Any news on gay scouts denied Eagle ranks being reinstated?

[EmberMike]

Now that the new policy is in effect, has anyone heard anything about the kids who were denied rank advancement? Are those ranks being honored now that the policy has changed?

 

I did a search on Ryan Andresen (finished Eagle reqs but SM wouldn't sign off) but couldn't find any news updates. I remember reading about a few others, also. Just wondering what has happened with them.

 

[moosetracker]

Hopefully Ryan didn't age out in the meantime.. Even so, he may have become disillusioned and never came back.. It is sad but true that one negative scouter can derail the enthusiasm of any youth.

 

Have not heard anything good coming from the change, but also nothing bad coming from the change, since the change has occurred. I had heard of a few nasty things during the time between vote and enactment, where scouters could still be nasty and get away with it.

[Huzzar]

Wouldn't it depend on the age of the Scout as of 1/1/14? Anyone that aged out before that will be under the old rules.

 

 

 

[Old_OX_Eagle83]

I think you're correct Huzzar. We're discussing a police that came into effect on a specific date.

[EmberMike]

Ryan had all of the requirements done. Isn't there something in the rules about the Board of Review being possible after the 18th birthday if all of the other reqs are already completed prior to turning 18?

[Stosh]

Gay boys were Eagling long before "policy" went into effect. It varied from council to council.

 

Stosh

[qwazse]

Scuttlebutt (and I think this was alluded to in one press release last year) was that sexual orientation was not the only issue for this scout. He stated that he he had become an atheist on his BOR. But the verbal report that I got was from someone far outside his council, and that may have been based on the same article I was reading. My experience is that the press can wander far from the truth on these things.

 

Like Stosh said, it would be very irregular to bring up a boy's sexual orientation at all.

 

Given that one result of this whole debate was to make scouters across the nation aware of how scoutmasters in general prefer to handle this situation (i.e., they prefer committees to not dig into issues that are clearly delineated as matters between a boy and his parents), I hope that retroactive reinstatement is applied -- if indeed orientation was the only barrier. But, I suspect that if it is, it will be left up to the boy to go to the press about it.

 

And, I do recall that in the last proper reports, Mr. Anderson stopped taking calls from the media -- understandably so.

[Huzzar]

It looks like Ryan Andresen turned 18 in 2011 or 2012 so it would be the old rules.

[EmberMike]

I thought that even under the old rules Ryan would have still been eligible for a Board of Review even though he turned 18 a few years ago, but upon closer reading it would appear not. From the 2013 Guide to Advancement:

 

"It is possible for those who completed the requirements for the Eagle Scout rank in their youth, but never received it, to obtain credentials necessary for acquiring it. If a board of review was not held, and the individual met the BSA membership eligibility rules in effect at the time, then a board of review may be requested. In any case, all requirements must have been completed before age 18."

 

So even though he did complete the requirements and could still have been eligible for a Board of Review even years later, the fact that he did not meet the membership eligibility rules in place at the time would prevent him from ever getting the Eagle rank.

 

Guess I could have answered my own question, but thanks everyone for the comments anyway.

[moosetracker]

Ryan had all of the requirements done. Isn't there something in the rules about the Board of Review being possible after the 18th birthday if all of the other reqs are already completed prior to turning 18?

There is a time limit on that also, and... All paperwork must be in.. Including the forms his SM refused to sign.

[Basementdweller]

If he did would he have to return that Money that Ellen gave him.

 

 

The only reason MR. Andersen made such a splash was he was from a Rich White home, he was also well spoken, and good looking. Makes great media. Had he been from a poor home and an awkward boy would it have been news probably not. But MOM drove the media bus.

 

There is a thread on here somewhere about it....too lazy or disinterested to look it up.

 

There are plenty of failures on this one. The SM and BOR for continuing to pass him on his BOR and scout spirit requirements. Sorry guys grow a back bone and say no if a lad tells you he is an atheist or, at the time, he is gay.

 

Mr. Andersen, because, he was taking an oath he did not believe in. That is really screwed up.

[Basementdweller]

I thought that even under the old rules Ryan would have still been eligible for a Board of Review even though he turned 18 a few years ago, but upon closer reading it would appear not. From the 2013 Guide to Advancement:

 

"It is possible for those who completed the requirements for the Eagle Scout rank in their youth, but never received it, to obtain credentials necessary for acquiring it. If a board of review was not held, and the individual met the BSA membership eligibility rules in effect at the time, then a board of review may be requested. In any case, all requirements must have been completed before age 18."

 

So even though he did complete the requirements and could still have been eligible for a Board of Review even years later, the fact that he did not meet the membership eligibility rules in place at the time would prevent him from ever getting the Eagle rank.

 

Guess I could have answered my own question, but thanks everyone for the comments anyway.

He did not meet the membership requirements at the time.

 

So no he should not receive it.

[qwazse]

If he did would he have to return that Money that Ellen gave him.

 

 

The only reason MR. Andersen made such a splash was he was from a Rich White home, he was also well spoken, and good looking. Makes great media. Had he been from a poor home and an awkward boy would it have been news probably not. But MOM drove the media bus.

 

There is a thread on here somewhere about it....too lazy or disinterested to look it up.

 

There are plenty of failures on this one. The SM and BOR for continuing to pass him on his BOR and scout spirit requirements. Sorry guys grow a back bone and say no if a lad tells you he is an atheist or, at the time, he is gay.

 

Mr. Andersen, because, he was taking an oath he did not believe in. That is really screwed up.

BD, you really stink at post-modernism. Oaths aren't to be believed. They are only there for dramatic effect.

 

A boy usually does not become outspoken about his identity (that includes preference in religion, mates, vehicles, and beverages ... among other things) until late adolescence. That's about the time he already has Life and is starting to think about his service project. So, no surprise any of this was missed at earlier ranks.

 

Than again, there may be a cadre of Star scouts who've been denied advancement but never made the papers. They would not be as attractive to the media or Momma's indignation.

[Basementdweller]

If he did would he have to return that Money that Ellen gave him.

 

 

The only reason MR. Andersen made such a splash was he was from a Rich White home, he was also well spoken, and good looking. Makes great media. Had he been from a poor home and an awkward boy would it have been news probably not. But MOM drove the media bus.

 

There is a thread on here somewhere about it....too lazy or disinterested to look it up.

 

There are plenty of failures on this one. The SM and BOR for continuing to pass him on his BOR and scout spirit requirements. Sorry guys grow a back bone and say no if a lad tells you he is an atheist or, at the time, he is gay.

 

Mr. Andersen, because, he was taking an oath he did not believe in. That is really screwed up.

I have been accused of being old school.

 

I am and forever will be a man of my word

[Basementdweller]

With that said.......

 

I understand giving a lad latitude for self expression or exploration.

 

But at what point does the troop Atheist or Pagan become an issue and you need to have him removed or stop advancing them on the grounds of scout spirit.??????

 

Most scouters have experience with a boy that says he doesn't believe in god or the self proclaimed Pagan.

 

My experience has been most of the time it is for shock effect and to get a reaction.