New Scout is a Jehovah's Witness

[packsaddle]

I could try to come up with a better example but it would be difficult to beat this one....to demonstrate the mess we get into when people and organizations try to poke their noses into the private beliefs (or worse, try to control the beliefs) of others.

 

If the CO for the unit I serve wants to exercise some kind of control over the beliefs of the scouts in this unit, they are free to knock themselves out trying. But it's not in my job description. If BSA wants to continue to wallow in this quagmire, they are free to do that as well but there's nothing that says I have to do the wallowing for them. It's THEIR mess of THEIR making and they can lie in it. If a boy or a leader fills out an application and signs it and if the CO has no objection, I'm sending it up the line. And if the council and BSA want to create controversy and strife by enforcing their 'rules', I'll be glad to step aside and let them take the heat. It's not part of my job to question the beliefs of others and act as an 'enforcer' for BSA.

NeverAnEagle, In this thread I am acting as an advocate for the boy. Is this not obvious? Yes, BSA could reject the application. BSA successfully defended their right to reject memberships for any reason they wish, in front of the Supreme Court. I'm a volunteer and I don't have the ability to 'override' the geniuses in the professional ranks. So I'll defend the boys against other volunteers who DO think they have the responsibility and are qualified to judge boys in matters of faith.

[King Ding Dong]

Somethings need Shouting.. but Yes I am having Fun with the Editors. Joining Scouts is About Participating in Scouts. Not Participating Is Kinda Like sitting at Home saying your Part of Football Team because You don't wan't to get sweaty.

Lol. Or a woman who wants to be married but doesn't want relations because it is "messy"

[BadenP]

As others have pointed out the Jehovah Witnesses FORBID their members from joining boy scouts period. Allowing him to continue will result in him being asked to leave his faith tradition so you are playing fast and loose with his and his families religious beliefs and status in their tradition. Unless the parents tell you they are leaving the JW's you allowing this to continue is playing with fire and is totally irresponsible.

NJ I am good friends with several JW elders and they verified what I said is true if the boy continues in the scouts he will be asked to leave his faith tradition. If the SM continues on the current path the boy and his parents will be asked to leave their faith tradition. Sad but true the SM needs to act more responsibly in this case find out the parents intentions regarding their faith then act accordingly. Look up the JW website for yourself to see what they do and do not allow and why the BSA is NOT a good fit for their boys.

[moosetracker]

Somethings need Shouting.. but Yes I am having Fun with the Editors. Joining Scouts is About Participating in Scouts. Not Participating Is Kinda Like sitting at Home saying your Part of Football Team because You don't wan't to get sweaty.

Depends.. If the troop is active in hiking, canoeing, camping etc.. and the boy enjoys these things, he may not be able to participate in all of scouting, he can't do the advancement stuff.. But it is like sitting at Home saying your part of a football team.. It's more like just showing up for the games but missing parts of the warmup and exercise sessions.

[NJCubScouter]

As others have pointed out the Jehovah Witnesses FORBID their members from joining boy scouts period. Allowing him to continue will result in him being asked to leave his faith tradition so you are playing fast and loose with his and his families religious beliefs and status in their tradition. Unless the parents tell you they are leaving the JW's you allowing this to continue is playing with fire and is totally irresponsible.

BadenP, it seems to me that it is up to the parents to act in accordance with their own beliefs, which they presumably know better than the SM.

[dfscott]

Hey All-

 

Sorry to resurrect this old thread, but I thought I'd provide an update.

 

I ran into our DE at a scout event and tried to pin her down on it. She did some admirable bobbing and weaving, but eventually it came to "BSA has no problems with JW -- it's the other way around, so you need to discuss with the family and make sure they understand what is required."

 

So, our CC sat down with the boy's mom (not deliberately excluding dad -- he just doesn't speak much English). She considers her family as "not particularly devout" and doesn't have any problems with her son saying the Pledge. It was something she told him long ago and she didn't even remember saying it. In the meantime, he's been part of our flag ceremonies, and also stands and salutes the flag while saying the pledge. My son goes to the same school (where they also say the pledge) and he says he does it there as well.

 

Looking at the joining requirements, it says: "Repeat the Pledge of Allegiance." It doesn't say "swear fealty" or anything like that. It doesn't even say "Repeat the Pledge of Allegiance and agree to follow it." (although many may say that is implied).

 

So, for now, I've given him his Scout Badge. I didn't want him to be the only boy in the troop without one. When we get to Tenderfoot, we'll see where it stands (since that's when you agree to follow the Oath and Law).

 

Thanks, everyone, for all the feedback and discussion.

 

 

[SSScout]

DF: Don't be sorry. I somehow missed this thread the first time 'round. As in many things religious, we often have more things in common than not. Us Quakers (and I do not speak for all of us, just those that agree with me) traditionally hold to five main testimonies, Biblically based ( I'll not go into all the particulars) historically, but some would deny that.

Jesus instructed us to not swear at all, but simply let your yea be yea and your nay be nay. We therefore are advised to avoid all "judicial "oaths, but promising to do something "on our honor " is certainly OK..Idolitry is a no-no. Saying one thing and doing another is not desirable. So most Friends avoid saying the PoA. No harm in reciting and being knowledgable about it, just not in "saying" it officially. I also have read parts of Mein Kampf and Das Kapital, but doesn't mean I agree with them.

I have never had anyone challenge me when I step back and stay silent when others salute and say what they think is appropriate.

 

I am in agreement with BP when he says a boy's family's faith is up to the parents, and it is up to us Scouters to second their efforts.

[Huzzar]

Wouldn't the Boy Scouts encourage a tepid JW to become more devoted to his religion?

Nothin'