Shutdown ?

[moosetracker]

Hopefully your teaparty buddies in the house watch the same right-wing talk radio as you and drink the kool-aide.

 

Actually, I don't spend a lot of time "watching" radio of any kind. I just don't find "watching" the radio all that interesting. But, to each his or her own.

You mean you walk or drive around in you little tinfoil hat, while listening?.. Fine by me.. Your still soaking in the rhetoric.. What is weird is that you guys can listen to all the conflicting statements being put out and not see the inconsistencies..

 

"Where not doing this, the Democrats are".

"A government shutdown might be good for the country. Show people they don't need government".

"We're not going to be disrespected... we have to get something out of this. And I don't even know what that is."

"“We are very excited…it is exactly what we wanted.â€Â

"We keep passing Amendment bills to open up sections of the government, Senate doesn't pass them."

"85% of the government is up and running."

 

Their statements cancel out the other statements that they are making.. Yet you guys believe every single one of them..

[Stosh]

There are probably very few Democrats who are completely unwilling to compromise on ACA - are they' date=' too, "extremist ideologues"? [/quote']

Why should the Democrats compromise on a bill that was already written into law? It's a done deal. That's like the Patriots trying to negotiate the Superbowl victory after they were beaten by the Giants. Game over, move on. The majority of Americans support the ACA and want the shutdown to end. I'm sorry that a minority of people disagree but that's how democracy works.

 

Again' date=' that the ACA is the law of the land, for now, does not at all imply that it can't be debated, defunded, revoked, etc. It wasn't that long ago (1974-1995) that a 55 mph speed limit was "the law of the land."[/quote']

​41 House bills to repeal ACA have been debated, voted on and defeated. That's democracy in action. They can revisit repealing ACA in a new Congress/Senate/President in a few years but it's extremely shortsighted and foolish to think that Obama will sign a bill that would make major changes to his presidency's keystone legislation. The Republicans should stop wasting everyone's time.

"It's the law of the land!" This phrase has been a bit overused. It was a keystone in the propaganda of certain institutions, but I don't want to say which one because it would automatically write me off according to the Godwin Law of debate.

 

Just because something is the law of the land today, doesn't mean it is locked in stone forever. There have been a lot of laws that were repealed because of the demands of people, even some Constitutional amendments.

 

Stosh

[moosetracker]

There are probably very few Democrats who are completely unwilling to compromise on ACA - are they' date=' too, "extremist ideologues"? [/quote']

Why should the Democrats compromise on a bill that was already written into law? It's a done deal. That's like the Patriots trying to negotiate the Superbowl victory after they were beaten by the Giants. Game over, move on. The majority of Americans support the ACA and want the shutdown to end. I'm sorry that a minority of people disagree but that's how democracy works.

 

Again' date=' that the ACA is the law of the land, for now, does not at all imply that it can't be debated, defunded, revoked, etc. It wasn't that long ago (1974-1995) that a 55 mph speed limit was "the law of the land."[/quote']

​41 House bills to repeal ACA have been debated, voted on and defeated. That's democracy in action. They can revisit repealing ACA in a new Congress/Senate/President in a few years but it's extremely shortsighted and foolish to think that Obama will sign a bill that would make major changes to his presidency's keystone legislation. The Republicans should stop wasting everyone's time.

Not without going into effect unless found unconstitutional by the court system.. Oh, yeah, that has already been played out and guess who won that round.. Now the law goes into effect, if it doesn't work, the Republicans have something they can campaign on.. If it doesn't work, they look like fools.. Oh, yeah, they already do.. So really if all your scare tactics are correct, you should be ushering in Obamacare with high anticipation that it will help you in future elections where then you can repeal it.. But, you are scared to death of it's implementation.. Wonder why??

[JoeBob]

Tidbit:

 

Obama in 2006: "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure."

At that time the National Debt was a mere $9 trillion. Have you heard any Dem say by how much they want to increase the debt ceiling? One trillion dollars to get them through the 2014 election cycle (I rounded up from $988 Billion...). Are we going to let Obama double the debt before he's out of office? ($9T in 2006, $14.4T in 2013, add $1T for 2014, $1T for 2015...)

 

Frustration:

This is like arguing with a teenager who refuses to believe that their bank account is overdrawn: "I can't be out of money! I have more checks!"

Liberal members of the media, congress, and this forum are all relying on emotion to make their argument. All emotion and personal vitriol, no ability to face facts.

"It's never been done before!" Wrong - 27 times since 1976.

"Federal workers are going without a paycheck!" Yes. I feel bad for them. But many of them really need to start looking at the private sector and adjusting their long range plans. Hopefully they're smart enough to realize that, mathematically, the Fed cannot keep spending money at the current pace. There are not enough rich people to punish to pay the bills.

 

To my fellow conservatives: I'm pretty sure that we're not going to change any minds in here. They're not thinking.

[moosetracker]

Tidbit:

 

Obama in 2006: "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure."

At that time the National Debt was a mere $9 trillion. Have you heard any Dem say by how much they want to increase the debt ceiling? One trillion dollars to get them through the 2014 election cycle (I rounded up from $988 Billion...). Are we going to let Obama double the debt before he's out of office? ($9T in 2006, $14.4T in 2013, add $1T for 2014, $1T for 2015...)

 

Frustration:

This is like arguing with a teenager who refuses to believe that their bank account is overdrawn: "I can't be out of money! I have more checks!"

Liberal members of the media, congress, and this forum are all relying on emotion to make their argument. All emotion and personal vitriol, no ability to face facts.

"It's never been done before!" Wrong - 27 times since 1976.

"Federal workers are going without a paycheck!" Yes. I feel bad for them. But many of them really need to start looking at the private sector and adjusting their long range plans. Hopefully they're smart enough to realize that, mathematically, the Fed cannot keep spending money at the current pace. There are not enough rich people to punish to pay the bills.

 

To my fellow conservatives: I'm pretty sure that we're not going to change any minds in here. They're not thinking.

We have to first get the Republicans to stop holding their breath, and demanding a ransom for a 6 week extension of spending.. Then we can go into negotiation on the Debt ceiling and the budget.. Nothing is going anywhere until they stop trying to demand negotiation on a small extension bill, and just pass it.. Then negotiations can start for the Debt ceiling the Dems will start with something the Republicans will not except, the Republicans will come with their equally absurd demands and they can both meet in the middle.

 

Normal negotiations, after the Republicans let go of the hostage.

[JoeBob]

Tidbit:

 

Obama in 2006: "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure."

At that time the National Debt was a mere $9 trillion. Have you heard any Dem say by how much they want to increase the debt ceiling? One trillion dollars to get them through the 2014 election cycle (I rounded up from $988 Billion...). Are we going to let Obama double the debt before he's out of office? ($9T in 2006, $14.4T in 2013, add $1T for 2014, $1T for 2015...)

 

Frustration:

This is like arguing with a teenager who refuses to believe that their bank account is overdrawn: "I can't be out of money! I have more checks!"

Liberal members of the media, congress, and this forum are all relying on emotion to make their argument. All emotion and personal vitriol, no ability to face facts.

"It's never been done before!" Wrong - 27 times since 1976.

"Federal workers are going without a paycheck!" Yes. I feel bad for them. But many of them really need to start looking at the private sector and adjusting their long range plans. Hopefully they're smart enough to realize that, mathematically, the Fed cannot keep spending money at the current pace. There are not enough rich people to punish to pay the bills.

 

To my fellow conservatives: I'm pretty sure that we're not going to change any minds in here. They're not thinking.

"I'll gladly pay you tomorrow for a hamburger today..."

[moosetracker]

Tidbit:

 

Obama in 2006: "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure."

At that time the National Debt was a mere $9 trillion. Have you heard any Dem say by how much they want to increase the debt ceiling? One trillion dollars to get them through the 2014 election cycle (I rounded up from $988 Billion...). Are we going to let Obama double the debt before he's out of office? ($9T in 2006, $14.4T in 2013, add $1T for 2014, $1T for 2015...)

 

Frustration:

This is like arguing with a teenager who refuses to believe that their bank account is overdrawn: "I can't be out of money! I have more checks!"

Liberal members of the media, congress, and this forum are all relying on emotion to make their argument. All emotion and personal vitriol, no ability to face facts.

"It's never been done before!" Wrong - 27 times since 1976.

"Federal workers are going without a paycheck!" Yes. I feel bad for them. But many of them really need to start looking at the private sector and adjusting their long range plans. Hopefully they're smart enough to realize that, mathematically, the Fed cannot keep spending money at the current pace. There are not enough rich people to punish to pay the bills.

 

To my fellow conservatives: I'm pretty sure that we're not going to change any minds in here. They're not thinking.

Sorry, but the 6 weeks extension has nothing to do with either the Debt ceiling negotiations or the budget negotiations.

 

You are trying to charge me $5 bucks for a glass of tap water before I even order my hamburger, and I can't order the hamburger because you refuse to let me have the menu until I pay 5 bucks for the water.. I won't pay $5 bucks for tap water.. Sorry..

[JoeBob]

Tidbit:

 

Obama in 2006: "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure."

At that time the National Debt was a mere $9 trillion. Have you heard any Dem say by how much they want to increase the debt ceiling? One trillion dollars to get them through the 2014 election cycle (I rounded up from $988 Billion...). Are we going to let Obama double the debt before he's out of office? ($9T in 2006, $14.4T in 2013, add $1T for 2014, $1T for 2015...)

 

Frustration:

This is like arguing with a teenager who refuses to believe that their bank account is overdrawn: "I can't be out of money! I have more checks!"

Liberal members of the media, congress, and this forum are all relying on emotion to make their argument. All emotion and personal vitriol, no ability to face facts.

"It's never been done before!" Wrong - 27 times since 1976.

"Federal workers are going without a paycheck!" Yes. I feel bad for them. But many of them really need to start looking at the private sector and adjusting their long range plans. Hopefully they're smart enough to realize that, mathematically, the Fed cannot keep spending money at the current pace. There are not enough rich people to punish to pay the bills.

 

To my fellow conservatives: I'm pretty sure that we're not going to change any minds in here. They're not thinking.

More like you've gotten $14.1 Trillion worth of hamburgers YESTERDAY and are refusing to pay.

 

And have the gall to ask for more hamburgers...

[Brewmeister]

When congress "passes" the most sweeping social welfare program in a generation by parliamentary maneuver and with NO bipartisan support, it should be no surprise that the peoples' house would lead a revolt.

[moosetracker]

Tidbit:

 

Obama in 2006: "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure."

At that time the National Debt was a mere $9 trillion. Have you heard any Dem say by how much they want to increase the debt ceiling? One trillion dollars to get them through the 2014 election cycle (I rounded up from $988 Billion...). Are we going to let Obama double the debt before he's out of office? ($9T in 2006, $14.4T in 2013, add $1T for 2014, $1T for 2015...)

 

Frustration:

This is like arguing with a teenager who refuses to believe that their bank account is overdrawn: "I can't be out of money! I have more checks!"

Liberal members of the media, congress, and this forum are all relying on emotion to make their argument. All emotion and personal vitriol, no ability to face facts.

"It's never been done before!" Wrong - 27 times since 1976.

"Federal workers are going without a paycheck!" Yes. I feel bad for them. But many of them really need to start looking at the private sector and adjusting their long range plans. Hopefully they're smart enough to realize that, mathematically, the Fed cannot keep spending money at the current pace. There are not enough rich people to punish to pay the bills.

 

To my fellow conservatives: I'm pretty sure that we're not going to change any minds in here. They're not thinking.

Most of that was bought by the Republican President Bush, who lowered the taxes to where the government couldn't fund itself, then got into 2 wars that couldn't be paid for.. So what "you" are you pointing to??

 

Still, I won't pay $5 bucks for your tap water.

[moosetracker]

When congress "passes" the most sweeping social welfare program in a generation by parliamentary maneuver and with NO bipartisan support, it should be no surprise that the peoples' house would lead a revolt.

So are you saying the elected senate is not elected by the people.. The elected President is not elected by the people.. Actually due to those elections not being able to be gerrymandered, Senate & President are MORE representative of the peoples choice then the house ever will be..

 

If the Republicans were playing all sorts of parliamentary games to keep the ACA from passing, you can't all of a sudden call "foul" if someone plays your game and out maneuvers you. Republicans played games, Democrats followed suit. Democrats won. End of subject.

[Stosh]

Tidbit:

 

Obama in 2006: "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure."

At that time the National Debt was a mere $9 trillion. Have you heard any Dem say by how much they want to increase the debt ceiling? One trillion dollars to get them through the 2014 election cycle (I rounded up from $988 Billion...). Are we going to let Obama double the debt before he's out of office? ($9T in 2006, $14.4T in 2013, add $1T for 2014, $1T for 2015...)

 

Frustration:

This is like arguing with a teenager who refuses to believe that their bank account is overdrawn: "I can't be out of money! I have more checks!"

Liberal members of the media, congress, and this forum are all relying on emotion to make their argument. All emotion and personal vitriol, no ability to face facts.

"It's never been done before!" Wrong - 27 times since 1976.

"Federal workers are going without a paycheck!" Yes. I feel bad for them. But many of them really need to start looking at the private sector and adjusting their long range plans. Hopefully they're smart enough to realize that, mathematically, the Fed cannot keep spending money at the current pace. There are not enough rich people to punish to pay the bills.

 

To my fellow conservatives: I'm pretty sure that we're not going to change any minds in here. They're not thinking.

Bush? Ancient history. What Bush may have pushed, Obama made a career out of. Our children would have suffered for years with the debt of Bush's administration, but it's going to take generations to fix it now with the current administration... and they're asking for even MORE!

 

There's got to be some way of stopping this slippery slope. The Tea Party may be adamant about it, but they're the only one's calling for a halt in such insanity.

 

Stosh

[Stosh]

When congress "passes" the most sweeping social welfare program in a generation by parliamentary maneuver and with NO bipartisan support, it should be no surprise that the peoples' house would lead a revolt.

The President is elected by the Electoral College. Abraham Lincoln was elected with 39% of the popular vote. It works for good and for bad. But the People don't elect a president, they elect members of the Electoral College. Only the senators and representatives are elected by the people. To draw the senate different than the house is simply incorrect.

 

Stosh

[Brewmeister]

When congress "passes" the most sweeping social welfare program in a generation by parliamentary maneuver and with NO bipartisan support, it should be no surprise that the peoples' house would lead a revolt.

The House of Representatives is commonly called "The peoples' house." If you'd spend less time "watching" your radio and more time studying basic civics you might actually learn something.

[Stosh]

There are probably very few Democrats who are completely unwilling to compromise on ACA - are they' date=' too, "extremist ideologues"? [/quote']

Why should the Democrats compromise on a bill that was already written into law? It's a done deal. That's like the Patriots trying to negotiate the Superbowl victory after they were beaten by the Giants. Game over, move on. The majority of Americans support the ACA and want the shutdown to end. I'm sorry that a minority of people disagree but that's how democracy works.

 

Again' date=' that the ACA is the law of the land, for now, does not at all imply that it can't be debated, defunded, revoked, etc. It wasn't that long ago (1974-1995) that a 55 mph speed limit was "the law of the land."[/quote']

​41 House bills to repeal ACA have been debated, voted on and defeated. That's democracy in action. They can revisit repealing ACA in a new Congress/Senate/President in a few years but it's extremely shortsighted and foolish to think that Obama will sign a bill that would make major changes to his presidency's keystone legislation. The Republicans should stop wasting everyone's time.

Prohibition was ruled Constitutional, but the people repealed it. I can't change history. It's a fact and it was before my time so I didn't have anything to do with it, and Bush wasn't born yet, so he didn't either.

 

Stosh