opposed to the Scout who is pushed through to be an Eagle in the shortest possible time limit. An immature 13 year old Eagle with 35 merit badges doesn't hold much weight in my book.

Parents' involvement to the point of encouragement, helping the Scout set and achieve goals, being active where parents should be active like Committees, transportation, etc.

If parents "butt out" completely is sends a message that the parents couldn't care one way or the other about the boy advancing.

[Stosh]

Flame time. Just because a boy puts on a Boy Scout uniform. Yes, he has done all that is required, the shirt with all the patches, belt, pants, socks, maybe a hat and necker. He has all the check boxes filled out on the Inspection Sheet. Does that make him a Boy Scout? Or are there other factors that come to play beyond the requirements? Well, what about when they pin an Eagle medallion on him? He, too, has all the check boxes filled in....

 

If all the boy has to do to reach the goal is make the trek from Scout to Eagle, that's fine, but is it the patch at the end or journey that makes the difference? Are we making too much ado about the patch instead of the journey?

 

Stosh

[Old_OX_Eagle83]

The scout who's parents are involved/are an SM/ASM, probably do a lot more work to get their Eagle than the rest. They clean up after meetings, make sure the trailer is cleaned up after a campout, and just generally do a lot more detail work. That said, they also have more opportunities than the rest, which evens things out.

Basement is correct. The thing to keep in mind here is advancement is a method of scouting, not the purpose of scouting. Every scouts experience and path will vary, what they have learned, and how they have grown during their time as scouts is all the matters at the end of the day.

 

I'm an Eagle, and am proud of my accomplishments, but this rank, and advancement toward eagle didn't make me who I am, and do not sum up my scouting experience/ Eagle is an important mile stone, but only a mile stone at the end of the day.

 

It's important to keep things in perspective, and honestly, there's to much focus on Eagle.

[Old_OX_Eagle83]

Parents should be involved in a boy's Scouting advancement. What matters more to me is the personal initiative of the Scout and how much he really worked to earn the award as opposed to the Scout who is pushed through to be an Eagle in the shortest possible time limit. An immature 13 year old Eagle with 35 merit badges doesn't hold much weight in my book.

Parents need to understand the role of "parent" in the Boy Scout program. I say role of "parent" because it is a role completely separate of any other role they may have in relationship to the unit in questions; mixing roles leads to big problems.

 

A "parent" supports the scout, like a cheerleader supports a sports team. A "parent" supports the unit the best of his or ability, in whatever way the unit needs support.

 

The scout grows, matures, gains confidence, and moves through the scout program under the direction of senior youth, and is mentored/coached by qualified adult leaders, who in that role are never the parent; although they might be the parent at home.

[Basementdweller]

Flame time. Just because a boy puts on a Boy Scout uniform. Yes, he has done all that is required, the shirt with all the patches, belt, pants, socks, maybe a hat and necker. He has all the check boxes filled out on the Inspection Sheet. Does that make him a Boy Scout? Or are there other factors that come to play beyond the requirements? Well, what about when they pin an Eagle medallion on him? He, too, has all the check boxes filled in....

 

If all the boy has to do to reach the goal is make the trek from Scout to Eagle, that's fine, but is it the patch at the end or journey that makes the difference? Are we making too much ado about the patch instead of the journey?

 

Stosh

Most get lost on the journey, a shame they didn't spend a bit more time learning their compass skills.

[desertrat77]

It's how the Eagle lives his life after the court of honor that matters most. Whatever path he took to earn it--hands-off parents, or parents dragging him by the collar thru the ranks, or the extra scrutiny as the SM's kid--it's all challenging, just in different ways.

 

As I look back, my parents were supportive but hands-off, but I always felt bad for the kid with the pushy parents. Those kids never had a chance to breathe and were forever being hit over the head with the scout handbook by mummy/daddy. They earned Eagle whether they wanted to or not, but they sure didn't seem that happy when they did. In fact, we all know a few that purposely sabotaged earning Eagle, just because.

[Stosh]

It's kinda like the two Eagles (brothers) that I know of that mom kept a day-planner for each of the boys and got them to where they belonged. If asked if they were planning on getting to a scout event, they had to ask mom to check their calenders to make sure the schedule was free. Kinda makes one wonder how well that worked for character/leadership development. Of course dad was an Eagle, too. I wonder if his mom kept his schedule too.

 

Stosh

[Snow Owl]

It really depends on the Troop. It is sad to say, but there are situations when a scout "earns" his eagle on paper and was not given the full oportunity or challange to earn his Eagle the proper way. It is sad to think that there are "eagle" mills that truly undermind the entire program by handing out rank automaticly.

[Scouter99]

Thinking about this again. I do love the slaps at 13 year old Eagles' date=' since I was one (a month before my 14th Birthday). Nothing like telling a committed Scout he is not good enough.[/quote']

 

I will admit that I am suspect of very young Eagles not based on the boys, but based on how I know too many troops operate poorly to facilitate young Eagles.

That said, I get a kick out of people who believe that boys who earn Eagle before their first shave are "too immature" or too this or not enough that given that the 17-yr-old Eagle is a recent development. The average age of an Eagle in 1947 was 14.6 Average is everyone taken together, so that's a LOT of 13-yr-olds bringing that number down compared to today's average of 17.1. (source)

 

Frankly, you could argue that it is mature, driven, qualified boys who set a goal and meet it early, and immature, poorly-prepared boys who are finishing their project 2 years after the last time they went camping and earning the rank 5 minutes before their 18th birthday.

[desertrat77]

Thinking about this again. I do love the slaps at 13 year old Eagles' date=' since I was one (a month before my 14th Birthday). Nothing like telling a committed Scout he is not good enough.[/quote']

 

I will admit that I am suspect of very young Eagles not based on the boys, but based on how I know too many troops operate poorly to facilitate young Eagles.

That said, I get a kick out of people who believe that boys who earn Eagle before their first shave are "too immature" or too this or not enough that given that the 17-yr-old Eagle is a recent development. The average age of an Eagle in 1947 was 14.6 Average is everyone taken together, so that's a LOT of 13-yr-olds bringing that number down compared to today's average of 17.1. (source)

 

Frankly, you could argue that it is mature, driven, qualified boys who set a goal and meet it early, and immature, poorly-prepared boys who are finishing their project 2 years after the last time they went camping and earning the rank 5 minutes before their 18th birthday.

Well said....

[DuctTape]

Neither.

 

"A boy may wear all the scout uniforms made, all the scout badges ever manufactured, know all the woodcraft, campercraft, scoutcraft and other activities of boy scouts, and yet never be a real boy scout. To be a real boy scout means the doing of a good turn every day with the proper motive and if this be done, the boy has the right to be classsed with the great scouts that have been of such great service to their country." -J. Alexander

 

as written in the 1911 Handbook for Boys

 

[Hal_Crawford]

In the end, the scout does the work and earns the word regardless of whether parents are involved or not. It the parents do the work for the scout he isn't going to make it to Eagle.