Knowing what you know now, would you still have taken Woodbadge?

[duckfoot]

I was looking(hoping) for more advanced Scoutcraft. Did not expect the classroom work or the leadership seminar or the patrol project or the ticket. My bad for not researching hard enough I guess.

 

My experience wasn't bad, just not what I expected at all. I guess that colors my recollection, that and the fact I didn't get my beads the way I wanted to.

 

I'm not sure I'd spend the money and go if I knew up front what was coming.

[Hueymungus]

I had not a clue as to what I was getting myself into when I took it. WE1-492-09 is my course. I was just a Tiger Den Leader and decided to become the Cubmaster. I was only a Cubscout for one year back in 1976. So, I had no insight to the Scout culture. It saved my Pack and helped me get pointed in the right direction. So, yes, I would take it again.

[pcola]

It would have been more helpful in my first or second year of scouting, but was more of a review of the Patrol Method. The course I attended was excellent, but not as beneficial as attending NCS for Outdoor skills. I don't wear my beads because the course seemed more of an item to complete rather than a skill building course. I have encouraged new leaders in scouting to attend, as I believe it is a good leadership course for beginning leaders.

[Basementdweller]

No,

 

Already had 10 years as a youth including Brown Sea, Jambo and philmont.

 

 

Like many here I am tired of being held hostage by beading ceremony's. It is way over blown.

 

 

If it were that good then they wouldn't have to resort to high pressure sales at roundtables to fill the courses.

 

I met a fellow recently who has a ticket item toa recruit another scouter to atttend woodbadge

[le Voyageur]

Got my beads back in the early 70's. Back in those days it was old school, and a week long course. Not busted up over several weekends. As I see it, today's Wood Badge has abandoned the outdoors as the classroom of Scouting. It's an okay course for new leaders, or paper pushers. But, for those wanting to run their Unit per BP's vision, Wood Badge isn't it...

[Stosh]

I took WB back in 1993. It was okay, but not very useful. Working the ticket was far more beneficial, but that part of the curriculum, I designed. I had grown up in the GBB era of scouting. Now that my WB is obsolete, they want me to take it again. Sorry, I'll pass.

 

Stosh

[ParkMan]

I took it and would take it again. I'd been a scout leader for about a year. I was involved as a youth for about 6-7 years.

 

I've taken numerous leadership development courses outside of scouting, but was fine with listening again - reinforcing those ideas is not a bad thing. I see Wood Badge primarily as: a seminar on leading units, a survey course of the scouting program, an opportunity to interact with some pretty committed scouters from around your council, an opportunity to let go a bit and have fun with adult scouters.

 

Wood Badge is not an outdoor skill building course.

[qwazse]

I made sure I knew what I was taking (got the opinions of lots of scouters) before I took it.

I knew I was taking it to light a fire for me to complete some moderately challenging goals.

 

I enjoyed the fellowship that I built. But I missed those weekends with my unit(s)! Plus, a high adventure that we were planning demanded more of my time than expected which -- since all of that work wasn't part of my ticket -- delayed my WB homework.

 

One scout was starting to get too much pleasure in calling me "Old Man", so it was very gratifying to come back from my first weekend and say "Boy, from now on it's "Old Crow"!"

 

I met a scouter taking the course who did not flinch about taking our units winter backpacking. Without her, the ladies in my crew would have not had that opportunity. Any night with the moon hovering over a snowy field is a win. The deer whistling in the morning because hunting season is over is a double win!

 

Also, since I was working on an award, I think it put me on the "same level" as a young lady who was working on our crew's first bronze award, and encouraged her that I wasn't asking for anything from her that I wasn't willing to do myself.

 

So, yes, I would do it again, but I also am very clear with other scouters about the time commitment and the lack of wood to harm in the earning of the award.

[Eagledad]

The present course that was introduced in 2000 is not like the previous course started in the 60's that was designed for experienced scoutmasters. And think goodness. You all don't realize how much of a problem the old course was because the new course has been running pretty well for 13 years now. But the problem with a course that simulates a perfect troop is that the partticipants that have no other experience to base a troop program on would force their scouts to function exactly like the WB troop. It all started with the inclusion of women as leaders because up until that time, the majority of troop leaders had some scouting experience as a youth. For men and women who didn't have any scouting experience gave them the best picture of running a troop. But wasn't intended to be an end all top shelf troop model program, it was a simply the model used for the real purpose of teaching adults different teaching styles. Yep, WB was not intended to teach adults how to run a troop, it's intention was guiding scoutmasters new teaching styles. But that intention got lost after 1990 because many of the adults used the course as the ideal troop model and that cause a lot of problems with units struggling. If the scouts didn't respond like the participants in WB, they leaders didn't know what to do and generally overreacted. The new course is directed toward team buidling. Thats why Cub leaders are encouraged as well. I was our District person who worked with struggling adult committees and 9 times out of 10, the main problem was the unit didn't have a vision or a team concept. Each adults function on their own doing what they felt was important. I only had to show committees their vision and get them to understand each persons role on the team. It works very well and I think has benefited the program. I do however agree that the BSA needs to provide better access to outdoor skills. Almost 3/4 of adult joining troops today do not have any experience in scouting. And that has it's own problems. Barry

[Brewmeister]

The present course that was introduced in 2000 is not like the previous course started in the 60's that was designed for experienced scoutmasters. And think goodness. You all don't realize how much of a problem the old course was because the new course has been running pretty well for 13 years now. But the problem with a course that simulates a perfect troop is that the partticipants that have no other experience to base a troop program on would force their scouts to function exactly like the WB troop. It all started with the inclusion of women as leaders because up until that time, the majority of troop leaders had some scouting experience as a youth. For men and women who didn't have any scouting experience gave them the best picture of running a troop. But wasn't intended to be an end all top shelf troop model program, it was a simply the model used for the real purpose of teaching adults different teaching styles. Yep, WB was not intended to teach adults how to run a troop, it's intention was guiding scoutmasters new teaching styles. But that intention got lost after 1990 because many of the adults used the course as the ideal troop model and that cause a lot of problems with units struggling. If the scouts didn't respond like the participants in WB, they leaders didn't know what to do and generally overreacted. The new course is directed toward team buidling. Thats why Cub leaders are encouraged as well. I was our District person who worked with struggling adult committees and 9 times out of 10, the main problem was the unit didn't have a vision or a team concept. Each adults function on their own doing what they felt was important. I only had to show committees their vision and get them to understand each persons role on the team. It works very well and I think has benefited the program. I do however agree that the BSA needs to provide better access to outdoor skills. Almost 3/4 of adult joining troops today do not have any experience in scouting. And that has it's own problems. Barry

That's an interesting perspective I have not heard given on the "old" course. Usually the prior curriculum is just looked back on wistfully...

[Brewmeister]

I would take it again only because I met several great resources I would not have. Otherwise, I consider it mainly a rite of passage.

[BadenP]

The present course that was introduced in 2000 is not like the previous course started in the 60's that was designed for experienced scoutmasters. And think goodness. You all don't realize how much of a problem the old course was because the new course has been running pretty well for 13 years now. But the problem with a course that simulates a perfect troop is that the partticipants that have no other experience to base a troop program on would force their scouts to function exactly like the WB troop. It all started with the inclusion of women as leaders because up until that time, the majority of troop leaders had some scouting experience as a youth. For men and women who didn't have any scouting experience gave them the best picture of running a troop. But wasn't intended to be an end all top shelf troop model program, it was a simply the model used for the real purpose of teaching adults different teaching styles. Yep, WB was not intended to teach adults how to run a troop, it's intention was guiding scoutmasters new teaching styles. But that intention got lost after 1990 because many of the adults used the course as the ideal troop model and that cause a lot of problems with units struggling. If the scouts didn't respond like the participants in WB, they leaders didn't know what to do and generally overreacted. The new course is directed toward team buidling. Thats why Cub leaders are encouraged as well. I was our District person who worked with struggling adult committees and 9 times out of 10, the main problem was the unit didn't have a vision or a team concept. Each adults function on their own doing what they felt was important. I only had to show committees their vision and get them to understand each persons role on the team. It works very well and I think has benefited the program. I do however agree that the BSA needs to provide better access to outdoor skills. Almost 3/4 of adult joining troops today do not have any experience in scouting. And that has it's own problems. Barry

Sorry Barry but your experiences with the old WB course are NOT typical nationwide and neither is your comparison. WB21C really provides these untrained scoutmasters very little in helping them manage a troop and create a fun, challenging, and exciting experience for the boys. The boy scout program has been so dumbed down that almost any boy age 11 can get (not earn) their Eagle in a year and a half in the ever growing number of MB mill troops. The old WB course in my councils were excellent in taking these new sedentary SM's and giving them the tools and techniques so necessary in teaching scout skills and creating a really challenging program for the boys where they felt they really accomplished something. WB21C is nothing more than a management style program with virtually NOTHING to give the new troop leaders in the way of how to run a troop or letting the boys run the program, in my opinion and most others in my local councils WB21C is a total waste of time. Time for the BSA to get back to its basics and roots.

[Eagledad]

The present course that was introduced in 2000 is not like the previous course started in the 60's that was designed for experienced scoutmasters. And think goodness. You all don't realize how much of a problem the old course was because the new course has been running pretty well for 13 years now. But the problem with a course that simulates a perfect troop is that the partticipants that have no other experience to base a troop program on would force their scouts to function exactly like the WB troop. It all started with the inclusion of women as leaders because up until that time, the majority of troop leaders had some scouting experience as a youth. For men and women who didn't have any scouting experience gave them the best picture of running a troop. But wasn't intended to be an end all top shelf troop model program, it was a simply the model used for the real purpose of teaching adults different teaching styles. Yep, WB was not intended to teach adults how to run a troop, it's intention was guiding scoutmasters new teaching styles. But that intention got lost after 1990 because many of the adults used the course as the ideal troop model and that cause a lot of problems with units struggling. If the scouts didn't respond like the participants in WB, they leaders didn't know what to do and generally overreacted. The new course is directed toward team buidling. Thats why Cub leaders are encouraged as well. I was our District person who worked with struggling adult committees and 9 times out of 10, the main problem was the unit didn't have a vision or a team concept. Each adults function on their own doing what they felt was important. I only had to show committees their vision and get them to understand each persons role on the team. It works very well and I think has benefited the program. I do however agree that the BSA needs to provide better access to outdoor skills. Almost 3/4 of adult joining troops today do not have any experience in scouting. And that has it's own problems. Barry

LOL, BP you're assumptions are always intertaining to say the least. You are right, WB21C does little in helping SM's create a fun, challgening, and exciting experience for boys. That is not its purpose. It is desgined as a team builder and guide to understanding BSA visions and goals. Don't make more of it than that. As for the explination of changes, I got that from folks at national. We also had one of the developers of the old course here in our council and he explained the original intent of that course. It wasn't for raming as many new troop leaders through as possible for the purpose of learning how to run a troop. That is not from me, but course developers. And while the BSA may be lacking a basics course, Wood Badge is not the place. The problem with your perspective BP is you think everyone is born with the skills to run a unit. They are not and the new WB does have a place to help the problem. I know this because the issues the old course caused are rarely an issue today. And you see it in the forums as well. No more complaints of units where the scouts are leaving because the adults force the scouts to look like troop 1 of WB. Personally I enjoyed the older course, it was a lot of fun and I made some new friends. But I gained nothing from it in terms of running our troop. Like Stosh, I mostlly learned from my ticket. Barry

[Stosh]

The present course that was introduced in 2000 is not like the previous course started in the 60's that was designed for experienced scoutmasters. And think goodness. You all don't realize how much of a problem the old course was because the new course has been running pretty well for 13 years now. But the problem with a course that simulates a perfect troop is that the partticipants that have no other experience to base a troop program on would force their scouts to function exactly like the WB troop. It all started with the inclusion of women as leaders because up until that time, the majority of troop leaders had some scouting experience as a youth. For men and women who didn't have any scouting experience gave them the best picture of running a troop. But wasn't intended to be an end all top shelf troop model program, it was a simply the model used for the real purpose of teaching adults different teaching styles. Yep, WB was not intended to teach adults how to run a troop, it's intention was guiding scoutmasters new teaching styles. But that intention got lost after 1990 because many of the adults used the course as the ideal troop model and that cause a lot of problems with units struggling. If the scouts didn't respond like the participants in WB, they leaders didn't know what to do and generally overreacted. The new course is directed toward team buidling. Thats why Cub leaders are encouraged as well. I was our District person who worked with struggling adult committees and 9 times out of 10, the main problem was the unit didn't have a vision or a team concept. Each adults function on their own doing what they felt was important. I only had to show committees their vision and get them to understand each persons role on the team. It works very well and I think has benefited the program. I do however agree that the BSA needs to provide better access to outdoor skills. Almost 3/4 of adult joining troops today do not have any experience in scouting. And that has it's own problems. Barry

I'm thinking new WB is designed more for replacing leader specific training and would be better served there.

 

The team building concept is basically the Patrol-Method, which isn't being applied much, but could be resurrected without an expensive program.

 

Brew, you're correct, the old program is looking back on wistfully because it has been relegated to all the charm of the era of dinosaurs.

 

Even if they have had WB prior to 2000 they cannot serve on the new and improved program regardless of how many years of scouting they have under their belt.

 

Can't be on Jambo contingents either without special consideration. They put me on the Centennial Jambo contingent, not because I was WB trained, but because of my emphasis on boy-led. The interesting thing about the whole process is it had been traditional that the former contingent members were assigned selecting the next contingent staff. They didn't invite me to be in on that for the upcoming Jambo. Musta been something I said.

 

Stosh

[LeCastor]

Duckfoot, yes, I would definitely take Wood Badge again knowing what I know now. In fact, I would be interested to serve on the next Wood Badge staff in my council. While I don't care too much for PowerPoint presentations, I did think that the course information was useful in my Troop and in my work life. During Wood Badge, I got to live and interact for a whole week with my Beaver patrol and see what it's like to work as a team in a camping environment. Sure, I did that every summer as a Scout, but it's been a while since I was a Patrol Leader or Scribe in a Patrol context.

 

For outdoor skills, I enjoy staffing IOLS and learning more and more by teaching different sessions. It's fun to help get new Scouters enthused about LNT, lashings and backpacking. Do I wish Wood Badge still had a Scoutcraft component? Sure. Am I upset about it? No. As many have already said in countless Wood Badge threads, it's what you make of it. So were my undergrad and grad school experiences. Did I enjoy Wood Badge? Absolutely. Was it informative? Yes. I would do it again.

 

LeCastor