Is BALOO required for pack campout ?

[dedkad]

I have had other packs approach me to attend a campout with them because I am BALOO-trained and their person wasn't available to come. Maybe someone from another pack would be willing to help you out.

[Fehler]

Stop doing the work for them. Tell them to step it up, or its nothing but Day Camp. Them's the rules, and if you as IH won't enforce them, who will? Sure,. if training is unavailable on the short notice, give them the option of inviting someone from another Pack. But make them do the call/set it up. Stop the hand-holding.

[King Ding Dong]

Lewis and Clark council is offering Baloo training September 21st......

 

That is pretty close to your location.

Thanks for that. GSLAC has LOE on 10/5-6 also (20 min from the CO) but maybe I get someone to at least do BALOO.

[King Ding Dong]

I have had other packs approach me to attend a campout with them because I am BALOO-trained and their person wasn't available to come. Maybe someone from another pack would be willing to help you out.

That is an option, but the downside is I would just be enabling them.

[kari_cardi]

KDD, you could also use the argument that the pack cam out will be a better experience if led by someone trained to lead such an event. I'd focus on getting a Wolf or Bear leader to do BALOO so you don't have to do this again next year or the year after. I'd also present it as 'this is the training for Cub Scout leaders to camp, and Webelos leaders need to take WELOTS' so it is matter-of-fact and just part of training and not 'special training that is a PITA that council requires so we can have fun.'

 

FWIW, my council lets someone with WELOTS or IOLS stand in for BALOO-trained. My council also doesn't require a tour permit for outings within council boundaries, so there isn't any real oversight there anyway. We still follow the rules because 1. it truly does give a better experience to have someone trained, and 2. it's the right thing to do.

[AKdenldr]

Yes Baloo is required.

 

Change the date for the campout so you can make it. Announce that the date was changed because "we need a czar of camping". Then recruit like crazy for someone(s) (in person conversations) to be our "Pack Campout Guru". Pack Campout Guru sets the pack camp date schedules, attends campouts, and must do the training. Since this is a limited role (how many campouts do you do anyways?) you should be able to find a parent who likes the campouts and can do that for the boys.

 

Now, if the fall campout is a council or district thing where the date is set -- I think there are plenty of trained folks there.

[Woodward]

Lewis and Clark council is offering Baloo training September 21st......

 

That is pretty close to your location.

KDD, I took the LOE at Beaumont a couple of years ago and we had a lot of fun, at 20 bucks it's not a bank breaker.

[SSScout]

 

In my council, the camp training appears to be cumulative. One can take BALOO. If you take OWL, then you have credit for BALOO and OWL. If you take IOLS, with an extra hour or so of discussion, you have IOLS,and OWL, and BALOO credit. There is a Cub Scout program section that has to be done, but the IOLS covers a multitude of, er, sins.

[King Ding Dong]

I've been trying for two years now to take BALOO, ever since I found out that our pack, like yours, is short of trained folks. Our district rarely does it, and the neighboring districts only do it during the school year when we are active with pack stuff. can't run the pack if we cancel events to get trained!

 

Regardless, other than trying to do right why does it matter? It's family camping. Jr is camping with mom and dad, not you. The pack just happens to be there too.....

BD what is OWL then ? I have two trainingcertificates from that weekend BALOO and OWL -Webelos. I think OWL is just less to write with the "leader skills" left off.

[jc2008]

If you don't have a BALOO you can do "family camping". The difference is that you are not covered by BSA insurance if its a family camp rather than a cub scout camp trip.

 

There are good reasons to do the training. I hope your leaders are at least Youth Protection Trained!

[King Ding Dong]

Yeah they all do YPT. I talked to my co IH, no to on family camping, to much liability and I agree. I have a few prospects. One asked me today if BALOO had an online option. Sigh.

[Basementdweller]

In my council, the camp training appears to be cumulative. One can take BALOO. If you take OWL, then you have credit for BALOO and OWL. If you take IOLS, with an extra hour or so of discussion, you have IOLS,and OWL, and BALOO credit. There is a Cub Scout program section that has to be done, but the IOLS covers a multitude of, er, sins.

That doesn't seem right....

 

Baloo and owl covers different things.......and IOLS has nothing to do with pack camping

[Basementdweller]

Just thrown something out for digestion.

 

So you schedule a Pack campout with no Baloo trained person in attendance....Your in council so you don't need to get a tour plan. The Campmaster at check in will not look for the training card.... It is a scheduled pack event.....Insurance is good to go.

 

hmmmm, Sounds all legit to me...No baloo trained person....no way for council or the powers figure it out.......

 

 

 

[King Ding Dong]

Just thrown something out for digestion.

 

So you schedule a Pack campout with no Baloo trained person in attendance....Your in council so you don't need to get a tour plan. The Campmaster at check in will not look for the training card.... It is a scheduled pack event.....Insurance is good to go.

 

hmmmm, Sounds all legit to me...No baloo trained person....no way for council or the powers figure it out.......

 

 

Wow, BD getting all lawyery. I am not sure I followed that. I ran it by a District trainer and a 25 year district guy they both told me without BALOO it is considered family camping and BSA insurance does not cover family camping. GTSS is very vague on this. Notice it says tiger, wolf and bear dens cannot camp as dens and no insurance will be issued. What if your pack is only tigers or only wolves show up ? What bloody difference does it make if the campout has all tigers or all bears anyway, if you have trained leaders and parents ???

 

We are not camping on council property this time so I want to not only protect the pack but also the CO.

 

I think I have one guy willing to do the BALOO only. He just wants to make sure he is not responsible for planning the whole campout. This will be a less than 24 hour campout, not much to plan. A couple activities, a hike, bobcat ceremony, eat, let the boys run around some more, s'mores, sleep. Wake up, eat, leave. Planning complete.

[kari_cardi]

In my council, the camp training appears to be cumulative. One can take BALOO. If you take OWL, then you have credit for BALOO and OWL. If you take IOLS, with an extra hour or so of discussion, you have IOLS,and OWL, and BALOO credit. There is a Cub Scout program section that has to be done, but the IOLS covers a multitude of, er, sins.

I agree, it doesn't seem right but that's a great description of how my council does it. I'll take it if it means we get to camp. My personal theory is this practice evolved as the number of training opportunities declined due to a lack of volunteer trainers.