qwazse Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 If a church is having misgivings about hosting a BSA unit, maybe this is their program. But, I would be concerned if, for example, the best canoeing instructor in the community is non-Christian, and my youth want to develop a long term canoeing program. I would like to be able to incorporate that person in an official capacity in my unit. Sounds like the TL leaders are going to have to work around obstacles like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ding Dong Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 If a church is having misgivings about hosting a BSA unit, maybe this is their program. But, I would be concerned if, for example, the best canoeing instructor in the community is non-Christian, and my youth want to develop a long term canoeing program. I would like to be able to incorporate that person in an official capacity in my unit. Sounds like the TL leaders are going to have to work around obstacles like that. They aren't going to like this, but from the pictures looks like they are going to a have a more LIBERAL policy on guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WAKWIB Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 If a church is having misgivings about hosting a BSA unit, maybe this is their program. . Right now the spotlight seems to be on the churches that are recently dropping BSA and considering TLUSA, but I think there is an even greater potential market in those churches who have never sponsored a Scouting unit or haven't for a very long time. That is a variable that may be greater that even TLUSA expects. There seems to be a genuine surprise among TL leadership about how this thing has gained momentum. I don't think that it's all about the gay issue, or even all about Christianity. I think the sense of this being a new, grass-roots, reimaging of scouting has a lot of appeal. Honestly, that is why I find it so fascinating. I've heard people cuss and discuss various problems with Scouting for 40 years. Everyone has a big idea of what they would do if they were "king of the forest." Now we can see what happens when folks get off the pot and concentrate some creative effort to make some of these changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moosetracker Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 I believe the Pope wears one as well' date=' and I have seen photos of Cardinals in the Catholic church wearing them, though I suspect they don't call them yarmulkes.[/quote'] Right, it is called the "zuchetto". I believe it originated as a way for clergy to cover their tonsure (the part of the head that is shaven) and has remained even though the tonsure has been more or less done away with. Now you can all go back to your regularly scheduled discussion of Trail Life. About which I will say, basically I agree with you. The only situation in which I could see a Jewish or Muslim or Buddhist boy wanting to join Trail Life is if he were friends with a bunch of other boys who were joining, and even then I would expect most parents to try to steer their son toward an organization that was equally welcoming to all religions. (I know that's what I would do if I still had a son of Scout age.) With what I've seen from Trail Life USA, I can say that as a Catholic I would not want my sons to join. It seems like it is basically a Protestant organization. Huzzar you forgot the Methodists and United Church of Christ also.. All 4 of these are not small communities within the Protestant community.. We may have forgotten one or two other large bodies, but I know there are other smaller groups.. I just know that I do look for Protestant churches with a more modern views, and they are very easy to find in my community.. Therefore I would not say "mainstream" rejects the views of liberal churches.. I would say half of protestant church's are conservative, and half are not. Same with Catholic churches.. I am curious to see the new Popes liberal views on Catholics being more welcoming and being concerned about poverty and not about social issues.. He is now taking the Catholic church back to the viewpoint of "Love they neighbor as thy self" and "He who is without sin, cast the first stone".. So this is going to cause anger with his conservation population.. As stated he is not changing the catholic doctrines, but he is seeing it as something not to be highlighted and dwelled upon, and in the light of "We are all sinners" and one sin is not greater then another persons sin.. We may soon see a split off of Conservative Catholics due to this shift, but it sounds like a lot of Catholics are excited about the change in tone. Sort of the Pope now in agreement with the views of the "Nuns on the bus", where last years the nuns were being chastised and punished by the last pope for being more concerned about poverty, then about gays. abortions and contraception.. All I can way is I for one think it is a positive direction for Catholics.. I hope this new pope lives long and prospers.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 When there is more revealed about TLUSA's actual program and organizational structure , it might be interesting to have a topic where there is some comparisons made between their operation and the ours in BSA. There may be some good ideas floating around in a new and forming group that we could borrow and modify to make our program better. Hopefully if that more positive and constructive topic is introduced it will not get deleted by a moderator or the site owner. Yeah, I know this topic that survived the purge about TL being "confused" about who they are makes it easy to take shots at them and makes us real Scouters feel so much better about ourselves. I do think a more objective study of the nuts and bolts of a potential competitor could be more constructive and helpful to us as we do our jobs of serving youth. Your assuming Wak...... The reason I worded it the way I did was because I was completely flabbergasted by them allowing gay youth in..... The original cited reason for them to leave and they were back pedaling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 I am King of the Forest.... I am a Scoutmaster of a troop of 30 young men. We camp as a troop monthly, our patrols have monthly patrol outings. We participate in community service and are working on being Boy led. the patrols have a very strong patrol identity and I couldn't happier. Very Little national says actually impacts the youth in my program......We have, I suspect, gay youth as members already. We have gay scouters. we have muslims, jews, catholics atheist and all variety of protestants. I jump thru the training hoops, I jump thru the paper work hoops, I jump thru the rules hoops.......But ya know the boys never see it and probably could care less. Because I understand that scouting isn't about me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 If a church is having misgivings about hosting a BSA unit, maybe this is their program. But, I would be concerned if, for example, the best canoeing instructor in the community is non-Christian, and my youth want to develop a long term canoeing program. I would like to be able to incorporate that person in an official capacity in my unit. Sounds like the TL leaders are going to have to work around obstacles like that. I would like to see boys be able to enjoy shooting AR style rifles.....Why? Because that is what they are into. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ding Dong Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 I am King of the Forest.... I am a Scoutmaster of a troop of 30 young men. We camp as a troop monthly, our patrols have monthly patrol outings. We participate in community service and are working on being Boy led. the patrols have a very strong patrol identity and I couldn't happier. Very Little national says actually impacts the youth in my program......We have, I suspect, gay youth as members already. We have gay scouters. we have muslims, jews, catholics atheist and all variety of protestants. I jump thru the training hoops, I jump thru the paper work hoops, I jump thru the rules hoops.......But ya know the boys never see it and probably could care less. Because I understand that scouting isn't about me. I thought you said you would kick the smart ass atheist out ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ding Dong Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 If a church is having misgivings about hosting a BSA unit, maybe this is their program. But, I would be concerned if, for example, the best canoeing instructor in the community is non-Christian, and my youth want to develop a long term canoeing program. I would like to be able to incorporate that person in an official capacity in my unit. Sounds like the TL leaders are going to have to work around obstacles like that. They can't now at a range ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 If a church is having misgivings about hosting a BSA unit, maybe this is their program. But, I would be concerned if, for example, the best canoeing instructor in the community is non-Christian, and my youth want to develop a long term canoeing program. I would like to be able to incorporate that person in an official capacity in my unit. Sounds like the TL leaders are going to have to work around obstacles like that. Under the lovely umbrella of scouting I can't take the boy scout troop to the range and shoot 9mm pistols or 223 ar rifles or even semi automatic rifles.... Now as a group of friends and families we could do it.......Outside of the umbrella...we could go shoot what ever anybody owns...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 I am King of the Forest.... I am a Scoutmaster of a troop of 30 young men. We camp as a troop monthly, our patrols have monthly patrol outings. We participate in community service and are working on being Boy led. the patrols have a very strong patrol identity and I couldn't happier. Very Little national says actually impacts the youth in my program......We have, I suspect, gay youth as members already. We have gay scouters. we have muslims, jews, catholics atheist and all variety of protestants. I jump thru the training hoops, I jump thru the paper work hoops, I jump thru the rules hoops.......But ya know the boys never see it and probably could care less. Because I understand that scouting isn't about me. He said he was an atheist....but has no clue what it is......The second he very clearly articulates what it is and still professes he is.....he will be asked to leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlyn_LeRoy Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 I am King of the Forest.... I am a Scoutmaster of a troop of 30 young men. We camp as a troop monthly, our patrols have monthly patrol outings. We participate in community service and are working on being Boy led. the patrols have a very strong patrol identity and I couldn't happier. Very Little national says actually impacts the youth in my program......We have, I suspect, gay youth as members already. We have gay scouters. we have muslims, jews, catholics atheist and all variety of protestants. I jump thru the training hoops, I jump thru the paper work hoops, I jump thru the rules hoops.......But ya know the boys never see it and probably could care less. Because I understand that scouting isn't about me. Why would you ask him to leave? You've previously said your program has (or you suspect it has) atheists members, and that you're handling all the "rules hoops", so do they even realize that atheists can't be members? Or would they only find out as they were getting kicked out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 I am King of the Forest.... I am a Scoutmaster of a troop of 30 young men. We camp as a troop monthly, our patrols have monthly patrol outings. We participate in community service and are working on being Boy led. the patrols have a very strong patrol identity and I couldn't happier. Very Little national says actually impacts the youth in my program......We have, I suspect, gay youth as members already. We have gay scouters. we have muslims, jews, catholics atheist and all variety of protestants. I jump thru the training hoops, I jump thru the paper work hoops, I jump thru the rules hoops.......But ya know the boys never see it and probably could care less. Because I understand that scouting isn't about me. Because that is what the troop committee has said it wants. with that said how will the troop committee ever find out???? And to be completely honest it depends on how the lad acts....... If he is going to be a idiot about it waving his atheist flag about he has gotta go.....If he is respectful of others beliefs then there is no problem...... Just as with any lad.....If a catholic or protestant kid gets out of line.....Would be dealt with exactly the same. Tone it down or you will be asked to leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Ding Dong Posted September 20, 2013 Share Posted September 20, 2013 I am King of the Forest.... I am a Scoutmaster of a troop of 30 young men. We camp as a troop monthly, our patrols have monthly patrol outings. We participate in community service and are working on being Boy led. the patrols have a very strong patrol identity and I couldn't happier. Very Little national says actually impacts the youth in my program......We have, I suspect, gay youth as members already. We have gay scouters. we have muslims, jews, catholics atheist and all variety of protestants. I jump thru the training hoops, I jump thru the paper work hoops, I jump thru the rules hoops.......But ya know the boys never see it and probably could care less. Because I understand that scouting isn't about me. How is waving your atheist flag around any different than waving your Catholic flag around ? You previously said you would inform the troop committee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted September 20, 2013 Author Share Posted September 20, 2013 I am King of the Forest.... I am a Scoutmaster of a troop of 30 young men. We camp as a troop monthly, our patrols have monthly patrol outings. We participate in community service and are working on being Boy led. the patrols have a very strong patrol identity and I couldn't happier. Very Little national says actually impacts the youth in my program......We have, I suspect, gay youth as members already. We have gay scouters. we have muslims, jews, catholics atheist and all variety of protestants. I jump thru the training hoops, I jump thru the paper work hoops, I jump thru the rules hoops.......But ya know the boys never see it and probably could care less. Because I understand that scouting isn't about me. KDD you really have no clue....I am sorry there is no rule written in a book or a picture or pictograph you can look at and see clear black and white. this is a grey area....... Ya need your glasses checked.....you didn't read my previous post. My scouting world is much different than your Mono culture, religion and color world. I would be dealt with in the exact same manner an over zealous catholic who is not respectful of others beliefs would be asked to leave as well. Just as I would deal with an over zealous gay youth....... It is about respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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