Encouraging Volunteers

[JoeBob]

One thing I wish my Council would do to encourage volunteers is to not lose our paperwork. I've been trying for almost a year to be an official Merit Badge Counselor. The other thing is for the professionals to treat volunteer Scouters as customers instead of the help. Several of our professionals have been downright rude to me as a volunteer Scouter. Had I not been a true believer in scouting, I would have quit on the spot.

I'm with you about paperwork. I've submitted 4 applications over 2 years to get legit as an MBC.

My pack and troop had good folks on the committee that made it their main focus to deal with the paperwork. They didn't do a lot of front line contact with the boys, but they did an excellent job keeping the bureaucrats off the rear end of the woodsmen. If I had to deal with boys and council idiots, I'm pretty sure that I wouldn't still be here.

 

Professional's attitudes: I've seen good and bad. The ones who treat you like a valued resource get unwavering support. I just avoid the ones who treat me like help, and warn away anyone I can.

 

Mid-level staff at camp this year were 90% anal-orifices. I wonder if they are working a staff job at camp because they want to share their Scouting values, or if they view their time at camp as a last resort because they couldn't get a real job...

[NJCubScouter]

As a scout parent(not an official volunteer) and forum lurker, I wanted to comment on this topic. I’m sorry if this comes off as a rant, but this is a major irritation I have with the boy scouts. I want to emphasize that I would love to volunteer for my son’s scout troop or volunteered when he was in cub scouts. I am very involved with a number of activities which my children participate in and truly love the work I do in those programs. However, I have never volunteered with the boy scouts for one main reason: I absolutely refuse to give up my social security and driver’s license numbers for a volunteer position.

 

There are three main reasons for this stance. The first one is obviously the privacy issues and the possibility of identity theft from giving this very confidential information out. Second, I don’t believe background checks do very much; it’s simply a PR stunt that accomplishes very little. For example, Jerry Sandusky could have passed a background check well past his 60th birthday. The two-deep leadership rule(which I have always observed is followed and is my personal rule I follow when I volunteer) does far more to protect the boys involved with the BSA than any background check can every hope to accomplish. Finally, there are ways to do criminal background checks that do not require a social security number. As a scout parent, the two-deep rule is infinitely more reassuring to me than any criminal background check that a scout leader has passed.

aph5, first of all, welcome to the forums!

 

Second of all, I understand what you are saying about privacy and confidentiality, but personally I think it is worth giving up my SSN to the BSA in order for them to do a criminal background check on everybody else who volunteers. (I say everybody else, because I already know I don't have a criminal record.) If there was evidence that the BSA misuses this information, it would be a different story, but I have never seen any such evidence. (And I suspect that if such evidence was out there, someone would have posted about it in this forum, just as we have read many times over the years about inflated and fictitious membership figures, etc.)

 

The fact is that every once in awhile, the criminal background checks DO "catch" someone, sometimes because the person apparently thought the conviction had "expired" or something, and probably more often because the would-be leader looks at the application, realizes that a background check is about to happen and that they are going to be "caught", and they themselves raise the issue with unit leaders before submitting the application. We have had a few threads in this forum over the years about what happens next, whether the 25-year-old conviction for "possession" or simple assault is enough to prevent someone from being a leader, etc.

 

I also don't think there is any need to "compare" the background checks with the youth protection training/guidelines (including 2-deep leadership) in terms of which makes the kids "safer." It's not a competition. Both methods work in combination with each other. Yes, the YP program probably IS more effective, because it regulates the behavior of everybody, whereas the background check doesn't tell you about the hidden intentions of someone who has never been convicted of anything. But I think the background checks provide some additional amount of effectiveness in the overall effort to protect the Scouts.

[MattR]

One thing I wish my Council would do to encourage volunteers is to not lose our paperwork. I've been trying for almost a year to be an official Merit Badge Counselor. The other thing is for the professionals to treat volunteer Scouters as customers instead of the help. Several of our professionals have been downright rude to me as a volunteer Scouter. Had I not been a true believer in scouting, I would have quit on the spot.

MB apps are one of those things that should be done online. We fill them out, hand them in, and then ignore them because they end up in a pile on some desk at Council. They don't have enough help to wade through the paperwork so I don't blame them. All they're waiting for is for someone to type all the fields on the paper into the computer.

 

JoeBob, you should hear what some of the staff say about the scoutmasters. Plenty of analness to spread around.

[perdidochas]

One thing I wish my Council would do to encourage volunteers is to not lose our paperwork. I've been trying for almost a year to be an official Merit Badge Counselor. The other thing is for the professionals to treat volunteer Scouters as customers instead of the help. Several of our professionals have been downright rude to me as a volunteer Scouter. Had I not been a true believer in scouting, I would have quit on the spot.

MattR,

 

I agree about MB apps ideally being online. However, with the example of the systems we currently use online, I'm not certain it would be any better.

 

The staff needs to realize that the volunteers are the ones who actually do the heavy lifting and deliver the majority of the program. They need to either help us out or get out of our way.

[MattR]

One thing I wish my Council would do to encourage volunteers is to not lose our paperwork. I've been trying for almost a year to be an official Merit Badge Counselor. The other thing is for the professionals to treat volunteer Scouters as customers instead of the help. Several of our professionals have been downright rude to me as a volunteer Scouter. Had I not been a true believer in scouting, I would have quit on the spot.

perdidochas, you have a great point that the online version will be just as troublesome, but it will be less of a fire hazard. If you're going to lose the information, you can do it much more efficiently with a computer.

 

I agree about the heavy lifting part. My council does a good job with respect to that. My DE is always thanking me and the other units.

[King Ding Dong]

As a scout parent(not an official volunteer) and forum lurker, I wanted to comment on this topic. I’m sorry if this comes off as a rant, but this is a major irritation I have with the boy scouts. I want to emphasize that I would love to volunteer for my son’s scout troop or volunteered when he was in cub scouts. I am very involved with a number of activities which my children participate in and truly love the work I do in those programs. However, I have never volunteered with the boy scouts for one main reason: I absolutely refuse to give up my social security and driver’s license numbers for a volunteer position.

 

There are three main reasons for this stance. The first one is obviously the privacy issues and the possibility of identity theft from giving this very confidential information out. Second, I don’t believe background checks do very much; it’s simply a PR stunt that accomplishes very little. For example, Jerry Sandusky could have passed a background check well past his 60th birthday. The two-deep leadership rule(which I have always observed is followed and is my personal rule I follow when I volunteer) does far more to protect the boys involved with the BSA than any background check can every hope to accomplish. Finally, there are ways to do criminal background checks that do not require a social security number. As a scout parent, the two-deep rule is infinitely more reassuring to me than any criminal background check that a scout leader has passed.

NJ, I completely agree on the background checks. Having just gone through the process of renting my house it is amazing the BS you hear. They want the house but the moment you hand them an application with authorization for a credit check they get very belligerent. I had 4 military families insist that it was not needed because they were in the military. Huh? One threw a fit over providing his checking account number and address to his bank. huh? What was he planning on paying his rent with (chickens ?). I wrote him a nice letter explaining I did not understand his objection because every single check he has ever written to any person or business or charity has his account number AND routing number printed on it. The address to his bank is in the phone book. I wasn't asking for his PIN. Never heard from him again.

[perdidochas]

One thing I wish my Council would do to encourage volunteers is to not lose our paperwork. I've been trying for almost a year to be an official Merit Badge Counselor. The other thing is for the professionals to treat volunteer Scouters as customers instead of the help. Several of our professionals have been downright rude to me as a volunteer Scouter. Had I not been a true believer in scouting, I would have quit on the spot.

I think I've met the DE twice in my 3 yrs as a BSA leader. He had taken over a newly formed district (combined from two old districts), and had a deer in the headlights look. My problem is with a higher up part of the council staff. Every time I have ever met/talked with him on the phone he has been short and rude, even when I tried to engage him in small talk when he was not doing any work, just waiting for the next group to check in. I've let the council know this on several occasions with the annual surveys, so they know about the problem.

[Stosh]

I have been dealing with volunteer groups for over 40 years and they all basically function the same. They all have their 10% that do the work while 90% sit on their hands and reap the benefits. Sometimes this 10% is the Old Guard that circle the wagons rather tightly and won't let in any new blood. But on the other hand the 10% can be those dedicated few that will always step up to keep the program going. It varies from one group to the next which one applies.

 

However, I have always promoted the: "If-the-program-is-important,-here's-what-needs-to-be-done." approach. It's not all that difficult to introduce into any group. For example, the Roundtable has a flyer for the up-coming fall camporee. No problem. I would after opening flags, hold up the sheet and say, "There's the fall camporee flyer, who wants to take charge?" If no one did, I would crumple it up and toss into the trash. I never had to cajole, beg, plead, guilt, people into doing something they didn't think all that important. There were times that the boys "changed their minds" and stepped up after pulling the paper back out of the trash.

 

Too often we promote programs the people aren't all that interested in and then can't figure out why anyone doesn't want to work on putting them on. Just because we did it last year is not sufficient justification to doing it again this year.

 

Stosh

 

[qwazse]

I have been dealing with volunteer groups for over 40 years and they all basically function the same. They all have their 10% that do the work while 90% sit on their hands and reap the benefits. Sometimes this 10% is the Old Guard that circle the wagons rather tightly and won't let in any new blood. But on the other hand the 10% can be those dedicated few that will always step up to keep the program going. It varies from one group to the next which one applies.

 

However, I have always promoted the: "If-the-program-is-important,-here's-what-needs-to-be-done." approach. It's not all that difficult to introduce into any group. For example, the Roundtable has a flyer for the up-coming fall camporee. No problem. I would after opening flags, hold up the sheet and say, "There's the fall camporee flyer, who wants to take charge?" If no one did, I would crumple it up and toss into the trash. I never had to cajole, beg, plead, guilt, people into doing something they didn't think all that important. There were times that the boys "changed their minds" and stepped up after pulling the paper back out of the trash.

 

Too often we promote programs the people aren't all that interested in and then can't figure out why anyone doesn't want to work on putting them on. Just because we did it last year is not sufficient justification to doing it again this year.

 

Stosh

Stosh,

 

The "pulling out of the bin" happened at the last crew meeting. Up until this last point I had heard zero interest from the boys about the fall council camporee. Then, they reviewed their sports calendars and realized that they could make this work. I explained that the venturing portion may very well be scaled back because no crew has committed thus far, and they may have to contribute some sweat into having the fun. They were okay with that and brainstormed a few ideas. Gauntlet thrown ...

 

Now to talk to the reservation director about the possibility of flaming arrows and exploding targets ...

 

Thing is, if adults are afraid that I'm gonna cause lil' Johnny to lose a limb, the odds of volunteers to help supervise increases.

[Stosh]

I have been dealing with volunteer groups for over 40 years and they all basically function the same. They all have their 10% that do the work while 90% sit on their hands and reap the benefits. Sometimes this 10% is the Old Guard that circle the wagons rather tightly and won't let in any new blood. But on the other hand the 10% can be those dedicated few that will always step up to keep the program going. It varies from one group to the next which one applies.

 

However, I have always promoted the: "If-the-program-is-important,-here's-what-needs-to-be-done." approach. It's not all that difficult to introduce into any group. For example, the Roundtable has a flyer for the up-coming fall camporee. No problem. I would after opening flags, hold up the sheet and say, "There's the fall camporee flyer, who wants to take charge?" If no one did, I would crumple it up and toss into the trash. I never had to cajole, beg, plead, guilt, people into doing something they didn't think all that important. There were times that the boys "changed their minds" and stepped up after pulling the paper back out of the trash.

 

Too often we promote programs the people aren't all that interested in and then can't figure out why anyone doesn't want to work on putting them on. Just because we did it last year is not sufficient justification to doing it again this year.

 

Stosh

I just got back from the 150th Gettysburg Reenactment, and there there isn't any flaming arrows, but a ton of stuff exploding, cannons, aerial burst fireworks and musketry all over the place. The Venturing crew boys seemed have a good time. Duh!

 

If there isn't any controlled danger, then where's the adventure?!

[CubScoutIdeas]

I have been dealing with volunteer groups for over 40 years and they all basically function the same. They all have their 10% that do the work while 90% sit on their hands and reap the benefits. Sometimes this 10% is the Old Guard that circle the wagons rather tightly and won't let in any new blood. But on the other hand the 10% can be those dedicated few that will always step up to keep the program going. It varies from one group to the next which one applies.

 

However, I have always promoted the: "If-the-program-is-important,-here's-what-needs-to-be-done." approach. It's not all that difficult to introduce into any group. For example, the Roundtable has a flyer for the up-coming fall camporee. No problem. I would after opening flags, hold up the sheet and say, "There's the fall camporee flyer, who wants to take charge?" If no one did, I would crumple it up and toss into the trash. I never had to cajole, beg, plead, guilt, people into doing something they didn't think all that important. There were times that the boys "changed their minds" and stepped up after pulling the paper back out of the trash.

 

Too often we promote programs the people aren't all that interested in and then can't figure out why anyone doesn't want to work on putting them on. Just because we did it last year is not sufficient justification to doing it again this year.

 

Stosh

I love the crumple up idea! I'm the pack committee chair, and it can be difficult to get the parents to take charge of events.

 

I think you have a very valid point about not doing something just because we've always done it.

[Stosh]

One also must remember that the pool of volunteers is not limited to one's own awareness. When I was a pastor in a small church, the director of education came to me almost in tears. She couldn't find a Sunday school teacher for the 2nd grade. She said she had asked EVERYONE! I picked up the phone and made one call. It was a 75 year old grandma lady that didn't get out much but was in church every Sunday without fail. I asked her. She asked how many kids. I said two. She said, good, one for each knee. That was that. The kids had a great time and she volunteered to take 3rd grade the next year.