OA and Venturing

[EagleScout441]

I have been debating in the "OA and Venturing" topic for a few days now in favor of Venturers having elections. I would like to know how the Venturers feel about it. If you aren't a Venturer please DO NOT answer in this poll. This poll will be open until 08/31/2013 00:00.

[qwazse]

Nice poll. Wonder how many venturers will think they are venture scouts.

[EagleScout441]

Lets just hope for now that some Venturers will actually vote.

[gsdad]

Seeing as this is a Scouter forum, I don't think we are your target audience. What is a Venture Scout?

 

[EagleScout441]

Seeing as this is a Scouter forum, I don't think we are your target audience. What is a Venture Scout?

"What is a Venture Scout?" Is that a serious question? A Venture Scout is a member of a Venture Crew.

"I don't think we are your target audience." You might not be but there are Venturers on this Forum.

[dhendron]

Seeing as this is a Scouter forum, I don't think we are your target audience. What is a Venture Scout?

Actually, there is no such thing as a "Venture Scout" or a "Venture Crew" and never has been. A Venturing Crew member is a youth (male or female, depending on the demographics for that particular Venturing Crew) that is registered with a BSA Venturing Crew.

 

The word "Venture" is no longer officially used by BSA. Its last use was associated with the "Venture Patrol", which I understand (correct me if I am wrong) is no longer officially supported by BSA although they still sell the patch and many units still have them. This was intended to be a high adventure patrol of older boys in a Boy Scout Troop.

[Stosh]

If OA is a Boy Scout program, why would Venturing even be involved? Same for the leadership of the Cub Scout program. Do they wear the lodge flap on their DL uniform?

[EagleScout441]

Seeing as this is a Scouter forum, I don't think we are your target audience. What is a Venture Scout?

Boy Scout, Sea Scout, Varsity Scout, and, Venturer? Why do all of them have "Scout" in their title except Venturing? Do Venturers not want to be considered as part of the Scouting organization? Or is the correct term "Venturing Scout"?

"The word "Venture" is no longer officially used by BSA."

Were they at one point called Venture Scouts/Venture Crews?

Venture Patrols are dying, there are very few in existence now(sadly) that I know of, though I do believe that they are still part of the BSA.

[EagleScout441]

If OA is a Boy Scout program, why would Venturing even be involved? Same for the leadership of the Cub Scout program. Do they wear the lodge flap on their DL uniform?

Please see this thread for an argument in favor of Venturers in the OA: http://www.scouter.com/forum/order-of-the-arrow/22073-oa-and-venturing

"If OA is a Boy Scout program, why would Venturing even be involved?" The fact is that both Boy Scouts and Varsity Scouts are allowed into the OA. And OA is referred to as "Scouting's Honor Society," Venturers simply feel left out.

[qwazse]

Seeing as this is a Scouter forum, I don't think we are your target audience. What is a Venture Scout?

Easy E441, dhendron paid good money for that VLST course. He has to get his money's worth!

 

Venturers (who were never were officially "venture scouts," and were once-upon-a-time Explorers more interested in outdoor stuff than career exploration) want to be respected for who they are. What that means varies widely. Some (like evidently the ones you met) want to be in OA, others want to be trusted to help serve other BSA units, others don't want boy scouts demeaning the awards they earn, others want to be treated as a different program and don't want anything "scout" associated with them.

 

We adults really do have a tough time figuring it out.

 

Venture patrols, that was easy. I think it was E92 who explained that they were what in our day was called "Leadership Corps". As soon as he did, I got it. We were the older boys in a troop who hopped in a car, found a site, did a service project, camped, cooked some insanely good food, caved, and came back and reported to the SM with a whole list of activities and program for the troop. Sometimes the SM tagged along. It's just an internal name that a troop can use to distinguish those boys. Who knows how many there are, really? But since patrols aren't supposed to overnight without an adult anymore, they are just rogue scouts. I sure do hope there are lots of them!

[qwazse]

If OA is a Boy Scout program, why would Venturing even be involved? Same for the leadership of the Cub Scout program. Do they wear the lodge flap on their DL uniform?

I think, stosh, what's happening is that more venturers are actually getting involved with their summer camps. Those that express interest see how the OA does a bang-up job of giving back to their camps, and they want to be part of that. Or they are Arrowmen who know a guy or gal and are thinking "This is great, why can't they be here too?"

[Eagle92]

Ok a little history, and EMB, please correct me where I screw up as you are the expert.

 

1972, Leadership Corps was created for older scouts in a troop. It was a leaderhsip patrol that would dome some things on their own. FYI My troop used them and I liked the concept.

 

1989, Leadership Corps are replaced with the Venture Crew within a troop. They had an ASM Venture, and a Crew Leader POR patches. Also were able to wear the 'Varsity/Venture Letter" on a jacket or MB sash and would do outdoor oriented activities to earn Venture Pins to wear on the sash like Varsity Scouts. Around 1993 or thereabouts, Varsity Scouts could earn the Venture Pins and Venture Crew members, do not know if Venture Scout was an official term or not but heard it back then, could earn the Varsity pins.

 

1998 Venturing splits from Exploring. To try and ease the confusion some, which many told the PTB the confusion will happen b/c there are too many similarities, a troop's venture crew became a venture patrol and Venturing called their units Crews. Sea Scout ships could still divide their ships into crews still.

 

Venture p-atrols still exist.

[click23]

Crud, I voted THEN read the entire OP. Doubt that you would get many venturers here to vote anyways.

[gsdad]

If OA is a Boy Scout program, why would Venturing even be involved? Same for the leadership of the Cub Scout program. Do they wear the lodge flap on their DL uniform?

I wear a Lodge flap on my uniform, and I am a Cub leader.The kids ask about it and I tell them what it represents, and it is one more thing they can look forward to when they move on to Boy Scouts. My DE was shocked to learn I actually paid my Lodge dues when I registered.

[SR540Beaver]

I would have liked it if you had made your poll a yes or no vote. Yes to include Venturing, no to keep it just Boy Scouts. I voted the option of "I don't care", but I do care. Boy Scouts and Venturing are both BSA programs, and they share many of the same goals.......but they are very different programs. That isn't to say that there are not youth in Venturing who are worthy of being recognized for their selfless service, they just aren't eligible because they aren't Boy Scouts. Venturing doesn't even have to be outdoor oriented. It always dumbfounds me that we have two divergent programs that people keep wanting to bring back together. Venturing is the un-scout program.....and I don't mean that as an offense. Let me explain. There are folks and boys out there that complained about uniforms, ranks, POR's, all that stuffy structure and the exclusion of girls. So what does BSA do? THey develop a program that is coed, uniform optional, advancement optional and a loose structure that can encompass many a program emphasis. And what happens? They want to be Boy Scouts and go to Jamborees, high adventure bases, summer camp, OA, etc. I'm not against the Venturing program, I'm really not. But why don't we just cut to the chase, sundown Venturing and all the overhead and expense of a struggling program and make Boy Scouts coed? Do that and girls can become Eagles, be elected to OA, go to Jamborees, etc. Problem solved.